Pristine; this has been the most intense day I have spent on the net. I can't tell you how I feel. My head is about to bust open. I am going to step out for a sec. and grab some coffee.
Alibeta; I commend you for not behaving like them. Thanks.
Ok! This will be my last reply to this phadda. Jannu bhayee agar koyee ghalti hui ho Mu’af karna! I apologize if I have offended you in anyway. But I consider Salman Ahmed as a brother to me. And its my duty to protect the person I adore.
Lekin I just hate Pakistani people first listening to such pop icons and then ridiculing them. khare mitti pao! As I said, any ghalti mu’af!
gemini
keep smiling
United Kingdom
16 Posts Posted - 08/08/2001 : 18:46:02
whoa..this is intense..and only yest dat girl and i were thinking of topics to liven up the forum!lol
ppl chill out..there is no need to curse jannu sahib..is that what our traditions teach us.. to insult a person older than us. this person may not be entirely right..ok so salman used a word which should have been best avoided..maybe hell be more carefull next time if someone tells him..let the admin know maybe hell inform him..but other than that i c no issue to be arguing about.
and about the dancing bit well ive been to concerts where families want everyone to sit down..but i have to say its totally impossible to expect that in a concert!
Shamain
New Junooni
USA
18 Posts Posted - 08/08/2001 : 17:08:34
Hey Ali..thanks for trying to wake up this loser buddha frm his ignorance! iam glad u put all our comentary on the other board. I will be sure to chek it out.
Cheers to all of u that stuck up for junoon and defended Salman’s commentary!
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
u guys rok!!!
Cos’ the fearful always preyed upon your confidence
Didn’t they see the consequence?
They pushed you around…
The arrogant build kingdoms made of the different ones
Breaking them till they’ve become just another crown
And I have felt the same..
wow
Die Hard Junooni
USA
19 Posts Posted - 08/08/2001 : 17:27:31
I don’t understand a few things from you Uncle Jannu.. You claim that you were offended by the comments of Salman… Well I hope you know that we teenagers and adults are not the only ones that log onto this forum… My brother and his friend, for example, are 12 and 11 years old respectively… The comments that you have made in the previous few posts don’t seem to be too encouraging on the basis of morality… Performative contradiction… I do think so…
Now about some comments you have made… One argument that you seem adamant on is that Junoon should not have provoked dancing becasue the venue was not suited for such “a problem”. I am sory sir but I find this pretty hard to comprehend… What hazards are we talking about… Fire hazards… Health hazards… What dancing is going to cause a fire to start… or cause people to have a heart attack… Or is it just that there was not enough room… I personally don’t think that there is a huge problem if you dance in a concert hall which has seats. Ofcourse it is more preferable for an open area to exist but seats do exist in most of the concerts I have been to and although people don’t get as crazy as they do with Junoon they still dance… I mean I don’t understand what the major problem is… The only reason dancing wasn’t permitted in Miami, until Junoon defended us and instructed the promotoer’s not to stop us, was that the VIPs were having a difficult time watching the show… If that is the problem… I am sorry… Junoon never cares about such an issue and never will… That is why they have such a following of crazy diehard fans… I remember that concerts in Pakistan have been cancelled by Junoon because the management had a special VIP section and prevented people from dancing… Even if the concert hall makes it difficult to dance due to the presence of seats, I don’t think restricitons should be placed… No one if forcing you to get up and dance… Everyone is on their own account…
You have also stated that since Junoon is a Pakistani sufi rock band they should not encite the audience to get up and dance… Sir I don’t see the connection… We junoonis don’t think that since Junoon is a Pakistani sufi rock band we should listen to them like the Sabri Brothers (by the way I really liked them, I am just making a point)… There is no classification under which dancing should be allowed or not… It’s just whatever moves you to the occassion… For us, Junoon’s music is just as enticing as the Rolling Stones, U2, or the Beetles…
