Q1.I heard alot about kismat and naseeb being two different things but can’t find out what’s the islamic point of view on kismat and naseeb on two.
Q2.The other thing which disturbed me that Allah(Swt) has written destiny of all of us in loh-e-mehfooz and he knows what we gonna do in future.The thing is if Allah knows everything about our future.He knows whether we will commit sins or do good deeds, he knows that whether we will go in jannat or jahnum, he knows we can’t beat our ‘nafs’ then what’s the point of testing us because he knows from the day when he created us that how we gonna pass our life on earth then why he put us in such a difficult test? I know that Allah has given us two paths and choice is ours but I have known may people who opened their eyes in kufr and died in kufr and they couldn’t come out of it in their whole life.
so question is if Allah(swt) knows about our future, when he wrote our kismat from day one then keeping popular belief of kismat in mind we know that we can’t do anything which is not in our kismat no matter how we hard we try so what’s the point of all this naiki and badee stuff???
Allah didn't force your own actions and decisions on you... He knew in advance what choices you would make throughout your life and that is what is recorded... He always knew for example that i would come to this forum of my own free will on this day and post this reply... Allah with His foreknowledge knew that and recorded it in advance... the choice was mine, the recording was His, the Mighty and Majestic...
Some things you yourself don't have any influence over... when and where you were born for example, your own gender at birth etc... these things are written FOR you...
No.I am not shia but it's wrong to associate general concepts with the shias.Can only shias think of kismat and naseeb??Explain me difference between naseeb and kismat, if you can, instead of determining my sect.
I have myslef been in much confusion about the same thing. Although I dont claim to have found the answer yet but I think I have found enough to justify myself atleast, if not others.
Here is my take on it...first of all, you have to realise that no where in our religion anything is time bound...everything is bound to certain events. Think of it this way...Allah has not given us any time for the day of judgement rather we are told about certain series of events that would lead to that day. (obviously this has been revealed to us through Prophet Muhammad SAW...adding this for those who would argue where in Quran Allah has mentioned about such events!)
If we consider our life as some kind of a mathematical model with various constants and variables...consider this model representing some kind of a "state machine"...At each "state" we have a limited set of options to substitute the values for the variables whereas the constants are something that are either derived from the previous state or induced directly by what we call "Kismat/Taqdeer"...now at each state we choose what to substitute for these variables (known as "Tadbeer") and move on to the next state. Also, we have a limited number of states in our whole life and the way we chose to reach from one state to another is again under our control (determined through how we are substituting for the variables). And thats how event after event...state after state we reach to a point where we die!
Again, the above anology is what definitely makes sense to me (for now, atleast) and it may sound really absurd to you. But as I said earlier, this is how I think of this whole "Taqdeer vs Tadbeer" thing..and you have every right to differ from my thoughts.
Update:
I completely missed out one important point up here...The start and end state of human life is pre-defined. Its just that how and when we reach the end state...which is in our control...since we have option to make choices at each and every state of life.
Mashallah iss say muskil koi explanation nahin thee.sir jee mein nay eik simple sawal poocha tha aur aap nay uss may constants, variables, mathmatics aur different states kay peechay chupa diya.hayeeeeeeeee.Jiyo sir jee jiyo
Congratulation man you got power to see hidden things. I think you don’t know how much potential you got to see hidden text and meaning.Be I am the first person to congratulate you on your revealing powers.
Rangbaz…please read an update to my original post, maybe that would make sense…otherwise, another simple anology would be to think about we have a starting point and a finishing point. Many roads lead to the finishing point and all these roads have many cross points. Now following through a road from one cross point to another its our choice which road we take next. This new road maybe more rough or more smoother than the previous depending upon the choice we had made. However, eventually since all the roads are leading to the same end point…we may linger on the time to reach the end, but eventually we will reach there nevertheless.
Off course, He the Almighty (swt) knows every thing. But he has created us as Ashraf’al Makhluqat and gave us Aql to distinguish between the Good and the evil.
beating the nafs? is this really that difficult? Have you ever even tried it?
Well believe me, its not that difficuIts at all. It is my faith that every muslim who firmly believes in Allah (swt), his Prophets (saww), his Imams (as), the Day of judgment, and the promissed reward for our good deed. for him it would not be a difficult task.
