Jews . .

Society Religion & Philosophy
41

[quote]
Originally posted by Ace:
Dear **doctornaveed-

Before you go on making more judgements regarding me

u r the one making judgements ABT ME AND INDIAN MUSLIM not me .i call u ignorant because u ignore the facts

  • please be kind enough to answer my post (WHICH WAS MY INITIAL POST AND NO ONE HAD BOTHERED ANSWERING IT BUT HAD INSTEAD POSTED A LARGE BUNCH OF SO CALLED FACTS)

i gave u my criteria for coming to a conclusion and admitted that i donot fulfill it.i asked the readers to find their own conclusions

*Dear brother- talking about logic, can you tell me what this logical 'attitude' of yours will get you?

mine is simple fact AS COMPARED TO UR SLOGAN OF LOGIC and i clarified that before u can dosomething u have to be sure abt the meaning of the specific word used in the verse in arabic NOT ENGLISH TRANSLATION

How does this hate benefit you?

told u before i dont hate them or anybody except my aunty lol so -fact-useless question
hanging onto it implies i am a liar

fellow muslims?

knowledge

this world?

do u know the future.or u want to remain ignorant

Now talk logically and tell me "WITH FACTS" about how this hatred has helped the muslim ummah throught history. *

can hatred evr benefit.again in ur delusional mind u confuse me with the prejudiced hatefilled ppl who blame others.i have already givenu my understanding abt it

Now please answer this for me- It was the initial question in the thread. And from there on we'll proceed.**
[/quote]

plus dear bro i donot wantto proceed

u do not qualify for an intellectual discussion.the rules of which r
1)listen completely
2)dont judge
3)elaborate with logic not name calling
4)provide facts
5)u have to have an appropriate knowledge of the subject

u failmiserably but who cares ,i am a poormisguided soul who does not want a medal from u or anybody.

my immaturity is evident from the fact that i am commenting again which is a waste of time.so maybe iamnotin ur league

ur comments r summarized thus
1)blah this blah that
2)pre judging
3)failing to provide any facts

It is He Who shows you His signs, and sends down provision to you out of heaven. But none pay heed save those who turn unto Him repentant. (Surah Ghafir: 13

i realize my mistake.i shud have thought abt allah and his creations andnot bothered replying

adios brother i acknowledge my immaturity and take my leave like a coward slinking away in the darkness

42

doctornaveeed, congrats, you are a perfect example of a cave Muslim. You are blind to reality.

43

[quote]
Originally posted by Faraz Mir:
doctornaveeed, congrats, you are a perfect example of a cave Muslim. You are blind to reality.
[/quote]

Care to elaborate on it O guided one???????

Or else, do not fall in the steps of Ace .

44

[quote]
Originally posted by Faraz Mir:
doctornaveeed, congrats, you are a perfect example of a cave Muslim. You are blind to reality.
[/quote]

BEHOLD

the paper tiger and ace backup speaks

IMMATURE HYPOCRITICAL naveed happy with being wat he is.SMOKES TO CELEBRATE BEING RECOGNIZED BY A BACK UP

45

SEE I CAME BACK TO COMMENT

I AM IMMATURE LOL

AND U R QUARELLING WITH AN IMMATURE PERSON MR NON-ORIGINAL-ACE-BACKUP

THAT SPEAKS VOLUMES ABOUT U

ACE IS ATLEAST WORTHY FOR CONVERSATION

I MEAN AS COMPARED TO U

46

I think by reading through this thread, it seems that “Ace” is making sense

         BUT

Other seems to be fixated in thought devolpment!
take it easy guys.

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif

47

SIR I AM JUST AN IMMATURE ILLOGICAL HATE FILLED CAVE MUSLIM.WAT DO I KNOW EXCEPT SOME FACTS

WHICH NOBODY REFUTES .SO COMICAL.THEY R FIGHTING WITH MY WAY OF THINKING.SO COMICAL.I SPEAK WIHT FACTS. IT IS FAJAR TIME.I AM GOING TO OFFER MY HYPOCRITICAL PRAYERS WHILE THE OTHERS R OUT PROBABLY LOOKING FOR FACTS OR SEETHING FOR THE LACK OF IT.EVEN THE SPARE TYRE BACK UP IS ABSENT.

MAY NOBODY IN THE WORLD REMAIN WITHOUT ALLAHS BLESSING.

GOOD BYE SAYS THE CAVE MUSLIM

[This message has been edited by doctornaveeed (edited April 08, 2002).]

48

I read an excellent letter on what cave Muslims are. If I find it I will post it for your reading pleasure dr. naveed.