Lastly the response you gave in defense of Awaz… The reason I say that you can’t compare Awaz to Junoon is because they have never nor will ever be as popular… People live and die for Junoon, that never was the situation for Awaz… I am not claiming that they are a bad band… I personally like many of their songs… But their is no comparison… You are probably unaware of this and I don’t blame you… You have only seen these groups from the perspective of the American audience… We junoonis in the US are nothing compared to the devotion that is given to them in Pakistan and India… 40,000 people in New Dheli to attend their concert…!!! I am not criticizing anyone but Awaz never had that support… Also the music of Awaz was mellow and Pop oriented… Junoon is pure rock group… And to put such as restrictions as were put in Dallas, Miami, and Atlanta is pathetic… I understand that this is the fault of the promoters… But we junoonis are not going to pay the price for the ineptitude and mismanagement…
LittleLondon
New Junooni
United Kingdom
4 Posts Posted - 08/08/2001 : 17:31:11
Wow - this has shown a different side to many of the people who ususally post messages! It’s actually scared me a little! I know now not to ever speak against Salman Ahmad! Lol - I have to say that many of the responses to Jannu’s post have been irrational and unfair - it seems some of you aren’t even actually reading what jannu is saying. His point is that Salmans choice of words ‘ullu…’ were uncalled for - I can’t speak for all but in my community it is offensive to use such language. Those people who are calling Jannu a ‘bhuddah’ or other such names - come on, take it easy! This is something Junoons management should look into - perhaps hold concerts for the youth separate to ones for families? And of course think twice about venues - you don’t want a serious accident do you - like the one in Rosklide when Pearl Jam were playing - people died!
gemini
keep smiling
United Kingdom
16 Posts Posted - 08/08/2001 : 18:46:02
whoa..this is intense..and only yest dat girl and i were thinking of topics to liven up the forum!lol
ppl chill out..there is no need to curse jannu sahib..is that what our traditions teach us.. to insult a person older than us. this person may not be entirely right..ok so salman used a word which should have been best avoided..maybe hell be more carefull next time if someone tells him..let the admin know maybe hell inform him..but other than that i c no issue to be arguing about.
and about the dancing bit well ive been to concerts where families want everyone to sit down..but i have to say its totally impossible to expect that in a concert!
yeah we have some decent Mods here! But I dont know if he have some fair ones! lol! Actually no pristine! I think you are the only one who is kind of unfair. I mean look ar you! Now the two posts without images arent being closed down? Which I protested? And mine was closed down, just because you diverted the topic from my Girl Friend's picture to personal attacks?!?!
Khare aap khush raho Humari khare hay! As for Mods on junoon's website. The just started the new BBS. They are working on making people mods. As for now the webmaster is the only Mod and he doesn't have all day to moderate all the posts!
[quote]
Originally posted by Pristine:
**
Looking at some of the cut-and-pastes from the other site, I am glad we have some decent moderators on Gupshup.
I am looking at the way some 'Junoonis' choose to express themselves, and I am shaking my head. All jannu did was to put forward his honest opinion which incidently criticizes their demi god. Its no wonder their idol said the things he said. To each his own.
**
[/quote]
>>And mine was closed down, just because you diverted the topic from my Girl Friend’s picture to personal attacks?!?!
Murghay ki aik hee taang. I would have said something more, if I didn’t know you so well. 
And which two threads you want closed down? jannu’s thread is already closed and confused’s thread relates to your complaints about Image Gallery. And then you say, we are unfair. Maybe next time, I should try to be unfair to you just to prove you right. Some people are never happy.
ps. At 1:40 pm, you said, you don’t have time to respond, and you will respond when you come back. And since then you have just kept on complaining that the thread should be closed down. Now who is running away? Need I say more?
*>>Pristine; this has been the most intense day I have spent on the net. I can't tell you how I feel. My head is about to bust open. *
What can I say, jannu bhai? You were caught in janoonis (whats an appropriate translation? "insane"?).
