so y u dont accept the fact tht "talibans" r not eliminated from tribal areas?...infact they r now strong in those areas now where they not used to strong...the whole situation is tht people of tribal and balochistan area hate army..literally hate army..just like we mahajirs started to hate army when our "brave" army killed thousands of innocent mahajirs...hameed gul,hamid mir and other experts have said tht pakistan army could NOT defeat taliban in nwfp...and the reason is simple..our army tried to use force...even more,local tribesman knew tht there were cia agents around the area..this even created more problems..understanding the background of any culture people is necessary..phathans love islam more then anything and taliban massive support in them..as i said even a child could have made better policies then opur army
One of the reasons "tribals" hate army is that those are "tribal" people who will hate a law being enforced, they can't follow laws, they only follow their own whims and desires, if you live in a country you need to follow its laws, period.
One of the reasons "tribals" hate army is that those are "tribal" people who will hate a law being enforced, they can't follow laws, they only follow their own whims and desires, if you live in a country you need to follow its laws, period.
Yaar Captan Sahab, if you are an army kaptan, than you must know that the tribals joined pakistan only if they will be allowed semi independence in enforcing local laws etc. The deman was accepted by Quaid.
Who brought weapons in the mosque in the first place, mullah do piyaza?
This is how any state works. You start kidnapping / killing people then govt is not ‘holds barred’ anymore and has moral / legal right to take them on. Every country in the world works like that. For those who bring in MQM, then taliban in NWFP hasn’t been really touched either because of the unruly deobandi pathan response in NWFP. Look at your own afghanistan * and see how they have treated their own non-pashtun muslims when it suited them.*
Yaar Captan Sahab, if you are an army kaptan, than you must know that the tribals joined pakistan only if they will be allowed semi independence in enforcing local laws etc. The deman was accepted by Quaid.
Did Quaide Azam agree that the tribals can create army of their own, support terrorists, provide safe-haven to terrorists, support suicide bombings within Pakistan (or anywhere outside for that matter)? Please enlighten me.
Ok, if you do not agree to them in their deeds let them be free to join Afghanistan. Why do you want to keep them with you?
Have you ever been deployed in Waziristan or just talking on heresay. These people are more loyal to the state than an ordinary pakistani. These places became hotbed of these activities only because we the Pakistan neglected them. totally. Just paid money to their Maliks through political agents and never did any development. The results are in front.
Tackle the issue politically, is army winning in the campaign? If so why has it beefed up its strenght by 15000 in recent month?
Ok, if you do not agree to them in their deeds let them be free to join Afghanistan. Why do you want to keep them with you?
Lets break Sindh for those reasons as Sindhis disagree with us, lets break Punjab as many Siraikis don't agree with us... shall we? You have to look at the reason of "disagreement" and not just say "disagree".
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Have you ever been deployed in Waziristan or just talking on heresay. These people are more loyal to the state than an ordinary pakistani. These places became hotbed of these activities only because we the Pakistan neglected them. totally. Just paid money to their Maliks through political agents and never did any development. The results are in front.
[/quote]
Why would you challenge "loyalty" of "ordinary Pakistani"? Do you think they care less about Pakistan? The only ones who care less about Pakistan are those who are supporting suicide bombings, who are supporting terrorists, who are supporting criminals etc. Lets compare "ordinary Pakistani" now.
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Tackle the issue politically, is army winning in the campaign? If so why has it beefed up its strenght by 15000 in recent month?
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I agree that "fighting" doesn't tackle a political issue, but then issues like "Lal Masjid" are not "political" issue, these are 'terrorism' issues.
nice man fughazi/taleban/alqaeda supporters out in full force today. :)
simple question- why did fughazi#2 not surrender. the entire world was looking on, he had access to all media, its not as if he was going to be coming out an 'accidentally' shot dead. he could have very easily told all stations I am coming out with my hands up in 2 minutes.
he did not. lets place the blame of what happened where it belongs, two bit militant things masquerading as scholars.
nice man fughazi/taleban/alqaeda supporters out in full force today. :)
simple question- why did fughazi#2 not surrender. the entire world was looking on, he had access to all media, its not as if he was going to be coming out an 'accidentally' shot dead. he could have very easily told all stations I am coming out with my hands up in 2 minutes.
he did not. lets place the blame of what happened where it belongs, two bit militant things masquerading as scholars.
On a same note I would like to know why Government waited so long to start the operation silence? Were they waiting for Ghazi to come out with his hands up for the last 4-6 months?
which of this offence is culpable by death punishment to 500 people alongwith the perpetrator?
why did the government waited for so long to punish him on first three counts?
The punishment of death was not given out, he chose it himself, he actually announced it on TV several times, were you not listening? He fought army of Pakistan, that is treason, even then army wanted to capture him but he chose death.
On a same note I would like to know why Government waited so long to start the operation silence? Were they waiting for Ghazi to come out with his hands up for the last 4-6 months?
I understand your stand, I questioned that too, but govt probably got danda from Chinese govt after recent abduction of Chinese nationals by Lal masjid folks. I am with you if you think govt should have done something back then (not necessarily of this scale) but then Lal Masjid folks didn't stop either from the wrong doings.
On a same note I would like to know why Government waited so long to start the operation silence? Were they waiting for Ghazi to come out with his hands up for the last 4-6 months?
I think the govt told them several times to sort themselves out.
had teh govt moved sooner a confrontation would have still happened. and then the type of mullahs going apeshyt in the country would be 20 fold.
valid question, why was the operation not started sooner, etc etc
but none of that changes that the outcome was the responsibility of fughazi and not anyone else. period.
The decision “when” to take action did not come from ‘jawans’ who actually executed the plan, it came from the government (several levels higher than the jawans)… we are proud of the jawans who participated and completed the operation: YES, are we proud of govt that it waits for danda: Not really.
Yes thats what I am asking. And based on your assumption Musharaf was wrong and so were the people at LAL Mosque.
Based on this Musharaf will always get the blame and rightly so…why?
Because its a case of law and order. If you fail to have a law and order you don’t deserve to hold that position.
Anyway I am too confused to blame who’s fault is it based on the following 2 points.
Ghazi sahib was wrong the way he tried to impliment Shariah law (I could be wrong Allah :swt: knows best but its my opinion Ghazi sahib took the wrong path)
Musharaf sahib was late and wrong the way he handled all this.
As per the Hadith…good people depart this world earlier and the bad people get more chances. (Allah :swt: unke rusi dheeli kar detay hain…He losen up their rope)
Now the way I understand this Hadith is that Allah :swt: give more time more chances to bad people so they can come to the right path. Its like abey sudhar ja warna bohat pachTao gay.
What ever the case Allah knows best and I pray to Allah :swt: to take care of my beloved country Pakistan and help us all to be on the right path.
indeed every thing is going strange .yesterday qazi saab told in a press conference that mushy is a lier the casulties are more than 1000 ,and there are more than 3 bodies in one coffin …jiss mai mard aurat ki bhi tameez nahi ki:eek:if i am lying then musharaf should prove me wrong and tell the exact figure and give permission to open the coffins.plus there is no list of wounded who were admitted in the hospital.
so i am all confused.ALLAH Mian pakistaniu aur pakistan kai haal pai raham farmain:(
Well, in the end Musharraf did maintain the law and order by removing the criminals.
I don’t think all ahadith can be applied in all situations, think about the MQM/police encounters back in 90s, in case the criminal (from MQM side died) do you think he was a good guy and police was bad guy hence got their death delayed? Not necessarily, right? We are in age of confusion where we can’t apply such rulings/ahadith clearly, we should leave such judgments to Allah.
