Referring to another discussion going on…
What is the origin of Kalima?
Is " La ilaha illallah, muhammad rassol allah", written as a complete verse in Koran anywhere?
I have seen at least three versions of Kalima, viz
la ilaha illallah
La ilaha illallah, Muhammad rasool Allah
La ilaha illallah, Muhammad rasool Allah, Ali Wali ullah.
Which one is the correct version and what is the evidence?
[quote]
Originally posted by analyze it:
**Referring to another discussion going on.....
1) What is the origin of Kalima?
2) Is " La ilaha illallah, muhammad rassol allah", written as a complete verse in Koran anywhere?
3) I have seen at least three versions of Kalima, viz
1) la ilaha illallah
2) La ilaha illallah, Muhammad rasool Allah
3) La ilaha illallah, Muhammad rasool Allah, Ali Wali ullah.
Which one is the correct version and what is the evidence?**
[/quote]
First one is the correct version, rest has been added by humans. The first one exists in Quran and is the first pillar of our faith. Look up 3:18. 2nd and 3rd versions are incorrect at least in my view.
2nd and 3rd are not incorrect...there is nothing wrong with it...anaylize it you better stick to your own religion and anaylize hinduismn im sure you have gained more info about islam then your own now!
btw Why dont you become muslim?!?
"kaisay na karta usko main pyar, uski haseen main sukh thay hazaar, bichar gayay hum dukh ki hay baat"
The second part exists in the Quran as well.
48:29.
Lahol-e- walaquwwat illa billah,
Ali, how do know what my reigions is....LOL
BTW is it necessary to be muslim in order to discuss about Islam???
LOL again.
048.029
YUSUFALI: Muhammad is the messenger of Allah; and those who are with him are strong against Unbelievers, (but) compassionate amongst each other. Thou wilt see them bow and prostrate themselves (in prayer), seeking Grace from Allah and (His) Good Pleasure. On their faces are their marks, (being) the traces of their prostration. This is their similitude in the Taurat; and their similitude in the Gospel is: like a seed which sends forth its blade, then makes it strong; it then becomes thick, and it stands on its own stem, (filling) the sowers with wonder and delight. As a result, it fills the Unbelievers with rage at them. Allah has promised those among them who believe and do righteous deeds forgiveness, and a great Reward.
PICKTHAL: Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves. Thou (O Muhammad) seest them bowing and falling prostrate (in worship), seeking bounty from Allah and (His) acceptance. The mark of them is on their foreheads from the traces of prostration. Such is their likeness in the Torah and their likeness in the Gospel - like as sown corn that sendeth forth its shoot and strengtheneth it and riseth firm upon its stalk, delighting the sowers - that He may enrage the disbelievers with (the sight of) them. Allah hath promised, unto such of them as believe and do good works, forgiveness and immense reward.
SHAKIR: Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and those with him are firm of heart against the unbelievers, compassionate among themselves; you will see them bowing down, prostrating themselves, seeking grace from Allah and pleasure; their marks are in their faces because of the effect of prostration; that is their description in the Taurat and their description in the Injeel; like as seed-produce that puts forth its sprout, then strengthens it, so it becomes stout and stands firmly on its stem, delighting the sowers that He may enrage the unbelievers on account of them; Allah has promised those among them who believe and do good, forgiveness and a great reward.
===============================================
Akif: these are three translations of 48:29. The second part is not precede by first part which is Lailaha illallah.(I mean exactly in the same order as kalima is read and recited.)
Is there any place in Koran where the kalima is written exactly as noted above and as read by muslim??
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by analyze it:
1) What is the origin of Kalima?
Ibrahim says; Kalima is the testimony of FAITH in Allah (swt) hence it originated the day the angels, jinns and man were created.
Allah (swt) knows best!
2) Is " La ilaha illallah, muhammad rassol allah", written as a complete verse in Koran anywhere?
Ibrahim says; Does it need to be?
3) I have seen at least three versions of Kalima, viz
1) la ilaha illallah
2) La ilaha illallah, Muhammad rasool Allah
3) La ilaha illallah, Muhammad rasool Allah, Ali Wali ullah.
Which one is the correct version and what is the evidence?
Ibrahim says: Each person testifying the faith in Allah (swt) at a particular time frame was to testify who they believed in and who was their respective Prophet , they are following.
hence In Islam we are to say 2) La ilaha illallah, Muhammadur rasool Allah
PS: by the time you respond to this I could be on the road, hence insha Allah, will respond on my return ( may take a few days or weeks)
MDP says the first version is correct, Ibrahim says the second version is correct. There must be someone who would state the third version is the ultimate.
If the kalima in the second form(the one most commonly stated) is not found in this form in the Koran, how did it come into being?? Is there any historical proof??
[quote]
Originally posted by analyze it:
*......
If the kalima in the second form(the one most commonly stated) is not found in this form in the Koran, how did it come into being?? Is there any historical proof?? *
[/quote]
do you remember an ayah in Quran "aamana billahi wa-malaikatihi wa-kutubihi wa-rusulihi wal-youmil aakhir......"??