I still admire your courage and patience which you displayed there, and that you held on so long in face of so much insults.
ooh hu hu heheh this thread has become pretty comical
put music down
put bands down
put their fans down
put mods down
while bringing other mods up
put uncle and aunties down for narrowmindedness
put the age/generation gap down
awesome work !!
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/ok.gif
i hope salman shows up
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/hula.gif
he does in the other fora. pir dekay gaiN agr usko pitaaee lagti hai ya nahi
oh and maybe we can get his thoughts on a female version of the band .. hmmmmm …
Aphro, Aphro…where were you? Are you implying anything 2 me? Well, I checked the site, nudge nudge, you kown…that site. Well I just got home after 15 hours at work. checked to see what’s going on there.
Take a guess what happened in the last hour or two? Mr. Junoon replied. As a singer he applied a song to me, one of the low rated according to him, and then the reply.
Well, I gotta go and make my entrace on the stage.
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/hehe.gif
and get my $$$ kicked.
Here's a message from JNMGMT:
This topic has been brought to the notice of Salman who wishes to express
himself to the participants.
SALMAN RESPONDS:
"Uncle jannu" reminds me of the song "Kiss Ney Suna" on Junoon's Azaadi album.It's one of Junoon's most underrated songs but one which really spells out the truth about desis caught in the web of western bigotry and propaganda.
"kaha jo unhon ney,voh sub ney sunna"
"jo hum ney kaha voh kiss ney suna"
"koi yahaan apni zuban samjhe kahan"
"ghulami mein khush hain abhi doosron ki"
"kay rehtay hain jannat mein voh ahmaqon ki"
"na hi rasta koi inka,nahi manzil..."
My outburst in Dallas was due two reasons...1)The organisers had made no mention of the "no dancing,standing in the aisles" law in our mutual contracts,yet at the 11th hour they tried to force us to tell the audience to sit down
not because of any fire hazard or danger to the other occupants but because the V.I.P.'s view was being blocked by the dancing Junoonis in the mosh pit.I told them that it's not the band's responsibility to ensure the vip's vision,as an organiser he was most welcome to come up on stage and make an announcement.That he didn't says volumes about his courage.What he did do was send a fire marshall on to the stage who told me that "if you don't tell these dancing monkeys to sit down,I'm going to pull the plug on you".As a person who has zero tolerance of bigotry of all kinds I was
shocked at the way he was abusing our fans,I challenged him to show me how the
dancing was causing a fire hazard,he had no answer but thinking that he was John Wayne sent to protect the sanctity of Texas from "the Injuns" he told me bluntly that if i don't tell these "monkeys" in their "own native language" to sit down and stop blocking the view of the VIP seats he would stop the show.I think had I met this guy on the street I would've knocked him on his ass.Even Brian felt so embarassed about this Racist american... So we had a choice either to walk off the stage or to continue...In the end we chose to carry on for all the Junoonis who had come from far and wide and spent hundreds of dollars just to see us live.When I spoke to the audience I was looking for an urdu equivalent for the word "racist Pig" for that fire marshall,Ulloo ka patha was the closest thing
that came to mind.Having seen our people suffer through the worst kind of discrimination(colonialism and the current western "terrorist" labels) I have very low tolerance of the redneck mentality.I was elected Ambassador for the U.N.
for my outspokeness on Human rights issues and not for being an ass licker of the West.Mr.Jannu I suggest you get out of Texas and visit Pakistan,30 years
away from your own native people is not a healthy sign especially in such a racially dicriminating state like Texas.They've got enough Uncle Toms,you don't need to become one yourself.
"khirad ko ghulami sey azaad kar"
"javanon ko Jannuon ka Ustad Kar"
Salamz ppls;
Got home after a 15 hr. day and logged in to chech this site after alibeta did not port the following messages on pak.org. He was doing a good job of it. He and I were going behind each others back. O.K. for the matter at hand:
This topic has been brought to the notice of Salman who wishes to express
himself to the participants.