49

We as muslims should take responsibility for our religion, not shove it all on the jews or someone. That was the purpose of the thread. I am not a jewish ally (as many of you seem to think), I'm against any force that hurts a muslim. I just want all of us to know that bettering our religion is our own responsibility. Bashing jews in no way betters us.

The point has been lost on many of you, and I will not spend the next five pages debating it.

Brother doctornaveed- You say that you haven't said anything regarding me? I guess I dont even have to expand on that one. Look at your posts- they're downright insulting and arrogant.

And when I said that our downfall is because of YOU and the media- I wanted us to understand that blaming the media and the jews will never help us. And by "YOU" I meant the wider audience of gupshup which would read the post.

Maybe if you guys re-read your posts- you'll see how accusing you people were. Jazaka'llah Kher all.

50

This thread has turned into a perfect Religion forum flooders!

Ace - sorry I didn't have the time to go through all the discussion, but have they successfully made you an agent working for the Jews big 1000 year plan? If not, then just wait, they will be coming to that conclution pretty soon! :)

[quote]
naveed lights a Benson and starts typing and says ahan of course i am a gentile
[/quote]

And Dr. Naveed, the other day someone sent me a forwarded message saying Benson was owned by a Jew! So, next time you lit up that cigarette, remember you are filling your lung's into a Jew's pocket! ;-)

[This message has been edited by ahmadjee (edited April 08, 2002).]

51

[quote]
Originally posted by Chaltahai:
What a load of crap!! You are all jealous, because jews are successful, intelligent, favor education over rhetoric and have done fabulously well in every facet of life. Your conspiracy theories and hateful remarks only show your depravity and impotence.
[/quote]

WELL SAID. now i would ask u to go to ISRAEL and enjoy the prosperity there..

why wasting time here, with patheitc muslims, who are ignorant and GENITLE

Thanks..

Dont think "you can" know "you can"
.::. ¢¼ ﷲ ﻼﺃ ﷲﺃ ﻶ ¢¼ .::.

52

I don’t think giving another viewpoint in face of rabid rhetoric is wastin gmy time.

Are you sure you mean Genitle or maybe Genital or even Gentile?

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif

53

It's been amusing watching this thread de-rail off the subject and then get back on track and again de-rail and so forth.

The fact is that Doctornaveed is CORRECT in his analysis, because the Qur'aan clearly states that the Jews are the Greatest enemies of Islam:

  1. Strongest among men in enmity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and Pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, "We are Christians": because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant.

060.001 O ye who believe! Take not my enemies and yours as friends (or protectors),- offering them (your) love, even though they have rejected the Truth that has come to you,.......

Unfortunately for the so called 'moderates', the Qur'aan is NOT wrong!!!!! Sorry to burst your bubbles.

It is very true that Jews are successful, but it is also true that Muslims have been successful for donkeys years. We cannot stereotype a whole nation, but the fact remains that the MAJORITY of Jews are enemies of Islam and always have been. That why up to this day they haven't accepted Muhammed SAWS as the Last Prophet and are still awaiting for the Messiah! Which they believe must come from their race!

The Jews still believe that they are the chosen race, which at one time was actually True. But the Qur'aan has confirmed that they are now the cursed race and not the chosen:

002.047 Children of Israel! call to mind the (special) favour which I bestowed upon you, and that I preferred you to all other (for My Message).

045.016 We did aforetime grant to the Children of Israel the Book the Power of Command, and Prophethood; We gave them, for Sustenance, things good and pure; and We favoured them above the nations.

  1. Allah did aforetime take a covenant from the Children of Israel, and we appointed twelve captains among them. And Allah said: "I am with you: if ye (but) establish regular prayers, practise regular charity, believe in my apostles, honour and assist them, and loan to Allah a beautiful loan, verily I will wipe out from you your evils, and admit you to gardens with rivers flowing beneath; but if any of you, after this, resisteth faith, he hath truly wandered from the path or rectitude."

  2. But because of their breach of their covenant, We cursed them, and made their hearts grow hard;....

027.076 Verily this Qur’an doth explain to the Children of Israel most of the matters in which they disagree.

027.077 And it certainly is a Guide and a Mercy to those who believe.

Finally, just to keep some members of the Forum happy, please digest the following:

002.062 Those who believe (in the Qur’an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.

54

[quote]
Originally posted by ahmadjee:
This thread has turned into a **perfect Religion forum flooders!

