Live Updates of Azadi March

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
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Re: Live Updates of Azadi March

Murtaza is quiet today so that means IK and TUQ drama is nearing its end.

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A collective Ice bucket challenge outside parliament house

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Murtaza Ali Shah ‏@MurtazaGeoNews](https://twitter.com/MurtazaGeoNews)2mins
I am coming upstairs mom. Whats for dinner tonight? I feel like some Qeemay walay naan.

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Follow

[https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1585967952/hamid_mir1_bigger.jpg

Hamid Mir‏[COLOR=#B1BBC3]@HamidMirGEO](https://twitter.com/HamidMirGEO)

Political crises will be over in Islamabad before September 6th

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  • Faisal Sherjan ‏@fsherjan](https://twitter.com/fsherjan) 32 mins
    Democracy is alive and well in Pakistan but Geo Network remains off air on cable systems 90 days after SC ordered its restoration
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Because Sept 5th is Defence Day of Pakistan. #MartialLaw](http://www.paklinks.com/gs/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=MartialLaw)

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Inside parliament only blockheads, being shameless..

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Not true. GEO is on cable in all parts of RWP/ISB.

If its off air in some air thats due to the discretion of the local cable operators of that area.

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Not in DHA, don't know about the rest.

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But the real dirt is inside that building

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As an MNA didn't IK take an oath to defend the constitution of Pakistan.

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Defend what part of constitution??

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Any part of the constitution.

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There is a fundamental ideological difference here, or dispute rather. I believe a quick and widespread free and fair investigation sans Nawaz Sharif's influence will strengthen democracy, and restore people's trust in the system. True, it may put Nawaz Family in the hot waters, but they are not a synonym for the system in my books! Democracy is bigger than governments. Pick up a history of any democratically elected government in Pakistan and you'll see that their short lives were contaminated with rigging allegations that ultimately brought them down. Clearly, this proves that rigging is the single biggest threat to Pakistani democracy and it must not taken lightly at any cost. Enough is enough. This reminds me, considering Nawaz Sharif's government was toppled 1993 because the same very reason, I'm baffled at his perpetual buffoonery to once again to do everything possible to resist acknowledging the curse of rigging and propose an action plan to save the credibility and the ultimate future of his government, and democracy.

If sitting governments stop blocking free and fair anti-rigging investigations, chances are they would never find themselves under such threat. For sake of some balance, it is imperative that people instead of asking opposition to withdraw their riggings demands - ridiculing them, chastising them and outright rejecting their concerns under all kinds of pretexts - must ask the sitting governments to clear their name to save and serve democracy that claim to represent. Where is the harm in that? The rule is simple: if you have done nothing wrong, you should have nothing to hide.

When the sitting governments employs every little dirty trick in the book to avoid free and fair anti-rigging investigation, you cannot expect people to have unbound faith in the system or better, in that government that claims to run that system. People will be bound to question it, challenge it and ask for better version of that same system. If you really want a better system, you must take absolutely zero tolerance to rigging. No matter what, the public must ask and pressure the government to come clean on this. It makes absolutely no sense to tell people that for sake of 'protecting the system', they should trivialise and tolerate every crime and abuse committed against that system.

I am going to highlight another basic ideological difference here between you and I. Just because organised corruption was conducted in the 90s, I see absolutely no reason they should not be punished now! That money belongs to Pakistan. It must be brought back, if it is already in the country invested in terms of private industries, it must be re-claimed.

By no means widespread investigation into rigging should be seen as threat against democracy, yes indeed it's a threat against any government that comes through rigging. We may have a fragile system, but we are handicapped and we must continuously brainwash ourselves into thinking that we prohibited to take any thorough measures to sort our problems that could easily be dealt with. While slow and steady change must be appreciated, but if there are opportunities for you to do more and you can do more, by all means, avail those opportunities.

I don't support martial law under any circumstances.

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MOD bhai log, its unrelated to the thread…but couldn’t help it. :wub:

Khoda pahar nikla chuha… No wonder a few of my friends get so impressed because its just a LONG reply…and discussing only 1 point neglecting everything else I asked of you.