SALMAN RESPONDS:
“Uncle jannu”
How old are you Mr. Ahmed? I am 36. So, how [d]old** are you? To me you look like you are around 35-37. Uncle? Ummm…what gives you the idea that I am an uncle? I think your PR folks told you such?
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
))
reminds me of the song “Kiss Ney Suna” on Junoon’s Azaadi album.It’s one of Junoon’s most underrated songs but one which really spells out the truth about desis caught in the web of western bigotry and propaganda.
“kaha jo unhon ney,voh sub ney sunna”
Well, I am on your site so every one listened.
“jo hum ney kaha voh kiss ney suna”
If you keep talking nonsense, looking back at the posts - not you, then I listened amusingly.
“koi yahaan apni zuban samjhe kahan”
zuban of reason? sanity? I am lost. You might be right.
“ghulami mein khush hain abhi doosron ki”
I escaped the ghulaami of those in Pakistan…as many a sane person has done so living in the west.
“kay rehtay hain jannat mein voh ahmaqon ki”
Don’t believe so. These ahmaq give a chance for others to live, eat, and prosper.
“na hi rasta koi inka,nahi manzil…”
Bhayya, YahaN par haiN to zindagi hai, us say ziadah apna mazhab bacha hua hai. Raasta aur manzil seedha qabar ko jaata hai.
My outburst in Dallas was due two reasons…1)The organisers had made no mention of the “no dancing,standing in the aisles” law in our mutual contracts,yet at the 11th hour they tried to force us to tell the audience to sit down not because of any fire hazard or danger to the other occupants but because the V.I.P.'s view was being blocked by the dancing Junoonis in the mosh pit.I told them that it’s not the band’s responsibility to ensure the vip’s vision,as an organiser he was most welcome to come up on stage and make an announcement.That he didn’t says volumes about his courage.What he did do was send a fire marshall on to the stage who told me that “if you don’t tell these dancing monkeys to sit down,I’m going to pull the plug on you”.As a person who has zero tolerance of bigotry of all kinds I was shocked at the way he was abusing our fans,I challenged him to show me how the dancing was causing a fire hazard,he had no answer but thinking that he was John Wayne sent to protect the sanctity of Texas from “the Injuns” he told me bluntly that if i don’t tell these “monkeys” in their “own native language” to sit down and stop blocking the view of the VIP seats he would stop the show.I think had I met this guy on the street I would’ve knocked him on his ass.Even Brian felt so embarassed about this Racist american… So we had a choice either to walk off the stage or to continue…In the end we chose to carry on for all the Junoonis who had come from far and wide and spent hundreds of dollars just to see us live.When I spoke to the audience I was looking for an urdu equivalent for the word “racist Pig” for that fire marshall,Ulloo ka patha was the closest thing that came to mind.
Mr. Ahmed, well, thank you for setting the record straight. Clearly, now that you have defined the situation, the onus was on the shoulders of the organizers, both national and local to ask the audience to take their seats. In retrospect, you did what you thought was applicable at the time. For the people, not having known what had transpired behind the scenes and, yet, no explanations forthcoming even from the organizers to date, you were in the wrong for saying such a thing. Regardless of the situation as you described, for someone of your caliber to hold the stage and the audience’s attention it does not behoove you to say anything like this given the fact that there were women and children present. I have been told very clearly here that the culture of Pakistan is such that nowadays even 3 yr. old can be found walking around saying such things. Somehow I doubt that. My, and others, whole contention is on your use of this wording. I agree that this is the most blatant harrassment and a case of degradation. The organizers should file a BBB report on the hotel for the use of such language. A letter should be written to the city of Dallas, Texas Atorney General’s office, Consumer affairs department in Washington and the ACLU. That organizers would take such a step is something I seriously doubt. This something I will look into.
But what’s hapened has happened. Memories can not be replaced nor wiped away. But I agree with you that what happened was utterly disgusting and, after hearing you, I feel spite for the local organizers… I will be sure to let them and others know.