[QUOTE]
Allah(Swt) has written destiny of all of us in loh-e-mehfooz/QUOTE]
first of, Allah (swt) never wrote your kismat. I know there are some treditions in “The Shih Books” about this. But are they really sahih?? Moreover, it is your own choice (as you wrote above) to make your own way through your life by distinguishing between good and evil.
what are the popular belife of kismat? are they any islamic?? let me quote (copy’n paste ) some thing for you and others who believe in such things from a book I read. Its a long reed but Insha-Allah it will clarify all your doubts and justifies your queries:
justice of God and predestination
Allah, Glory be to Him, says in His noble book: **“And say the truth has come from your Lord, whosoever wishes, let him believe, whosoever wishes, let him disbelieve”. “There is no compulsion in religion, truth stands out clearly from error” (2:256). “One who does an atom’s weight of good will see it, one who does an atom’s weight of evil will see it” (99:7-8). “You are only an admonisher, you do not watch over them” (88:22). **
How can you then accept traditions, reported in Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim, that Allah has preordained the actions of His slaves before He [even] created them? Al-Bukhari has reported in his Sahih:** “Adam and Moses argued with each other. Moses said to Adam: ‘O Adam! You are our father who disappointed us and turned us out of paradise’. Then Adam said to him: ‘O Moses! Allah favored you with His talk (talked to you directly) and He wrote [the Torah] for you with His Own Hand. Do you blame me for an act which Allah had written in my fate forty years before my creation?’ So Adam confuted Moses, Adam confuted Moses, the Prophet added, repeating the statement three times”.**
Muslim reported a similar tradition in his Sahih. He reported the Prophet said: “The constituents of one of you are collected for forty days in his mother’s womb, after which it becomes a clot of blood in another period of forty days. Then it becomes a lump of flesh, then Allah sends His angels to breath in it the spirit and with instructions concerning four things. The angel writes down his livelihood, his death, his actions, his happiness and misfortunes. By Him, besides Whom there is no God, if one of you acts like the people of paradise to the extent that between him and paradise remains the distance of a cubit and then the book (of destiny) overcomes him, he begins to act like the people of hell until he enters it. Another one of you performs the acts of the people of hell to the extent that there remains between him and hell the distance of a cubit and then the book (of destiny) overcomes him, he begins to act like the people of heaven and enters it”.
Similarly, Muslim has narrated in his Sahih from 'A’isha, the mother of the believers. She said: “The Prophet of Allah was invited to a funeral of a child from the Ansar. I said to him: ‘There is happiness for this child who is a bird from the birds of heaven, for it committed no sin nor did he reach the age (of committing sin)’. He said: 'The opposite is the case, O ‘A’isha. Indeed Allah has created for paradise its people while they were in their father’s loins and He created for hell its people while they were in their father’s loins’”.
Al-Bukhari has reported in his Sahih that a person asked: “‘O Prophet of God, can the people of paradise be known from the people of hell?’ He replied: ‘Yes’. He said: ‘Even if he didn’t work (for it)?’ He replied: ‘Everyone does what he is created for or what is decreed for him to do’”.
Glory and praise be to You, O Our Lord, You are more sublime and more exalted than this tyranny. How can we believe these traditions [which] contradict your dear book in which You have stated, and Your words are true: “Indeed, God does not do injustice to the people in any way, but the people do injustice to themselves” (10:44); “Indeed, Allah does not do an atom’s weight of injustice” (4:40); “Your Lord does no injustice to anyone” (18:49); “God did not do any injustice to them, but they did injustice to themselves” (3:117); “It was not God who did injustice to them, but they did injustice to themselves” (9:70, 29: 40, 30:9); “We did no injustice to them but they did injustice to themselves” (43:76); “That is because of what their hands have brought forth, indeed, Allah does no injustice to the slaves” (8:51); “Whoever does good, does so for his own self, whoever does evil, [does so] against his (self), your Lord does not do injustice to the servants” (41:46).
Just as He has said in the hadith qudsi, (sacred tradition) “O My slaves, I have forbidden injustice for Myself, [as] I have also forbidden it upon you, so do not be unjust to yourselves”. How can a Muslim who believes in God, His justice and mercy [also believe] that Allah, Glory be to Him, created the creation, and decreed upon some of them heaven and upon others the fire according to His wishes? [How can a Muslim believe] that He [also] decreed their acts, everyone proceeding towards what he is created for? [How can he accept] these traditions which oppose the noble Qu’ran, [and] the state of fitra (natural disposition) which God has created the people in, and which oppose sound reasoning and human intuition and basic human rights?
How can we believe in this religion which petrifies human reasoning, [teaching] the human being is a puppet which the hand of fate moves according to its wishes, only to put it into an oven later on? This belief which prevents the human mind from creation, discovery, invention, progress and competition which have brought about such wonderful things; and leaves a person stagnant and contented with the state he is in and with what he has, claiming that he is proceeding towards what has been decreed for him?
