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no ' but jehanum wasil'
today as I see MMA politicians, ijan ul haq types and networks bow down to militants and militant sympathisers by the tone of their coverage...I am very disappointed.
The stations that can go after govt in a no holds barred manner, are scared to talk about militants, or is it just not good business?
shameful
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This AAJ guy (wearing glasses, moustache and a blue shirt) is questioning the authenticity of the govt. account (of dead soldiers). What a turd!
tell this real life uncle sargam with a transplant to shut the hell up.
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Some day I'll call their show and also Talat idiots' and tell them what a bunch of morons these people are.
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Root cause? Where have we heard this word before?
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question is will they air it, tell them something they want to hear in prescreen and when live ask a diff question :)
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question is will they air it, tell them something they want to hear in prescreen and when live ask a diff question :)
That's the plan:
"Ooo ji main umreeka say bool raha hoon; aap ka show bahooooot mallloomati hai" & then coup de grace. :D
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moronic caller...wanted govt to sit and talk. abay lamer...how many months did govt wait, and how many days did the govt try to talk sense into these morons.
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Abdul Rasheed Ghazi and his burqa-posh brother are nothing but terrorists who were hijacking due process of the law to enforce their own narrow-vision of Islam.
The children (girls and boys) in these institutions are mostly brain-washed. But still I abhored the actions of the buqa-clad women who were running around raiding property, kidnapping and commiting acts of violence against other people. I am sure they had a reasonable point of view (though I may not agree with it) but the way they were going about it was just horribly inappropriate.
Lal Masjid was protected and encouraged during the time of Zia-ul-Haq and its illegal activities were ignored all the way up to now. All governments are responsible for this, but the biggest jerk is the Musharraf government (and its assorted ministers etc) who masterminded and prolonged the issue to distract public (I am not going into the reasons why they would do that).
Unlike some people who think this is all topi drama, I do believe that this is/was a real crisis. Innocent lives are lost (and are being lost). A school that housed and served (dubiously it may be) hundreds of children (including many orphans) is lost. A masjid is completely desecrated and destroyed and the name of our country is again dragged into the international media for a terrorist-related/unfavorable situation.
I am sure Musharraf will beat his chest and portray himself as the last ray of hope to protect Pakistan from rabid Mullahs and our armed forces/rangers did everything they were asked to do... but honestly, this situation has no winners. With hundreds upon hundreds of people dead, any one who even remotely thinks that anyone has come out in a favorable light after this 'show of force' by the government is just fooling themselves.
Past is past. Whats done is done. I am sure there will be investigations and inquiries and medals will be given out and people will keep commenting on this "saniha". My main concern is how will this event radicalize other segments of our society. I don't want my country to fall into the hands of extremists and radical clerics. Unfortunately, after what has happened in the last 2 weeks, I am not sure how we will be able to avoid going down that path.
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now they are confused about what they reported as facts?
huh
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Faisal what the govt did was right. maybe not politically correct, may not be good photo ops, but it was needed. At this time what else could have been done.
whether musharraf timed it, whether he did not time it, did it make any difference really, did these guys become more of a terrorist in 2 months? did the number of forced people in the compound increase by 200% in 2 months?
all attempts were made to solve this to a point that the state looked like a joke.
it is a real issue and it was tackled head on. would it grow radical elements and militancy in teh country?? err well there is enough already that brining it into light may help. Although as peopel continue to call ghazi a shaheed..even after he held kids hostages.. I dont have high hopes.
when you have 20K tribal idiots chanting revenge, you know what type of people they were, and whether this event happened or not they are there...
but then maybe the nation should have pretended to be a lil madrassa boy and bent over in front of the ghazi biradran...
that would have solved everything.
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Editorial: Lessons of Lal Masjid
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2007\07\11\story_11-7-2007_pg3_1
As the Lal Masjid saga moved to its endgame on Monday, the clergy represented by Wifaqul Madaris of the Deobandi school of thought decided to split from the Musharraf government. The delegation of clerics led by the old Taliban admirer Maulana Rafi Usmani of Darul Ulum Karachi announced that it was disappointed by the way the government had reacted to their efforts to “resolve” the Lal Masjid standoff. They kept the “agreed plan” secret but the federal state minister of information Mr Tariq Azim disclosed that the government could not accept the clerical position that the abandoned seminaries of Lal Masjid be handed over to the Wifaq instead of the law.
As the troops finally broke into the seminary held by Maulana Abdur Rashid Ghazi and his foreign terrorists, the nation was agonised over what should have been done. The foremost thought, naturally, was for the women and children kept hostage by the terrorists. The media talked about it all the time; one TV channel hyped it up unfairly through old school hymns from Allama Iqbal. This had the effect of watering down the universally accepted state principle of not negotiating with terrorists in a “siege-and-hostage” situation.
A justifiable lack of trust affected all efforts at talking to the terrorists inside Jamia Hafsa. As some of the ulema and the country’s top philanthropist Abdus Sattar Edhi offered to go inside the seminary to talk to Mr Ghazi, it was realised that even a single well-known personage taken hostage by the terrorists would immediately mean defeat of the government. For instance, had Mr Edhi been taken hostage by the terrorists during negotiations, the demand for safe passage would have had to be conceded. Once safe passage was allowed, the terrorists would have gone on to commit more acts of revenge in areas where the writ of the state is already weak.
The gap between the politico-religious minded and expert opinion has been evident during the siege and will continue to dog the government in the coming days. The inmates of Lal Masjid will be lionised by some while the collateral damage in the shape of women and children killed will be pinned on the government as “criminal neglect of the life of the common man”. Other “ungoverned spaces” inside the country will step up their “revenge” actions. Already, the killing of Chinese mechanics in Peshawar — providing repairs backup to Chinese rickshaws — was a crude retaliation for what happened after the Lal Masjid vigilantes abducted some Chinese nationals in Islamabad.
