Re: marrying first cousins?
considering all the genetic diseases we have in our family 
.. I wouldnt do that .. doesnt matter if I stay single for the rest of my life -_____-
Re: marrying first cousins?
Most women are referred to genetic counselors after they have gotten pregnant. A genetic counselor will tell you the risk of your child having Down's based on the tests and your family history. If you tell them you are married to your first cousin, they WILL tell you that your risk is extremely high. There is no other way around it. Most people don't even opt for an amniocentesis after their results because of the risks involved. And if you are one to believe that it's all up to God, then it's really pointless to go to a genetic counselor. And if you do get an amnio and find out your child has Down's or another genetic abnormality, what are you going to do? Abort the pregnancy? Most people won't. Divorce your first cousin? Not have anymore children?
I don't know why our people get so offended when the first cousin marriage issue comes up. Yes we know Allah hasn't forbidden it, but that doesn't mean that if someone is against it that they are against God. The world has a population of 7 billion people and about 2 billion of them are muslims. You can find someone to marry that is not your first cousin or related to you at all.
Re: marrying first cousins?
Btw, I don't have time to look up the research right now but there are studies that have shown that LDLc (Low density lipoprotein cholestrol) levels are a heritable trait. LDLc is a primary reason for the developments of arthreloscrelosis (sp?). So yes, diet and lifestyle and ethinicity are important factors but the genetic side of these diseases cannot be ignored either.
Re: marrying first cousins?
In the elder generation of my family, they have mostly been marrying their cousins. My khala's husband was her first cousin (from mother and father). Their children are perfectly fine.
However, my relative married outside family. They are not remotely related to the guys family in any way and two of their children has a genetically recessive liver disease. So strange when you think about the odds. At the same time her sister just delivered a healthy baby girl where the father is her first cousin and the FIL is her mothers cousin.
Rest Allah (swt) knows best, but better to tie the camel if there are risk factors such as common cousin marriages for generations and genetical diseases seen in family before.
Re: marrying first cousins?
Most women are referred to genetic counselors after they have gotten pregnant. A genetic counselor will tell you the risk of your child having Down's based on the tests and your family history. If you tell them you are married to your first cousin, they WILL tell you that your risk is extremely high. There is no other way around it. Most people don't even opt for an amniocentesis after their results because of the risks involved. And if you are one to believe that it's all up to God, then it's really pointless to go to a genetic counselor. And if you do get an amnio and find out your child has Down's or another genetic abnormality, what are you going to do? Abort the pregnancy? Most people won't. Divorce your first cousin? Not have anymore children?
I don't know why our people get so offended when the first cousin marriage issue comes up. Yes we know Allah hasn't forbidden it, but that doesn't mean that if someone is against it that they are against God. The world has a population of 7 billion people and about 2 billion of them are muslims. You can find someone to marry that is not your first cousin or related to you at all.
From what I remember from school/uni Downs is associated with mothers age and the quality of her eggs. As she gets older the quality of eggs deteriorates hence the higher risk at older age. There may very well be a predisposition if there is family history.
Passo, I don't think anyone is saying if one doesn't personally want to get married to a cousin they are defying Allah (SWT) naouzbillah. I personally wouldn't either. I just think people should make informed choices.
Yes, there is a genetic component to cardiovascular disease but its extremely common in South Asians so doesn't matter if someone is your cousin or not. Since when do people inquire about diabetes and hypertension before getting married?
Re: marrying first cousins?
they WILL tell you that your risk is extremely high. There is no other way around it.
Extremely high? Care to share numbers?
Again, referring to the human genetics commission page I linked, the chance for a child to have downs if the mother is pregnant at 35 is four times that than if she was 25.
So why are we restricting our criticism for one practice while the other is becoming increasingly common in the developed world?
Re: marrying first cousins?
Third World Problems.
Re: marrying first cousins?
Stoppit - Well, we are only discussing cousin marriages in this thread. If we were discussing the risk factors for a child to be born with Down’s then we would be listing and discussing mother’s age etc. In a first trimester screening, different tests are performed. Mom’s bloodwork, baby’s nasal bone, nuchal translucency etc. All these factors are combined with the mom’s age and family history and a risk assessment is performed. If your family history indictes that you are married to your first cousin or have had previous cousin marriages it is likely that the assessment for Down’s will be in the risk category i.e. 1 in 300 or even less than that. Of course not all babies from cousin marriages are born with Down’s or any of the other genetic abnormalities. All I am saying is a genetic counselor will tell you that the risk is high.
I am obviously not an expert in the matter. I briefly considered it as a career option, so I am just telling you from what I remember seeing at the prenatal clinics.
CDG - LOL. Actually I do 
My family has a history of heart disease. I don’t want hubby and I both to drop dead in our 50s 
j/k.
And yes, you are absolutely correct that the age of the mom is one of the biggest risk factors for Down’s Syndrome.
Re: marrying first cousins?
No.
Don't have any problems with people who do do it but I'd never.
Re: marrying first cousins?
do many doctors ask whether you and your spouse are related in any other way other than marriage?
Serious question…
Re: marrying first cousins?
Okay so maybe the two cousins who get married don’t have a history of Downs in their family but two unrelated people do in the end who has higher chances of having a baby with Downs? I think what stoppit and I are trying to say is the risk is not that much higher as people make it sound to be UNLESS cousin marriages are repeated generations after generations.
lol I get what you are saying at not wanting to drop dead at 50 but seriously though how would you feel being rejected because there is history of heart disease in your family eh?
Re: marrying first cousins?