How can we accept these traditions which conflict with sound reason and portray a picture that Allah, Glory be to Him, is the Creator, Almighty, Strong and Overpowering and it is up to Him to create weak slaves so as to put them into the hell fire simply because He does what He wills? Do the intelligent beings call this Lord a wise, merciful or just God?
What would happen if we discuss this with non-Muslim erudite scholars and they know that our Lord has these attributes and that our religion has decreed misery upon the people before they were born, will they then accept Islam and enter into the religion in great numbers?
Glory be to You, O Lord, this is false speech which was imprinted by the Umayyads and recorded by them for their own interests, it is up to the researcher to know the secret of that. This is falsified speech because it contradicts Your speech. Far be it from You that Your Prophet should fabricate anything against You which would contradict Your revelation that You sent to him. It is established that he (S.A.W.) said: **“If a tradition comes to you from me, then compare it with the book of God. Accept whatever agrees with the book of God and reject whatever contradicts it”. **
Traditions of these genre are many, they oppose the book of God and reason. They must be rejected, no attention should be paid to them even if al-Bukhari and Muslim have reported them, they were not infallible persons. One proof is sufficient for us to refute these invalid claims, this is the sending of the Prophets and Apostles from Allah to His creatures during the entire course of human history so as to rectify the misdeeds of the servants and to explain to them the right path. [It was also done] to teach them the book and wisdom and to give them the good tidings of heaven if they are upright and to warn them of the punishment of God in the fire if they are corrupt.
Amongst the justice and mercy of Allah, Glory be to Him, to His creatures is that He doesn’t punish [anyone] until He sends to them a Prophet and establishes for them proofs. The most High has said: “One who is guided, is guided for His own self; one who goes astray does so for his own loss, no one bears the burden of another (soul); We do not punish anyone until we send a Prophet” (17:15).
If the traditions which al-Bukhari and Muslim transmit indicate that Allah has prescribed the acts of His slaves before He created them and He decreed for some of them heaven and for others hell as we have previously indicated and as the ahl al-sunna wa’l-Jama’a believe, I say that, if this is true, then the sending of Messengers and the revealing of books is a futile exercise. Allah, the most High and Great, is above all that. They have not credited Allah with His due worth. We should not speak like this about Allah, Glory be to Him, this is a great accusation [against Him].
“Those are the signs of Allah We reveal to You with the truth, Allah does not wish injustice to the universe” (3:108). The answer to this lies with the Imams of guidance and lanterns of those in darkness and the light houses of the umma, i.e., the removal of injustice and futility from Allah, the most Glorious.
Let us hear from the door of knowledge, the commander of believers, 'Ali b. Abi Talib (A.S.). He explains to the people this belief which has remained a puzzle to some Muslims who have abandoned the door [of knowledge]. **He said (when one of his companions asked him: “Is our journey to Syria by the decree of God and by predestination?)” **
“Woe to you, Perhaps you take the decree as inevitable and unavoidable destiny. If this was so, then reward and punishment would be in vain, promises and warnings would be meaningless. Indeed, Allah, Glory be to Him, ordered His servants to act according to their free will and prohibited them through warnings. He has made obligations easy, not difficult for them. For a few good [works], he gives much [reward]. If he is disobeyed, it is not by being overpowered; if he is obeyed, it is not by force. He did not send Prophets for sport, neither did he reveal the book without purpose. He did not create the heavens and the earth and what is between them in vain, ‘that is the thinking of those who disbelieve, woe to those who disbelieve due to the fire’” (38:27). The Imam (A.S.) has spoken the truth, woe to those who ascribe futility and injustice to Allah, [we seek refuge] from His painful chastisement.
It is noteworthy, and the truth dictates, that the ahl al-sunna wa’l-Jama’a should dissociate Allah from futility and injustice. If you were to ask one of them he will never attribute injustice to the Majesty of Allah, Glory be to Him. However, he will find himself at a loss to reject the traditions reported by al-Bukhari and Muslim. So he believes at the same time that they are correct. Because of that, you will find that when you argue with them logically, he will claim that this is not called injustice on God’s part since He is the creator. The creator has the right to do as He wishes to His creatures. He is not asked what He does, [on the contrary] they are to be questioned. If you ask him: “How can God decree on a slave the hell fire before creating him because He has prescribed a wretched state for him, and how can He decree on another heaven before creating him since He has prescribed happiness for him? Isn’t that injustice on the two of them? [This is] because the one who enters heaven does not do so by his deeds but because of Allah choosing it for him, similarly, the one entering hell, he does not enter it because of the sins he committed but because of what Allah has decreed. Isn’t this injustice, does it not contradict the Qur’an?” He will answer you: “Indeed God does what He wishes”. You do not understand the contradiction in his position. This is clear since he has raised al-Bukhari and Muslim to the level of the Qur’an and he says the most correct books after the book of God are al-Bukhari and Muslim. In al-Bukhari and Muslim are [to be found] astonishing, strange and unfortunate things through which the Muslims have been confused. The Umayyads, and after them the 'Abbasids, have greatly succeeded in spreading their innovations and beliefs, which were in agreement with their barren politics. Their effects remain until today since the Muslims believe that it is the best and greatest legacy they have got because, according to their understanding, it is the collection of the correct traditions of the Prophet. If only the Muslims know the extent to which they lied against the Prophet (S.A.W.) due to their political goals, they (the Muslims) will not believe the traditions especially those which contradict the book of God.