Having seen our people suffer through the worst kind of discrimination(colonialism and the current western “terrorist” labels)
Much of it caused by our own actions first and, second, unintelligent reactions to counter what we think threatens us.
I have very low tolerance of the redneck mentality.I was elected Ambassador for the U.N. for my outspokeness on Human rights issues and not for being an ass licker of the West.
Be that as may be, as a public figure, you know this more then I do, you will pay a price for your showing your weaknesses when you use profanity. Now that, you are selected UN Ambasador you would be under a bigger microscope. As long as you are a public figure, you are open to greater scrutiny then anyone else.
Mr.Jannu I suggest you get out of Texas and visit Pakistan,
Yup, dream of doing that.
**30 years away from your own native people is not a healthy sign **
It has kept us alive, kept our faith more intact. Live in a more Islamic country.
especially in such a racially dicriminating state like Texas.They’ve got enough Uncle Toms,you don’t need to become one yourself.
Pakistan is full of Uncle Toms. Those are the ones I am trying to stay away from. You have fame, you have money, you have protection, you have the life. You don’t have the misery of the average man. You can not understand what life is below the ground you walk on. you can not understand what it feels like to be robbed by the police in your own home, you can not understand what it feels like to bribe a rikshaw to take you home in the evening, you can not understand what it feels like to hear to "put the bribe in the drawer…I can’t touch it, it’s time for my namaaz’, you can not understand what it feels like to do business with pakistan and having to eat a loss of RS. 50,000 and loose prospering home-business because I did not want to give Rs.7,000 in rishwat to have my stuff transported over, you can not understand what it feels like to live under utter fear of the wrath of Allah (sbwt) on the land of Muslims who engage in open and forced system of bribery, you don’t understand the fear of being killed because you are hanafi, in a sufi silsial and mohajir by birth which means that you are really a Pakistani. I think I will stop here. Mr. Ahmed you are living in a much safer environment then most can’t even dream of.
“khirad ko ghulami sey azaad kar” (Don’t know what khirad means)
“javanon ko Jannuon ka Ustad Kar”
Not having paisa for rishwat and no high names in the family, we decided to move to U.S. to stay free of ghulaami. Go around and ask in Karachi who doesn’t think they are living in ghulaami. You wouldn’t understand this sentiment, Mr. Ahmed…not if you or your parents did not come from India. Otherwise you are considered agents of RAW. Mr. Ahmad, don’t become the Ambasador for Aids, become the Ambasador for humanity. Lot more people die of inhumanity then Aids.
Good riddence to you, Mr. Ahmad. You have let me know your thoughts and I have done likewise. I wish you continued success in life. I am truly glad that you are using the modern approach in the footsteps of the foregone sufis to bring masses closer to God. God know, it’s people like them and you who have brought Islam to the majority of the people in the world.
I was at the concert with my family and we had one of the best, memorable, evenings in memory. I hope to see you and your group around for times to come. I have come across very harsh, I admit, and that on the very site for Junoon. By the tidal wave of obscenity you are the only person so far who hasn’t spoken any profanity on my thread. I think people should learn from you, right?
Like you said:
“jo hum ney kaha voh kiss ney suna”
“kaha jo unhon ney,voh sub ney sunna”
Again, thank you for the time you have given from your valuable schedule to come here and set the record straight. Like I said, I will do my meager best to let people know the dirty tricks played on you and, definitly, the city and state authorities for the way the hotel security delt with you.
