What should be the strategy of liberating the Muslim world from the invasion. (Afghanistan, Arabian Peninsula, Iraq, Chechnya, Kashmir, Palestine, Southern Phillipines …) Where & when is the invasion going to stop - cultural, political, economic etc.
what makes those countries/regions the muslim world? as a muslim who is against western cultural, political and economical systems why are you living in the west?
- First of all make sure that the country NEVER had any chemical weapons, biological, nuclear weapons.
- If they EVER had, immediately invite US to seize them or destroy them.
- Then, if that country has any natural resources, especially oil, hand it over immediately to US.
- Then if ruler/constitution has any line saying "Islamic system" delete it.
- If there is any political party whose name comes 1 mile close to "Islamic" ban it.
- Immediately develop diplomatic relationship with Israel, sign ALL kinds of treaties with them.
- If anyone ever makes a call for "jihad" send him to guantanamo.
Following these steps (may be I missed some more), I am sure no Islamic country will be attacked.
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*Originally posted by Stu: *
what makes those countries/regions the muslim world? as a muslim who is against western cultural, political and economical systems why are you living in the west?
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By the Muslim world, it is very easily understood that areas having a predominantly Muslim population or a Muslim majority!
When did I say I am against all Western thinking? When did I say everything Western is wrong? Certainly not! The regimes imposed on the Muslims are aided and helped by the West. Why? Why these dual standards?
Supporting Jordan on one hand that has no democracy and monarchy by the West is ok, because they obey your command. Recognizing and helping, even praising the Kuwaiti regime is just because they gave you 2/3 rd of their country to fulfil you imperialistic dreams. The list goes on.....
Look into trade. (the economic system), poor countries under billions of dollars of debt. Why? They had corrupt rulers. SO where did they go? To West! right! Why did the West not help the poor countries in getting their money back. If you act as guardians of democracy and morals why are such governments supported.
Surely there are many positive things in the West!
Of the 54 or so Muslim majority countries, how many are regimes imposed on the Muslims by the west? It appears by the excuses, accusations and rationalizations that are made it is a majority of them?
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*Originally posted by Seminole: *
Of the 54 or so Muslim majority countries, how many are regimes imposed on the Muslims by the west? It appears by the excuses, accusations and rationalizations that are made it is a majority of them?
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A very excellent question, Seminole. In another thread I've posted the facts surrounding the historical birth of the present forms of government in Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Jordan, and Kuwait. And guess what? The US played little role if any in establishing either the form of government or the leadership groups.
The fact is that the US took the governments as they found them and supported them or didn't support them based upon how we viewed our own national interests and how the Arab governments perceived their national interests.
If the US was solely to blame for the repressive, dictatorial regimes in the Arab world because we supported them, would it not make sense that those Arab governments that we did NOT support would be living, breathing bastions of harmony and democracy? If the only thing holding the Arab masses back from overthrowing their brutal regimes is US support, why did we have Iraq and why do we have Syria?
seminole and myvoice.....as altrustic as US is...why doesn't it liberate people from other countries too...
Who said anything about altruism?
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*Originally posted by lussi: *
seminole and myvoice.....as altrustic as US is...why doesn't it liberate people from other countries too...
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As a general rule, the US doesn't run around the world liberating anyone. We didn't go to Afghanistan with the primary objective to liberate them and we didn't go into Iraq with the primary objective to liberate them either. It's nice and gratifying that accomplishing our primary objective was also compatible with liberating oppressed people. Sometimes we act to save people from genocide too: Kosovo and Bosnia come to mind. (I don't think there is much oil there to exploit is there?)
If you and the rest of the world would want us to liberate all the oppressed people in the world, the first thing you should do is say "please." I'm not sure I'd go along with this though as the cost in American blood might be too high for me to support. Besides, we've still got to liberate the people of California and a few other places in our own country.
All that Americans have ever demanded is that others leave us and our friends and allies alone. Do that and, as a general rule, you'll have no trouble from us. Indeed, I think that most objective and independent observers would probably find more occasions to criticize America for being too slow to act or in not acting at all than in acting too quickly.
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*Originally posted by Stu: *
what makes those countries/regions the muslim world? as a muslim who is against western cultural, political and economical systems why are you living in the west?
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People are not against, the western, cultural, political and economical systems. They are against America's expansionist, imperialist, and arrongant mindset.