I'm trying to find an exact refence. but I think that Kalima (numbered 2 in your post) is derived using this ayah...
We oughta be Changez like, don't we?
okay, found it ....
02:285 The Rasool has believed in the Guidance which has been revealed to him from his Rabb and so do the Believers. They all
believe in Allah, His angels, His books and His Rasools. They say we do not discriminate against anyone of His Rasools. And
they say: "We hear and we obey. Grant us Your forgiveness, O Rabb; to You we shall all return."
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
We oughta be Changez like, don't we?
[quote]
Originally posted by analyze it:
**MDP says the first version is correct, Ibrahim says the second version is correct. There must be someone who would state the third version is the ultimate.
If the kalima in the second form(the one most commonly stated) is not found in this form in the Koran, how did it come into being?? Is there any historical proof?? **
[/quote]
You guessed it.
All 3 versions are correct.
The third kalima was established on the blessed day of Ghadir Khum, where the holy prophet (pbuh) declared Imam Ali (as) the Master (maula) of all believers.
hehe IRONY, yaar.
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/wink.gif
“kaisay na karta usko main pyar, uski haseen main sukh thay hazaar, bichar gayay hum dukh ki hay baat”
[quote]
Originally posted by a1shah:
** You guessed it.
All 3 versions are correct.
The third kalima was established on the blessed day of Ghadir Khum, where the holy prophet (pbuh) declared Imam Ali (as) the Master (maula) of all believers.
**
[/quote]
Verily Allah is your maula and wali:
Yunus - 10:30
There! Every person will know (exactly) what (all) he had earned before, and they will be brought back to Allâh, their rightful Lord (maula), and their invented false deities will vanish from them.
Al-Hajj - 22:78
And strive hard in Allâh's Cause as you ought to strive (with sincerity and with all your efforts that His Name should be superior). He has chosen you (to convey His Message of Islâmic Monotheism to mankind by inviting them to His religion, Islâm), and has not laid upon you in religion any hardship, it is the religion of your father Ibrahim (Abraham) (Islâmic Monotheism). It is He (Allâh) Who has named you Muslims both before and in this (the Qur'ân), that the Messenger (Muhammad SAW) may be a witness over you and you be witnesses over mankind! So perform AsSalât (Iqamat-as-Salât), give Zakât and hold fast to Allâh * He is your maula (Patron, Lord, etc.), what an Excellent maula (Patron, Lord, etc.) and what an Excellent Helper!
Muhammad - 47:11
That is because Allâh is the maula (Lord, Master, Helper, Protector, etc.) of those who believe, and the disbelievers have no maula (lord, master, helper, protector, etc.).
At-Tahrim - 66:2
Allâh has already ordained for you (O men), the dissolution of your oaths. And Allâh is your maula (Lord, or Master, or Protector, etc.) and He is the All-Knower, the All-Wise.
At-Tahrim - 66:4
If you two (wives of the Prophet SAW, namely 'Aishah and Hafsah) turn in repentance to Allâh, (it will be better for you), your hearts are indeed so inclined (to oppose what the Prophet SAW likes), but if you help one another against him (Muhammad SAW), then verily, Allâh is his maula (Lord, or Master, or Protector, etc.), and Jibrael (Gabriel), and the righteous among the believers, and furthermore, the angels are his helpers.
Shame on you A1 Shah*
[quote]
Originally posted by analyze it:
*Akif: these are three translations of 48:29. The second part is not precede by first part which is Lailaha illallah.(I mean exactly in the same order as kalima is read and recited.)
Is there any place in Koran where the kalima is written exactly as noted above and as read by muslim?? *
[/quote]
No...the two are not written together in the Quran anywhere. However, you have to understand the concept of the Kalima in order to understand its structure. The kalima is the most basic pillar of Islam. The one in which, our belief is imperative as a Muslim. And well, Allah SWTs oneness, and Prophet SAWs prophethood and finality are the only two imperatives, and if we disbelieve in either of these two, we risk losing our faith.
The third part is true, but its belief does not constitute belief in Islam. Im sure if there was any other component vital to our faith, it would have been added to the kalima as well.
[quote]
Originally posted by Akif:
** No...the two are not written together in the Quran anywhere. However, you have to understand the concept of the Kalima in order to understand its structure. The kalima is the most basic pillar of Islam. The one in which, our belief is imperative as a Muslim. And well, Allah SWTs oneness, and Prophet SAWs prophethood and finality are the only two imperatives, and if we disbelieve in either of these two, we risk losing our faith.
The third part is true, but its belief does not constitute belief in Islam. Im sure if there was any other component vital to our faith, it would have been added to the kalima as well. **
[/quote]
Kalima is a testimony of faith and the correct testimony of our faith has no other name in it except God because quran tells us so.
The words 'there is no god but God' are the exact words that God himself utters in quran and also the angels. To add anything to it is like saying that God forgot the second or the third part of it.