Good luck and Khuda Hafiz, Mr. Ahmed
Jannu
Great and interesting discussion guys
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/ok.gif
alibeta, pristine and jannu bhai…well we all know now that wat exactly took place in dallas that night…
i think it was very big of salman ahmed himself to come up and explain and enlight us with the situation/incident in that very concert..
havent read all the posts though…but though its clear that everyone had a different view about the incident depending from what angle they’re seeing it from…
and as ali bhai said…we are only humans, aint no robots.
btw loved the uncle tom part
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/hehe.gif
i strongly feel that if one of us had experienced the same incident with that yankee texas sheriff out in the street or similar…we all wud’ve smacked him around like salman said…you dont just let a person go away with such remarks, unless ya are a person with an undefined level of patience
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/wink.gif
jaanu bhai…no doubt that its true but yet sad what ya shared about, concering the bribe etc and other corrupt system back in Pakistan…
i believe we all have gone thru such phases in our lives..maybe salman ahmed himself too before he got famous ya know…
such things are found in every society, jannu bhai..at very apparent and discrete levels..even in these high class human right pillar wanna bees western countries…it just happens to be at a higher level..
anyways…inshaAllah May Allah bestow the best form of Imaan, health, manners, respect and His blessings and mercy upon us all.
Carry on the Great work Salman/Junoon
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/ok.gif
you guys RAWK the Earth
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/clown.gif
When this body is destined to face death, then let it die in the best way as a ~Martyr~ in the way of your Creator.
Salman bhayee Second Reply to Jannu Uncle!
JNMGMT
Junoon Management
5 Posts Posted - 08/09/2001 : 04:53:04
SALMAN RESPONDS:
I hate to continue this silly debate but your total ignorance of my life
as an artist in Pakistan is a revelation.What makes you think that Junoon has had a free ride.We’ve had to work our asses off to make a name for ourselves
in a country where there is no protection of copyrights,we’ve been banned
by fascists like Benazir Bhutto and Nawaaz sharif for singing songs like “ehtesaab”.Ali and I were labelled RAW agents when we spoke against nuclear proliferation and tried to promote peace in the subcontinent.The difference between you and us is that we choose to remain and fight for our rights and
not run off to a far away land to become armchair critics of Pakistan.
Your belittling of the artists shows your ignorance
against my fraternity and although I forgive you for it you should understand
the hurt you cause our fans with your ignorance.
I don’t hold anything against you,being comfortably numb in Texas, how could you know any better…
by the way, staying and facing my problems saved me from cynicism especially when I see that our enemies(benazir and Nawaaz) can’t even enter their own land for fear of being strung up.
Peace
Salman
Another Reply by Salman Ahmed bhayee!
SALMAN RESPONDS:
On a lighter note I was watching this movie suggested to me by Sayonee,it's
called Lagaan.It's about a cricket game in British India between the natives and
the British.I could've sworn that fire marshall in Texas must've had ancestry which lived in India, he looked exactly like the captain of the british team (lol)There was another character by the name of "Laakha" who was a typical
snivelling local sucking up to the british because of his jealousy...
Why can't Pakistanis shed their cynicism?I know life is tough and unfair
but does it make it any easier by having a negative attitude.I read an exellent short story with sufistic leanings titled "the Alchemist".It's by Paulo Coehlo
and it's dead inspiring maan!So much of what has happened in my life is a parallel to this Santiago character.I really recommend it all you Junoonis.
You also HAVE to see the movie "Almost Famous" for a complete laugh and a little truth as well.Once you see it we'll discuss it on the forum with Uncle Jannu!
ciao
I loved Salman's first reply! I have blind faith in my hero! I knew he had an explaination!
I hope this answers your questions Muzna!
Ali,
Yes, it did answer my questions. I am quite glad that I wrote to management and asked Salman to make an appearance.
After reading his views I have to say that I am disappointed. I do not object to any of the feelings of patriotism, self-esteem and pride. I take serious exception to the manner with which he chose to handle the situation. Not only at the time during the concert, but also now.
I would have expected someone that professes to have such high standards to have behaved in an entirely professional manner. He didn't.
Perhaps more later.....
Somehow I had the feeling you wouldnt be satisfied by Salman's answer?
There is a muhawaraa in urdu! " Roothay kuoon ho! Nahi humari shakal hi aisi hay!
Never satisfied! Chaahay kuch bhi ho jaye!