It is large amount. Obviously not as large as what Thug Nawaz loots and plunders Pakistan every month when he is in power. For instance, It is estimated that in 6 years as Prime Minister, Nawaz may have looted several billion dollars … or several 1000 million dollars. If one assumes that he looted only 4 billion dollars in 6 years or 72 months in power, that comes to looting and plundering Pakistan 55.5 million dollars every month … or Nawaz loot Pakistan ‘two and half times’ what Musharraf has in total, even though Musharraf ruled Pakistan for over 100 months, much more than Nawaz, and with absolute power.

*So even though you bluntly confirm that he must have looted money in his accounts, he is still not even close to Nawaz and his plundering. Why would u give me this comparison? I mean have I tried in any way what so ever to protect Nawaz in our discussion? Not at all. Grind him all u want. But that does not make your point any more valid and makes Mushi a better person at all. Lets not detract from his own lootings.

I won’t quote like you, an article of Liar Ansar Abbasi, but reliable sources. Though there are many, I would quote one Pakistani and one British.

*Ok fair enough. U have a beef with Ansar Abbasi or who ever it is… no problemo buddy. I’ll try to insert something of ur liking as well…

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/sep/09/pakistan-pervez-musharraf-exile-london

An excerpt from Gaurdian:

Perhaps recognising that a prolonged stay in London could be problematic, government officials do not want Musharraf to remain for long. A senior official said he was on a visitor’s visa and predicted he would take up permanent residence in the Middle East or in the US, where his son Bilal lives.
For now, though, Musharraf is polishing his public speaking: he starts a 40-day lecture tour of the US next Tuesday. He has said the talks will focus on his expertise about Islamic militancy, but also seek to redress Pakistan’s poor international image. “Pakistan is a most misunderstood country,” he said. “I enjoy the opportunity to clear up misperceptions.”
In particular, he is expected to be critical of Washington’s close relationship with India – reflecting a view widely held in Pakistani military circles. Some journalists have already dubbed Musharraf the “army ambassador” to London.
The 16 lectures are organised by the Harry Walker Agency, whose other speakers include Musharraf’s erstwhile partner in the “war on terror”, former US vice-president Dick Cheney. Among the organisations he will address is the Young Presidents’ Organisation, a forum for putative American leaders.

So we see here that his actual lectures started after SEPTEMBER 2009. Am I correct?

Now here’s another for ur liking

Revealed: Musharraf’s luxury retirement pad - Asia - World - The Independent

An excerpt from the Independent:

Revealed: Musharraf’s luxury retirement pad (MONDAY 18 August 2008!)

This luxurious home in the quiet suburbs of Islamabad, less than six weeks from completion, has been built by Pervez Musharraf as a retirement home for himself and his wife. What he had probably not expected when he commissioned the house four years ago was that he might need it as a bolt-hole should his opponents force him from office.
Amid mounting speculation as to whether Mr Musharraf will resign or fight impeachment charges, there has been much talk as to where the President will live. The most likely destinations floated to date include the US, Turkey, Saudi Arabia and even Britain. But yesterday it was reported that Mr Musharraf was insisting that should he stand down, he wishes to retire to his Mediterranean-style home set in five acres of land.
If he decides to stay, it will be no surprise to Hammad Husain, the architect commissioned by Mr Musharraf. Yesterday, standing on the driveway of the house in Chak Shahzad, Mr Husain outlined the details of the home that will include a fish-pond, a walking track and an extraordinary amount of barbed wire.
“Most of what you see is his input, along with mine,” said Mr Husain, as a team of labourers slaved beneath the blistering sun. “He has gone into the detail, he has been part of it and comes here to look at things.” Mr Husain, a family friend of the Musharrafs, said the President’s wife, Sehba, had chosen the curtains and fittings for the house, estimated at £1.25m.

Now this is also to ur liking i suppose

**http://www.standard.co.uk/news/pervez-musharrafs-london-pad-surrounded-by-kebab-joints-6725702.html
**
An excerpt from the Standard.