As Allah has guaranteed the protection of the noble Qur’an and as it was preserved by the companions who would present it to the Prophet (for checking), they (the Umayyads) could not change or alter it so they turned to the pure sunna and they fabricated what they wished and [attributed] to whoever they wished. As they were the enemies of the ahl al-bayt [who were] the protectors of the Qur’an and the sunna, they invented, for every event, a tradition which they attributed to the Prophet (S.A.W.). They presented these to the Muslims, maintaining that these traditions are the most correct, to the exclusion of others, so the people accepted them with confidence. They transmitted these, generation after generation inheriting them.
The belief of the ahl al-dhikr about Allah, the Most High
Imam 'Ali says: **"Praise be to Allah who knows the hidden secrets of things, and clear signs point to Him. He cannot be seen by the eye of an onlooker, yet the eye of one who does not see Him does not deny Him. The mind that proves His existence cannot perceive Him. He has preceded everything in sublimity, nothing is more sublime than He. He is so close nothing is closer than Him. His sublimity does not alienate Him from His creation nor does His closeness bring them on an equal level to Him. He has not informed the intellect about the restrictions to His attributes, and He has not prevented it from knowing what is essential to know about Him. The signs of existence bear testimony to Him to the extent that the mind which denies Him also believes in Him. Allah is beyond what those who liken Him to other things or those who deny Him, say about Him. **
**Praise be to Allah, for whom one condition does not precede another so that He may be the first before being the Last or that He may be manifest before being hidden. Apart from Him, everything called unique is [actually] little. Apart from Him, everything honourable is meek, everything powerful is weak, every owner is a slave. **
Apart from Him, every scholar is a student, every one with ability is disabled and weak, every listener other than Him is deaf to light voices while loud voices make him deaf and distant voices are remote from him. Apart from him, everyone that sees is blind to hidden colours and delicate bodies. Apart from Him, every manifest thing is hidden, every inner thing apart from Him is manifest. He did not create what He did to strengthen His authority nor due to fear of time nor to seek help against an equally aggressive partner or hateful opponent. Rather, all creatures are nurtured by Him and are His humble slaves. He does not enter into anything so that it can be said that He exists therein, nor is He separated from anything so that it can be said that He is away from it. The creation that He created or the administration of what He controls did not tire Him. No disability overtook Him for what He created. No misgivings ever occurred to Him in what He ordained and resolved. His verdict is certain, His knowledge definite, His governance overwhelming. Even in distress, He is the centre of Hope and, despite all the bounties, He is to be feared".
It is not necessary if one object is hidden for you is also hidden for me; it depends where we both are standing. Maybe you are standing somewhere away from that object and some obstacle in between you and that particular object and I am standing right in front of it. “Revealing powers” “ka koie chakar nahin hay”.
Since I am familiar about the Shia Concepts of Predetermination or freewill and (Ash’arites-Sect) concepts about Predetermination or freewill; That is why I am saying that what gupguppy is saying is the same as Shia Concept about Predetermination or freewill.
Heres what I understood of it based on Ayatullah Sistani's incredibly nuanced and hard to understand explanation.
First of all, foreknowledge does not impugn on free will. Allah is all Knowing, and thereby it is not beyond His power to see what each of us will do, how each atom of our bodies will behave. If I can predict an event however, that does not mean that I am causing it.
Taqdeer and free will are concepts independent of foreknowledge. In the shia school, I believe we do not have complete free will. The limit of our freedom is bounded by fate. The easiest analogy I can give is that we are like one of those choose your own adventure books. At each point we make choices that determine where we will end up in life, however those choices are bounded by taqdeer, that book that doesnt let us escape our chosen but previously specified ending.
) some thing for you and others who believe in such things from a book I read. Its a long reed but Insha-Allah it will clarify all your doubts and justifies your queries: