A close family member just got back from visiting Pakistan for a few weeks, and yesterday we ended up having a long discussion about their spiritiuality. They were complaining (and I had noticed anyway) how they hadn’t prayed a single taraweeh prayer whilst in Pak and also now having come back. This is a woman who used to push me in my ibaadah and worship. Yesterday I had to really push her not to end some of the classes she holds (Arabic, tajweed, Islamic study circles) at home. Her argument was that she felt she didn’t give enough time to the kids, and I told her to just cut down on the number of hours and not over burden herself but not to completely stop as it brings a huge amount of barakah and peace to the home. She just didn’t have that determination and passion that she held before.
I mentioned whether the Pakistani environment may have affected her heart in terms of spirituality, and she was like yeh probably, after spending every single day gossiping and backbiting… She was saying how there isn’t a supportive environment to spend time in worship - it’s a rather strange thing to do really
Now afetr that conversation I feel really sad for the state Pakistan is in.. Has anyone had any similar experience? This lady felt that practicing Islam there was looked down upon as old fashioned, and it’s just simply not the thing to do - I mean in terms of worship, prayers, zikr, Islamic study circles etc It’s quite sad really..
I know there are lost cases who look down at praying etc, but thank God i dont know such people.
And in Pakistan i never experienced such a thing, matlab people being unsupportive to spend time in worship.
Early muslims in Makkah were ridiculed, outlawed, oppressed, tortured, persecuted, and even killed for practising their deen but that only made their faith even stronger! When the difficulties increased beyond their tolerance level, they simply emigrated from Makkah and practised their deen in peace in the refuge of a Christian king and later in Madinah.
So tell your friend, Allah ain't buying this excuse of hers. If someone in Pakistan stopped her from practising her faith or ridiculed her for praying namaaz then yes I would somewhat understand why she is put off. I doubt she went through any of this bizarre oppression, she's just being lazy and finding excuses to justify it.
I don't think it's the country but it might be the heavy influence of her rishtaydars surrounding her doing chughliyan all the time and as a result she started feeling spiritually sick*.*
Erm, I don't know anybody in my crowd in Pakistan who would look down on that. Everyone prays or at least tries to pray regularly.
Wrong crowd for sure.....and if her spirituality was so strong, the environment wouldn't make too much difference. Why blame the country...
I wish that were true!!! But it really isn't - the environment always affects your spiritual state no matter how strong you are, though I guess stronger people have greater resistance to it..
The type of people she was with aren't what you would call the wrong crowd. It was just different families (who are known as good, respectable people) in those three cities.
I think I've portrayed it badly - they didn't outright ridicule her or anything like that. Nor did they blatently discourage praying or anything. Its a much more subtle thing - a subtle attitude difference towards worship and spirituality. Like it's an old fashioned thing - not in line with this craze to be Westernised..
^ Hareem, I think you're probably right. I don't wish to blame the entire country for it, so yeh it was probably the behaviour of family relatives affecting her. I was just wondering whether it's a widespread thing, which other people have experienced..?
Early muslims in Makkah were ridiculed, outlawed, oppressed, tortured, persecuted, and even killed for practising their deen but that only made their faith even stronger! When the difficulties increased beyond their tolerance level, they simply emigrated from Makkah and practised their deen in peace in the refuge of a Christian king and later in Madinah.
So tell your friend, Allah ain't buying this excuse of hers. If someone in Pakistan stopped her from practising her faith or ridiculed her for praying namaaz then yes I would somewhat understand why she is put off. I doubt she went through any of this bizarre oppression, she's just being lazy and finding excuses to justify it.
BarbieQue, you come across as quite harsh and offensive to be honest! :( The poor lady is not being lazy for sure! Of course she didn't go through any of what the early Muslims went through - what I'm talking about is nothing like that comparison. I'm talking about being in an environment, where perhaps doing extra worship or being closer to Allah isn't something that people strive for - which then subtly and very slightly drains your spirituality.
Khayr, maybe I've got the whole thing wrong. It was just a reflection / observation.
With a sudden and dramatic change of behaviour, that lady hardly comes across as 'spiritualistic', more like she was just a ritualistic and rituals got easily disturbed with a mere change of company. Big deal.
BarbieQue, you come across as quite harsh and offensive to be honest! :( The poor lady is not being lazy for sure! Of course she didn't go through any of what the early Muslims went through - what I'm talking about is nothing like that comparison. I'm talking about being in an environment, where perhaps doing extra worship or being closer to Allah isn't something that people strive for - which then subtly and very slightly drains your spirituality.
Khayr, maybe I've got the whole thing wrong. It was just a reflection / observation.