It is a contrast to the pomp of Musharraf’s nine-year rule in Pakistan, during which he was guarded by liveried soldiers and surrounded by political acolytes.
But security remains tight at his £1 million London flat.
The retired general is guarded by a small team of retired Pakistani commandos, which he pays for himself, and has a protection detail from Scotland Yard.

So this all even before he delivered a single lecture. Kamal hai jee!

How about this one?

**http://www.chowrangi.pk/bilal-musharraf-making-deals-while-papa-musharraf-is-on-the-throne.html
**
Found by Teeth Maestro, Bilal Musharraf, son of Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf, can be seen meeting with Saudi Prince Al-Walid bin Talal. Now, this would be another typical business meeting between Vice President of ePlanet Ventures (a Silicon Valley Venture Capital Firm) and the Prince. However, presence of Shahid Karimullah, Pakistani ambassador to Saudi Arabia, shadows this as an act of nepotism. Papa Musharraf helping Billy to secure a deal.

Quoting dawn as well for ur pleasure…

**http://www.dawn.com/news/965454/the-happening-place
**
By the by, could he please explain even at this late date especially now that he is, as we say in the vernacular, ‘weighing his wings’ before jumping into Pakistani politics (!), why Adm Shahid Karimullah, the ambassador of Pakistan to Saudi Arabia at the time, was present, hands respectfully folded in his lap, as Bilal Musharraf and his boss, one Asad Jamal, chairman and CEO of ePlanet Ventures, Global Venture Capital, were meeting Prince Alwaleed bin Talal?
**

The Global Intelligence Files - [Analytical & Intelligence Comments] A news report

**Mr. Bilal Musharraf completed his B.S. in Actuarial Science from
University of Illinois at Urbana Champaign in 1994. After graduation, he worked five years as an actuarial analyst for AIB in Boston, pricing and
reserving automobile insurance (1994-1999).

I wonder how Bilal got from pricing automobiles to… hifi multi million deals with the Sheikhs…all in 1999. jaisa baap waisa beta.

And I havent even mentioned the Millions and Millions in aid to 2005 Earth Quake disater…

**http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_response_to_the_2005_Kashmir_earthquake

**
Where is all this

So… keeping it short my dear… Whatever you have mentioned up there is after 2009…

Anyways… Still Defending your Demi God Mushi?
Care to answer the others…I dont mind the length. But should be to the point. Unlike the one u quoted me.

Have a nice day!

**
**

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The police of the Punjab the? or the police of the Islamabad the … or bheRiye (wolf) in disguise of police?

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Musharraf was awesome...he's the reason our family moved back to Pakistan from abroad. And now Imran Khan is trying to do the same on a bigger scale. Too bad patwaris and fake liberals don't get it. The fact you have fake mullahs and fake liberals on one team pretty much says it all.

Imran Khan is the real deal. Most of the middle and lower classes back him.

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Did Nawaz Sharif really tell Nawaz Sharif to mention Geo when he was talking about media?

Really. What credibility does that channel have now. Do you need any more proofs to show how this is Nawaz League's main PTV. Apart from die hard Nawaz Sharif fans and zealots, no one believes that channel or even quotes it.

Yeah, yeah throw a fit about ARY. Your channel is just as bad.

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I never said that Musharraf did corruption or money in his account are from looting … so do not say that I admitted that he did corruption.

I could not understand what is big deal about 2009? Obviously, Musharraf left Pakistan in 2009, so lectures would start after that. As for book’s revenue is concerned, that must be coming to him before 2009 and according to the Newsweek magazine, Musharraf must have earned millions of dollars from his book alone.

Report of Ansar Abbasi Kazzab the Liar is from late 2010, that means, if Liar has given correct figures than also it makes no difference, because by then Musharraf must have earned many millions of dollars from lectures alone.

As for corruption, I believe you did not read Newsweek article I posted (published after Musharraf resigned). In the article Newsweek claims that Musharraf was not corrupt and had no money from corruption. … so mark what I am saying … ‘NO CORRUPTION’ … and how sad it is that when one of the world most recognized and respected magazine believes that Musharraf was honest, some Pakistanis accuse Musharraf just to satisfy themselves or their political affiliation … Newsweek claim for me that Musharraf was not corrupt, is a big claim when one sees what western magazines claim about third world leaders, be they stooge of west or rebel of west, as almost all are reported to be corrupt.