[quote]
Originally posted by Muzna:
**Ali,
Yes, it did answer my questions. I am quite glad that I wrote to management and asked Salman to make an appearance.
After reading his views I have to say that I am disappointed. I do not object to any of the feelings of patriotism, self-esteem and pride. I take serious exception to the manner with which he chose to handle the situation. Not only at the time during the concert, but also now.
I would have expected someone that professes to have such high standards to have behaved in an entirely professional manner. He didn't.
Perhaps more later.....
**
[/quote]
Latest posts from the Junoon forum. The last post is very interesting where Jannu said that he is going to be discussing this with a lawyer?
So jannu bhayee, do you plan to sue Junoon?
Duniya
New Junooni
Canada
14 Posts Posted - 08/09/2001 : 08:03:52
Wow!..overnight this page turned into a 3 page essay!
So Salman seemed to have clarified everything. I’m sure Mr.Jannu isn’t all that bad, but I think now, it is clearly he who is unable to accept that he was wrong. It wasn’t Salman Ahmad’s use of “profanity”–because to be quite honest, we all find ourselves swearing when the occasion calls for it, and for everyone that knows me, I’m as decent as they get. Enough of the self-flattery, I just thought it was important to point out that Mr.Jannu’s argument lost its basis after we were informed (by Salman himself) that the dancing was stopped not due to any hall fire restrictions, but because of some power-tripping individuals in the VIP seats, who couldn’t bear to the real fans enjoying themselves.
gemini
keep smiling
United Kingdom
20 Posts Posted - 08/09/2001 : 08:10:49
Mr jannu..u really need to make a trip to Pakistan. It does have its share of problems ..like any other 3rd world country..but it is not asn grim as u put it. and anyway there r people over there who r courageous enough to fight against the system..wether they win or lose is something different but atleast they dont leave Pakistan, sit in a foreign land and comment on how things should be!
I
Duniya
New Junooni
Canada
14 Posts Posted - 08/09/2001 : 08:30:34
Just had to say…to what Salman said:
I don’t think its fair to describe all Pakistani’s abroad
as people who ran “off to a far away land to become
arm-chair critics of Pakistan”. I’m sure he didn’t mean to generalize,
but still. There are more than a 100 million people who reside
within the borders of Pakistan, and still they seem to be doing everything but
helping their country prosper. The point is, you don’t have to live in a
particular place to vouch for you committment to a worthy/noble cause,
there are many a worthy causes in the West…like spreading and
inspiring altruism and charity through Islam. Many of us are Pakistani byd
decent, but it is not our only obligation. As I’ve said before, there are
enough ass-wipes out there in this world for us to rally against…truck loads in the West, and truck loads in Pakistan…its not WHERE you live that makes you a good person…but rather HOW you choose to live.
THE END
jannu
New Junooni
USA
24 Posts Posted - 08/09/2001 : 09:14:26
Hey guys, I am trying to work on some of what I told Salman. The website for
one of the local organizer is: http://www.desimasalaradio.com/home.htm
There is no email or contact listed. However, there is a 800 number that can be accessed free of charge from U.S. Those in Europe will not be able to call this number. Unless you use Net-to-phone facility and access the 800 number.
There is another silent partner with Rehan whose contact information I will list.
I am going to be contacting a lawyer to discuss this situation and see what his ideas are. I will come back with more.
Just one request: Don’t be rude but be persistent. Nuf said. You know what I mean. Otherwise all will be for naught.
Later,
jannu
[quote]
Originally posted by AliBeta:
**Somehow I had the feeling you wouldnt be satisfied by Salman's answer?
There is a muhawaraa in urdu! " Roothay kuoon ho! Nahi humari shakal hi aisi hay!
Never satisfied! Chaahay kuch bhi ho jaye!
**
[/quote]
No Ali. You are wrong. I was satisfied by your answers wasn't I? You claimed that we would just agree to disagree and I said fine, I won't push anymore to get you to see what I am saying.