While marriage between first cousins is merely allowed in islam, there is a reason why it is so common among pakistani muslims, and maybe other sub-continent muslims.
You have the concept of arranged marriage, which is the worst part of hindu culture, where a man has to hide behind his parents to get a wife. While there is nothing islamic about arranged marriage and islam allows you to choose your own spouse. But arranged marriage remains prevalent among south asian muslims because of hindu cultural influence.
Now most marriages in Pakistan are still arranged marriages. So many pakistani parents then consider cousin marriage an easier alternative for their children because they don't have to go through the hassle of finding a suitable match elsewhere. Also with arranged marriage between cousins, parents know what kind of people they will be dealing with and whether the 2 families would be compatible because in pakistani culture the marriage is not just between the husband and wife but it is also a union of both families
I may be wrong but i don't think cousin marriages are so prevalent among non-south asian muslims like arabs, turks, africans etc??
Re: marrying first cousins?
^^ What you talkin abt bhai sahab.. You have some seriously messed up concept of arranged marriages… Arranged marriages is not forced marriages. Mine was an arranged.. and I am very very happy in my marriage. Some people bhi na… 
Re: marrying first cousins?
It irks me to no end when people think arranged marriage means the guy and girl have no say. It’s not like the parents say okay we picked this person and you have to marry them. 
Re: marrying first cousins?
Yeah.. No one hides behind anyone.. lol. I made a trip to meet my husband because he was living in a different state. He made a trip to meet me. We went out.. Had a good time. Some people seriously think arrange marriage is some sort of forced thing. My husband was asked to consider his cousin.. he said no.. and his parents moved on. All good. No one forces anything on anyone in arranged marriages now. Unless you are forced to marry someone, that’s a totally different thing and it shouldn’t be called arranged marriages. And Jews do arranged marriages too.. umm no just Hindus or our paindo Pakistanis :halo:
Re: marrying first cousins?
Completely true. And statistical analysis shows that He appears to decide more often in the case of first cousin marriages that genetic defects should occur.
It's like how He allows paan and He decides who gets cancer when.... but He does seem to decide that heavy paan chewers should get mouth and throat cancers more often than those who don't have much paan.
thumbs up. beautiful response.
Re: marrying first cousins?
Okay so maybe the two cousins who get married don't have a history of Downs in their family but two unrelated people do in the end who has higher chances of having a baby with Downs? I think what stoppit and I are trying to say is the risk is not that much higher as people make it sound to be UNLESS cousin marriages are repeated generations after generations.
lol I get what you are saying at not wanting to drop dead at 50 but seriously though how would you feel being rejected because there is history of heart disease in your family eh?
lets just agree to disagree on the first point :p
And the second point...thats obviously not what I meant. My previous comment was in the context of cousin marriages.
Re: marrying first cousins?
If two people want to get married, I think its absolutely fine. For me it doesnt make a diff if they are first cousins.
In which sense do you mean right or wrong?.. Genetically, you have to understand that if your family has been marrying within family for years, then it is basically your common genes going around. Now if a (most probably recessive) mutation take place somewhere, lets say in Mr. Faisal has a mutation (these can occur from generation to generation). Mr Faisals children will then inherent this mutation from him. Lets say that Mr. Faisals grandchildren marry each other. Then there is 25 % of their children will be sick. Even though Mr. Faisal is not sick and nor are his own children.
So genetically I would say the chances for cousin-couples to have a disabled child is slighty higher than an average non related couple due to the common genes. I think its important to acknowledge this fact, but at the same time there is no need to look down upon cousin marriages.
Lets not forget that these mutations and diseases exist everywhere in world, even in the West, where they dont marry their cousins. An example is Cystic Fibrosis.
- Islam says its fine.
this. Islam allows for it because there's the possibility of sexual attraction. The probability of marrying someone that has an allele for a genetic abnormality might be a SMIDGE lower but it's not 100% guaranteed that your kids going to be normal if you marry someone outside the family. The problem is when you have entire generations upon generations marrying into the family--inbreeding. The recessive alleles begin showing up more and more.
Dad's family has a couple of cousin marriages and they're fine. A khala of mine, her inlaws ONLY marry in cousins and the first 1-2 generations are fine, after that there are abnormalities with EVERY child of some sort.
I'd be open to it only because my parents and family aren't related but if I married a cousin then no, I wouldn't want my children to do so.
Re: marrying first cousins?
Islamically it's acceptable to marry your cousin and in terms of genetics what Stoppit said is right, the risk is higher for rare genetic diseases if marrying within the family has been going on for generations and generations.
Each to their own, there's no right or wrong answer. There's nothing wrong with marrying your first cousin, unless you know you come from a family with a high risk of genetic abnormalities...then I wouldn't really advise marrying into the same family.
Personally, I wouldn't do it for 2 reasons
1) It doesn't really happen in my family so it's not something I'm used to seeing and
2) all my male cousins are either younger than me or complete morons :D
Re: marrying first cousins?
Much has been said here about cousin marriages being fine as long as it doesn't occur in consecutive generations. But I can't imagine anyone keeps track of mating patterns like that. Why even go there? Isn't it a universally appealing idea to diversify your gene pool if you can help it? A better question would be why some families only marry relatives.
The fact that your religion allows it doesn't mean it advocates it. There is no encouragement of consanguineous marriage in the Islamic context. In fact, it can be argued that it's quite the opposite - marrying non-relatives is in the interest of forging the ummah far and wide. Even better, find a lost kafir to convert. Quit ogling your cousins, peepul.