With respect to Musharraf, world known magazine (Newsweek) is reporting that Musharraf was not corrupt and Pakistanis who are mostly corrupt and lie regularly, would like to label him corrupt just because they would like to see him as dirty as them. Is it not shameful? … Well, for me the saying in the (Newsweek) article that Musharraf was not corrupt is something to be proud, knowing that a mega corrupt country like Pakistan can produce someone who held highest post and was still not corrupt (rarity if we look at the tarnished history of corruption by most Pakistani past and present rulers … democrats or dictators).

I am putting down the article of Newsweek here again, as probably it is first time I have read in one of the most esteemed western magazine (3 most western esteemed magazines are Economist, Newsweek, and then Times) about a third world ruler (democrat, demon-crat, king or dictator) who is recognized and acclaimed that he was not corrupt. Read the (Newsweek Magazine) article again … think, and be proud that at least Pakistan produced someone who ruled Pakistan still has no stain of corruption attached to him (a rarity for a Pakistani ruler) :slight_smile:

http://www.newsweek.com/pakistans-musharraf-lucrative-speaking-fees-88033

Pakistan’s Musharraf: Lucrative Speaking Fees?
By Newsweek Staff](http://www.newsweek.com/authors/newsweek-staff)
Filed: 8/23/08 at 1:00 AM* | Updated: 3/14/10 at 2:10 AM*

Filed Under: World
Former Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf, who resigned from office this past Monday, rather than face a divisive impeachment trial in parliament, may be out of power. But he is not out of the money. When the 65-year-old former army chief finally leaves his British colonial-style residence inside Rawalpindi’s military garrison for an expected pilgrimage to Mecca in the next few days, he may continue traveling on a lucrative speaking tour through the Middle East, Europe and the U.S. Chicago-based Embark LLC is just one of the international public-relations firms trying to land Musharraf as a highly paid keynote speaker. Public-relations executives say the articulate and brash 44-year army veteran’s earning power could approach that of former U.S. President Bill Clinton, who famously snubbed him during a lightning visit to Islamabad eight years ago.

“The [speaking] fee for Musharraf would be in the $150,000-200,000 range for a day,” says Embark President David B. Wheeler, “plus jet and other V.I.P. arrangements on the ground.” Wheeler says Clinton, for whom Embark has arranged speaking engagements in the Middle East, commands up to $250,000 per appearance. “If we did multiple events in multiple cities, [Musharraf] could get closer to the $500,000 to $1,000,000 range [for a series of talks],” he said. Embark, which promises “unique experiences that educate, entertain and enlighten,” has also booked speeches for former U.S. President George H.W. Bush and former U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell.

Pakistanis who know Musharraf well say this is good news for the former president,** who is not believed to have salted away a fortune as some of his predecessors have done** (Musharraf will only receive a modest army retirement pension). But he is a long way from the poor house. Workers are putting the finishing touches on a mansion, said to be worth some $2 million dollars, that he is building on five acres of prime land just outside Islamabad. Since his resignation he has been playing golf and tennis with friends, surrounded by heavy security, and is also planning to write a sequel to his successful 2006 autobiography, “In the Line of Fire,” which could easily net him another seven-figure windfall.

**Now let me explain you what the above article says:
**

**Tells clearly that Musharraf did not do any corruption (slated away a fortune) as what his predecessors (BB and NS) have done. …**and what is mentioned is not by a Pakistani newspapers that have no shame to defame honest person and lie as habit, but it is from American internationally recognized one of the world most respected magazine … ‘Newsweek’.

So .. now with no corruption money, what he can earn … here are the details:

It means, Musharraf earning of $150000 to $200000 a day (per lecture of few hours) **when he gives lecture **(remember, there are 365 days in a year). If that lecture is done on multiple events basis in multiple cities (or lecture is shown at various placecs same time) than Musharraf could earn $500,000 to $1 million a day (per lecture of few hours).

Apart of earning from lectures, what article says about Musahrraf book ‘The line of fire’?