And I was not going to respond in this thread after you pasted Salman's reply....but when you asked I answered.
I knew that you wouldn't appreciate my response, but I wasn't about to lie and say yes I am satisfied.
Someday I will write about what I have seen of these performers....and I am not specifically talking about the Junoon group....I mean generally. I have been more involved than I care to share because I know that fans are blinded by their own "junoon". I think it's better to just let them learn the lesson on their own.
hmmmmmmm! Now charecter allegations! I know Muzna that you have been involved in arranging concerts and stuff. You might have an idea what goes on back there. I specifically remember you writing about Ali Haider. Khare number one thing. What they do in there private life is there own business and number 2, frankly I dont givea damn about Ali Haider.
But if you are talking about Salman Ahmed! Thats another topic! I have known Salman for a while now! As I can blindly say about Junaid Jamshed being totally clean, I feel the same way about Salman.
He is a very namazi perhaiz gaar banda. And I would recommend you to think twice before you start any allegations of moral values on Salman. Mind you! I am talking about Salman here not Ali neither Brian!
[quote]
Originally posted by Muzna:
** No Ali. You are wrong. I was satisfied by your answers wasn't I? You claimed that we would just agree to disagree and I said fine, I won't push anymore to get you to see what I am saying.
And I was not going to respond in this thread after you pasted Salman's reply....but when you asked I answered.
I knew that you wouldn't appreciate my response, but I wasn't about to lie and say yes I am satisfied.
Someday I will write about what I have seen of these performers....and I am not specifically talking about the Junoon group....I mean generally. I have been more involved than I care to share because I know that fans are blinded by their own "junoon". I think it's better to just let them learn the lesson on their own.
**
[/quote]
Ali,
Read my post again and tell me where I have made character allegations. Tell me where I have made any allegations at all.
In fact, if you have the presence of mind to recall, earlier in this thread and in the other bulletin board I referred to Salman's actions as "allegations" knowing full well that there are hundreds of witnesses to the incident. Why would I, now, come and make allegations which cannot be substantiated?
Furthermore, what you have heard from me is not by any stretch a full account of my involvement with the entertainment industry. And trust me, it's not restricted to Ali Haider. Not in the least.
Instead of jumping to conclusions, you might have considered spending a few moments to understand what I wrote. Let me spell it out for you dear....when I said that I know what goes on.....I meant that I know how negotiations take place between sponsors, organizers, performers and facility managements. I was referring to the logistics of show production. I was suggesting that I am aware of who is in control of what, what commitments are made and kept and who is allowed to do what. This includes the stipulations that are placed on the organizers by the hall management.
I meant that when I say Salman did not need to react with the profanity that he did, I know what I am talking about. (And frankly, using "colonialism" and subjugation as rationalizations for his behaviour was not very mature either. But that's neither here nor there.)
Now.....what made you instantly jump to defend Salman's faith? As far as I am concerned, that's his private life and therefore, is nobody's business. Whether or not he is namazi or parhaiz-gaar is between him and Allah, I will not judge his character by that. (It's laughable that when someone is doing something distasteful in their private life we are told that we shouldn't care about it, but when they are praying it should be used as a measurement of their piety! Ludicrous!) So don't give me examples from his personal life as references....spare me.
Alibeta, you haven’t been playing fair, have you? You have decided to over look my responses. Ali Azmat has said what I wanted to hear. I will not take that as an apology but he said said that greater caution needs to be taken… read his post and post it. I will be posting, here, to fill the gaps you have left. Ch…Ch…Ch… Shame on you
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/kiss.gif
Alibeta. More later… I have spent the last 24 hrs. totally immersed in this matter.
I have only one person to thank to give me the courage and the direction to do what I did and that is Aphrodite. Aphrodite is a person who I …jannu key under ka insaan: abay koi podium peh khaRa hai jo shuru ho gaya…Aphro ko line mat maar, do Takay haath peh rakh day gi. Bus ab chup…