It started when Western colonial powers had gained strength at world level. It was also the time when mechanization started and the might of steam engine had totally dominated minds of these powers. Industrial movement, French revolution, freedom of USA coupled with its economic attainments and the wide spread invincibility notion attached to Western powers, were the important events of that time. In short, the whole world and particularly the Islamic world (a world power before and after renaissance) came under total spell of European powers during the first quarter of 20th century. Britain alone controlled a quarter of the world major part of which comprised of Muslim territory. Britain had a vanity that it was controlling the sea all-over the world and that sun never set on its dominion. France had under its control a third of Africa besides a good number of Far-Eastern states. Even countries like Italy, Spain and Portugal were controlling a number of places around the world. The colonial powers were using resources of the whole world to strengthen their economic, political and cultural dominance. Similarly, Tzarist Russia had under its thumb the Central Asian States ( a galaxy of republics which once symbolized epitome of Islamic glory.)
The whole Muslim ummah was under the autocracy of Western powers with no hope and signs of improvement from any where. Turkish Ottoman empire ( a symbol of Islamic world power with its borders stretching from Morocco to Central Europe ( had become the "Sick-Man" of Europe. Balkan wars and World War I had forced her to retreat and ultimately confined to a limited area around Anatolia. Even here the great empire had to fight for survival and was coerced to adopt secularism in guise of Kamalism. It had to compromise on elimination of Ottoman empire and destroy its historical, religious and cultural identity to secure political and geographical entity.
For the Middle-East the Western colonial powers had a horrible plan. Pan-Arab nationalism and lust for power were the destructive instruments applied to snatch political freedom from the Middle-Eastern Muslim rulers. About a dozen powerless states under the European command emerged on world map as a result of Sykes-Picot Agreement (1916) and Balfour Declaration (1917). As such, the plan was to divide Middle-East into pieces on one hand and on the other to create conditions facilitating creation of a Jewish state among Arabs. The machination ultimately bore fruit and Israel was established in the heart of Muslim ever. Muslims, who enjoyed world leadership status for more than 12 centuries, were thus deprived of this position for the first time in history. Except in a few semi-independent states (Afghanistan, Turkey, Yemen and Arab Peninsula), the Muslim might and political authority - the symbols of Muslim ummah's dignity - was totally eliminated from around ummah with due understanding among USA, UK and USSR with connivance of UN. This way, all those rulers, tribes and people who once enjoyed power, pelf and freedom were eliminated from world politics for the globe.
cont....
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*Originally posted by Seminole: *
Who said anything about altruism?
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Apart from your TV, films, press and just about any other form of media, nobody much. I guess it must be really important for some reason.
http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle....storyID=2589900
BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Tens of thousands of protesters demanded on Friday that the United States get out of Iraq, as U.S. troops arrested a fourth wanted aide of Saddam Hussein.
The demonstrators poured out of Friday prayers in Baghdad mosques chanting anti-American slogans and calling for an Islamic state to replace Saddam’s toppled government.
The protests on the Muslim holy day came as regional states met in Saudi Arabia to discuss a response to the Iraq war.
U.S. Central Command in Qatar said Iraqi Kurds had captured and handed over Samir Abul Aziz al-Najim, a senior Baghdad official of Saddam’s Baath Party, near Mosul in northern Iraq.
He was the fourth person to be detained from a U.S. list of 55 most-wanted Iraqis. U.S. Brigadier General Vincent Brooks told a news briefing Najim may have been posted to northern Iraq to take command of some military operations there.
In the first Friday prayers since U.S. tanks drove to the heart of Baghdad last week, a Muslim preacher said the United States had invaded to defend Israel and denied Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction, a key justification Washington offered for the war.
No prayers were held last Friday. Followers of the preacher, Ahmed al-Kubaisi, carried Korans and waved banners that read “No to America. No to Secular State. Yes to Islamic State.”
“Leave our country, we want peace,” one banner read.
“This is not the America we know. The America we know respects international law, respects the right of people,” Kubaisi said.
Americans and British forces did not liberate Iraq. They invaded it!!!
The facade of freedom of the Iraqi freedom is not going to stay long. The West has its own dirty objectives and while achieving those objective it does not even care how many women are disgraced, children made orphans, how many killed and many places plundered and bombed. Yes Saddam was bad, but in no way was a threat to the United States. After 12 years of sanctions what else did you want from Iraqis.
All this has started to make sense. Its bias and hatred towards Islam that makes West commit such crimes against the humanity. (By West I mean, some Western governments’ and their policies)