**
It means Musharraf could easily net seven figure windfall from book … or figures in millions of dollars (7-figure windfall means … millions of dollars).**

Now for someone who could earn several hundred thousand dollars per lecture (few hours lecture in a day), why you think that if he has 23 million dollars … or even 230 million dollars (I am just multiplying what Ansar Abbasi claims, by 10) than it must be from corruption?

Obviously Musharraf do not need corruption to earn money. **His talent and speaking prowess is well respected across the world, especially in western and Arab countries, and he is in such demand that for him, earning huge amounts in no time is not a big deal.

Look at the video and think … what west recognise BeNazir, Zardari and Nawaz … as these type of leaders is our fate … Kings and Queens of Corrupts and characterless idiots.

**

That is why I am with Imran and TUQ … hoping that InshaAlalh they would succeed and would change Pakistan and give Pakistan an honest leadership. In above video, all 3 giant Thugs of corruption are mentioned … BB, Z and NS (NS at the end) … and that also at an occasion when people commemorate dead … still, how sad it is to see the way BB on her death was remembered in west … and worse thing is that some consider her as their’s heroine (Rani), without shame.

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[QUOTE]
I recognize the frustration you must feel when you see established politicians and their relatives constantly being elected. But please realize that every time someone decided to wrap up the system in the name of estesaab, these attempts failed. However, with a robust media and independent judiciary,
[/QUOTE]

Independent media? The media is polarised beyond belief. It is almost as bad as having media with severe restrictions. Journalism as an honest profession with all kinds of checks and balances and integrity is real a casualty of this oligarchic regime of Sharifs. Go on twitter and these self proclaimed journalists are acting like angry teenagers throwing tantrums. Cooking up conspiracy theories. Making lame jokes, passing provocative veiled insults and indulging in character assassination. In Western countries, journalists use twitter to break news. In Pakistan, these journalists use their gifted smartphones to fuel tensions, spread rumours and misinformation, cause fights, rile up the crowd, do open political campaigning for parties, launch smear campaign against politicians. This is ridiculous! I don't think Pakistanis actually realise that how badly the standards of their media is actually going down in the country, and how dangerous it actually is. Instead of condemning these wannabee Kingmakers and fortune teller journalists' irrepressible behaviour all around, they promote it. Such gross political polarisation, from grass root level to top end is not a good thing. It never is. Not at all.

Free and fair judiciary, the only reason why this political volcano erupted in this way is because of the supreme court. The same same supreme court the says we don't have time to investigate these riggings cases. The same government that says authorising anti-rigging is not under our control, go talk to the Supreme Court. But takes an embarrassing U turn and says that talk to us and we will open ten constituencies for you and set up a supreme court commission? I guess the proves that point, in order to get your democratic demand accepted, you need to step away from the system and use street power to get heard. Are we going to declare such way of making anti rigging pleas heard the only effective way of getting the problem resolved in every democratic cycle? But going back to my real point, is the Supreme court supposed to work according to the orders of politicians or law books or in the interest of the system? I thought it was an independent state institution? But clearly it's not the judiciary or tribunals that open up consistencies, it's the government that decides how many constituencies it opens, when and how.

Therefore, this calls for a conclusion that it is the government that's corruption and hindering the system by first indulging in, and the preserving the rigging. Moreover, how many corruption cases this supposedly free and independent supreme has resolved - under this regime to be specific? What steps they have taken to keep the tabs on the government? Transparency international had named at least dozen of illegally and unauthorised, corruption and nepotism ridden appointments made in higher and state institutions made by the Nawaz Sharif over the last year. What did the Supreme Court do about it? After all, in any democratic society, the supreme court is the ultimate third umpire, what role did the Pakistani supreme court played in resolving this crisis? They are still dead silent, and waiting for winks and coughs from Nawaz Sharif to launch investigation.

I understand and appreciate the ideas of free media and the independent judiciary in any society, we must strive to have that in Pakistan. But let's not pretend what we have in the country is an ideal or even half decent representation of those concepts. Let's not start glossifying things for sake of it. Let's not develop an ostrich syndrome where suddenly everything in the country appears picture perfect, and anyone who challenges it is a ghadar.