The situation confronted by the government has been compared to what happened in India after the hijack of an Indian passenger airliner from Nepal in 1999. The hijackers brought the plane to Kandahar and asked for the release of three Al Qaeda terrorists from an Indian jail in return for the Indian passengers. As days rolled by with the Indian government refusing to negotiate with the hijackers, the Indian public reaction to the killing of one passenger and the unspeakable suffering of the women and children on board the plane began to inflict its toll. The Vajpayee government gave in finally and released the terrorists, not least since the plane was on foreign territory sympathetic to the hijackers (the Taliban) and an effective operation could not have been carried out. In the event, the Indian government has not forgiven itself for its mistake. The terrorists released by India went on to perpetrate history’s worst crimes. Maulana Masood Azhar headed straight for Jamia Banuria in Karachi and announced his new jihadi outfit called Jaish Muhammad. In 2001 it attacked the Indian parliament and unleashed a military standoff between India and Pakistan lasting for nearly one year. The same year Umar Sheikh took part in the planning of the 9/11 terrorist acts in the United States, acting as the funnel for the funds that went from Al Qaeda to the hijackers in the United States. He was caught after he was instrumental in the kidnapping and beheading of the American journalist Daniel Pearl. Jaish, under different names, has since tried to kill President Musharraf a number of times.
The fact is that Lal Masjid was feeding ideologically into the anarchic order of Talibanisation in the Frontier and Tribal Areas. Eighty percent of the acolytes in its residential seminaries were from FATA and from the provincially administered tribal region of Malakand, Swat and Dir. Messrs Ghazi and Aziz regularly applauded the “state within the state” of the “FM radio mullah” Fazlullah of Malakand enjoying direct connections with Al Qaeda. No one paid heed to this. No one registered the trend of increased Al Qaeda “appearances” in the country. Over the last six months, many Al Qaeda terrorists were caught in the country and Lal Masjid remained an ally of Al Qaeda. Significantly, the “free media” knew about it but didn’t take it to task!
Law enforcement and intelligence agencies arrested 32 Al-Qaeda activists in Pakistan from January 2007 onwards. Nasir Suleman Zakaria, an Arab and Al Qaeda member, was arrested while travelling to Balochistan from Wana (South Waziristan). Two of the 32 arrested men were German, 3 were Turkish, 2 Kyrgyz, and 5 Uzbek, all attached to the different jihadi organisations of the country. Those who advocated “safe passage” for Mr Ghazi and his terrorists wrongly believe, together with Imran Khan, that General Musharraf has “unleashed an artificial war in Pakistan to please the Americans”.
Let us be clear. No government can violate the universal principle of “no negotiation with terrorists” and live to be praised. This time around, the “free media” didn’t play its cards fairly. It was allowed to carry on its own “negotiations” with the terrorists, tacitly bending public opinion in favour of “safe passage” — one FM radio in Lahore actually recommended it — and was not able to comment objectively on the vested interest of the Wifaq clerics negotiating with the ulterior motive of grabbing the madrassa property in a city already home to 88 seminaries bristling with rejectionism. *
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GIGN generally considered as the best counter terrorist special forces taking on a plane hostage situation. Imagine what it was like in lal masjid.
http://www.shadowspearmedia.com/flvplayer.swf?file=http://www.shadowspearmedia.com/flvideo/269.flv
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10 GIGN wounded and 4 bad guys killed. 12 passengers injured.
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Let us be clear. No government can violate the universal principle of “no negotiation with terrorists” and live to be praised. This time around, the “free media” didn’t play its cards fairly. It was allowed to carry on its own “negotiations” with the terrorists, tacitly bending public opinion in favour of “safe passage” — one FM radio in Lahore actually recommended it — and was not able to comment objectively on the vested interest of the Wifaq clerics negotiating with the ulterior motive of grabbing the madrassa property in a city already home to 88 seminaries bristling with rejectionism. *
Media is sympathetic towards these mullahtic loonies. Media shouldn't forget the restrictions taleban placed on afghan media during their rule.
Great article!
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A loan example of sane analysis among the cacophony of pro-Mullah journalists.
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Some of the sentiments expressed here remind me of the giddyness displayed during the infamous shock-and-awe when the gulf war started with bombings over Baghdad. Its very unfortunate. There are real people dead here. There are real people injured here. At this time, media in Islamabad does not have access to cover injuries and fatalities to children and women. We don't know the full story. My heart goes out to the soldiers who died. To the innocent citizens who are dead or injured or are otherwise suffering through this. While I completely support that laws of the land must be upheld, I refuse to believe that this was the only solution available in the situation. This is a masjid in the middle of a densely populated part of our capital city. I am sure there are other alternatives than to launch an all-out military attack, which by definition would result (and did result) in many innocent lives lost.
How did so much weaponery made it inside the compound? Who was funding all this jihadi warfare in the middle of Islamabad? How come foreign terrorists allowed to hide in the masjid? Why was the water/gas/electricity of the masjid not disconnected immediately when the terrorist mullahs in the masjid openly challenged the laws of the land?
I am sure we will get some answers in due time.
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A loan example of sane analysis among the cacophony of pro-Mullah journalists.
god forbid mullhatic loonies succeed in their aims; media will be the first to receive chitroles in public.
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i can not believe the stupidity of pakistani media and those politicians sitting in london. what else do they need.
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Faisan bhai, i'm gonna go read my thread in mod forum :D
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How did so much weaponery made it inside the compound? Who was funding all this jihadi warfare in the middle of Islamabad? How come foreign terrorists allowed to hide in the masjid?
If these guys can hijack planes on 9/11 and do what they did, all this should be pretty easy in a society like Pakistan.