Offensive because I called her lazy and harsh because I didn't entertain the excuses? Sorry but this is the exact same thing I would've said to my sister because that's just the way it is, I'm not going to beat around the bush when it comes to something as hugely important as namaaz.
I've heard of some hijabi women taking their hijab off after a while because of the mostly negative attitude of the society towards hijab especially in the west. That I can totally understand because it is about one's appearance, self-confidence, fear of constantly being judged, drawing unnecessary attention which makes them feel extremely uncomfortable etc. I wouldn't dare question those girls in the way that I'm questioning your friend about missing farz namaaz on purpose just because some ignorant people think it is too old-fashioned/conservative.
Why does she care what anyone else thinks of this very personal act of worship between her and Allah? You answered this question in one of your previous posts when you spoke of the "craze to be westernized". All I'm saying is letting other people's attitude towards religion govern your life does not make any sense to me.
I wish that were true!!! But it really isn't - the environment always affects your spiritual state no matter how strong you are, though I guess stronger people have greater resistance to it..
The type of people she was with aren't what you would call the wrong crowd. It was just different families (who are known as good, respectable people) in those three cities.
I think I've portrayed it badly - they didn't outright ridicule her or anything like that. Nor did they blatently discourage praying or anything. Its a much more subtle thing - a subtle attitude difference towards worship and spirituality. Like it's an old fashioned thing - not in line with this craze to be Westernised..
^ Hareem, I think you're probably right. I don't wish to blame the entire country for it, so yeh it was probably the behaviour of family relatives affecting her. I was just wondering whether it's a widespread thing, which other people have experienced..?
That's even worse then, they weren't even openly ridiculing her or mocking her or discouraging her....but a subtle attitude..they probably made a joke or two that wasn't mean spirited, a nod or a whisper...that made her lose her spirituality?
Im sure they were good people but that sounds like weakness on her part.
Spirituality and faith is a personal thing, I wouldn't fault anyone for having it waver in their lifetime...but then they shouldn't blame others for it.
Just to clarify: she's stopped praying taraweeh prayers - which are sunnah.. not fardh prayers..
By loss of spirituality I don;t mean a loss of iman! Doesn't everyone have ups and downs when it comes to spirituality? I don't mean you stop practicing altogether, or you leave your fardh prayers or anything drastic. I'm talking about a loss of the level of closeness that you felt with God previously.. Which you then push yourself to get to again. I'm suprised if you don't relate to what I'm talking about, everyone I've ever talked to mentions these sorts of ups and downs
It's not half as dramatic as it seems to be perceived here.. Jolie, it's not a sudden and dramatic change and NomiCA It's not a horrific experience. She really enjoyed her time there - we were just discussing how the time there seems to have changed her a little
Perhaps it was indeed weakness of her part.. But I'm not inclined to think it would be due to that totally. I think the experience and the environment she was in affected her heart - hardened it in a way. So she just doesn't feel like pushing herself that extra bit further like she used to We're not talking about fardh here! She still prays five times a day!
Hmm Sara I doubt it would have been a one off thing like a joke or a whisper. It's the whole mentality towards it.. like imagine no one else around you is pushing themsleves to pray taraweeh or recite from the Quran.. and at first you really want to cuz you know it's Ramadan and you've always pushed yourslef in this month... but after spending weeks constantly with such people you lose that passion.. no one else does it so you feel kinda odd.. or how everyone around you gossips and backbites and revels in other people's misfortunes, so that eventually you're sucked into it.. - THAT's what I'm talking about.
I was just wondering if anyone else had experiences something similar, but seemingly not. The only reason I mentioned Pakistan was cuz I presumed such attitudes are more prevalent there but I may well be wrong. Oh well. I hope someone reading this understands what I was trying to say!
Well actually Princess, you have heard that saying that you are or you become the company that you keep. So your friend probably experienced a different setting than what she is used to here. For example, over here, after maghrib, we usually wrap up the kitchen, get changed and head out to the masjid for taraveeh prayers wih our kids, especially this time, as kids are on summer vacations so they don't have to be in bed early. In Pakistan, women don't usually go to the masjid, and post iftaar is usually chillin' time for women where they catch up on their daily chitchat. In most households, maids usually do the housework so ladies sit around and stretch. It's a different culture. SO the loss of spirituality she felt was perhaps just the difference in the way things are done there. Here, the women are more involved in masjids, we make a greater effort to invlove our kids in little little activities and so you feel like you're doing more. So if your friend wanted to go for taraveeh but none of the other women were going, then obviously, it would be hard for her to be the only woman accompanying the men, right? It's just the way thing are here and there.