Ace - sorry I didn't have the time to go through all the discussion, but have they successfully made you an agent working for the Jews big 1000 year plan? If not, then just wait, they will be coming to that conclution pretty soon! :)

the other day someone sent me a forwarded message saying Benson was owned by a Jew! So, next time you lit up that cigarette, remember you are filling your lung's into a Jew's pocket! ;-)

[This message has been edited by ahmadjee (edited April 08, 2002).]**
[/quote]

double policy?

someone sent me a forwarded message
comment
1)heresay on heresay. did u confirm or just posted the heresay and then concluded by this remark that shows u believe in it
So, next time you lit up that cigarette, remember you are filling your lung's into a Jew's pocket! ;-)
2)allah gave u the oppurtunity, the brains,the responsibility and made u the moderator.is it not ur responsibility as the responsible moderator to post after confirming with the facts
3)i thought this problem of not researching the facts was prevalent in backward pakistani muslims only

55

Yeah, and many times when Jews fill up their gas tanks they help build another mosque, so give it a better look. What other holdings are posessed by the wealthy Arabs? Get real.

56

doctornaveeed,

It was a sarcastic comment, if you didn't get it, then try working on your sense of humor. Maybe lite up another Benson that might help you clear you thoughts a little.

And lets leave the 'you are moderator' stuff out the door. I am moderator of Cafe forum. In this forum I am like any other guppie, who has rights to express his views whichever way he wants.

57

"The fact is that Doctornaveed is CORRECT in his analysis, because the Qur'aan clearly states that the Jews are the Greatest enemies of Islam"

The Prophet (PBUH) was talking about the Jews that opposed him during his life. Surely he did not intend for all Muslims everywhere to fight Jews, and to hate them just to hate them. Look at all the Muslims that are dying because of that hate.

58

[quote]
Originally posted by Tiddah:
**"The fact is that Doctornaveed is CORRECT in his analysis, because the Qur'aan clearly states that the Jews are the Greatest enemies of Islam"

The Prophet (PBUH) was talking about the Jews that opposed him during his life. Surely he did not intend for all Muslims everywhere to fight Jews, and to hate them just to hate them. Look at all the Muslims that are dying because of that hate.**
[/quote]

Doth my eyes decieve me? Someone actually got the point.

59

I would hold the middle ground. There is ample evidence from the Quran and the Sunnah that the Jews are going to perpetually be the enemies of Muslims. But to the best of my knowledge, Muslims ever since the early days of Islam have never been the first to initiate conflict with Jews - we have always been provoked by them.

I have never seen an account of the Prophet (saws) or his Companions (RA) simply deciding to attack Jews just because they are Jews. They were attacked for specific reasons. The Jews of Khayber were attacked because they kept breaking treaties with the Muslims and conspiring against the Muslims.

However, the fact that he fought the Jews at Khayber did not mean that Mohammed (SAWS) then fought all Jews. The Jews of Fadak, for instance, agreed a treaty to avoid conflict, whilst the Jews of Tihama sought to submit to Muslim rule.

Even then, the Prophet (saws) permitted the Jews of Khayber to run their land, taking half of the harvest, provided that they would leave whenever demanded - something that happened during the time of Umar (ra). Again, they were not exiled from the land simply for being Jews. They were exiled for having attacked a Muslim who travelled into their land.

Allah (SWT) instructs us to, when dealing with other communities, deal with them fairly and justly. So when we meet a particular community of Jews, we should treat them fairly, unless that particular community does something against us.

It is foretold that we will have future conflicts with Jews. This doesn't mean we should fight them just for being Jewish. Remember the centuries of peaceful co-existence between Muslims and Jews in Spain, and also under the Ottoman Khalifat when many Jews forced into exile were given asylum in the Muslim lands.

We should not go round generally bashing all Jews - we should only be critical of those who openly show hostility to Muslims and Islam. Those who give no sign of hostility, even though they are currently in the minority should be left alone; just as the tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of Jews living under Muslim rule for centuries we allowed to flourish under our protection.

Yes, I sincerely believe that we will perpetually find ourselves in conflict with Jews. However, I believe we are instructed to deal with them justly and only oppose them when they oppose us.

[This message has been edited by mAd_ScIeNtIsT (edited April 10, 2002).]

60

[quote]
Originally posted by ahmadjee:
***doctornaveeed*,

It was a sarcastic comment, if you didn't get it, then try working on your sense of humor. Maybe lite up another Benson that might help you clear you thoughts a little.

And lets leave the 'you are moderator' stuff out the door. I am moderator of Cafe forum. In this forum I am like any other guppie, who has rights to express his views whichever way he wants.**
[/quote]

glad to know that