Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
They had every right to attack, I hope they do again.
Israel only defended itself because it has its daddy and its supporters around the world. Ahem Ahem.
this debate has been done to the death in the political forum
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
^ and yet u're still here, supporting killing of innocent civilians.
What I don't understand is why I'm here trying to talk you out of it.
Keep supporting. Go you! pats on the back.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
What I don't understand is why I'm here trying to talk you out of it.
Keep supporting. Go you! pats on the back.
Listen, I understand your views.
I myself dont support what Israel is doing and Israel needs to stop the bombing of Lebanon and withdraw from West Bank.
But what you have to understand is when Hamas and Hezbollah launch these types of attacks, if Israel does not respond harshly, it will only invite Israel to be open to more attacks because neither Hamas nor Hezbollah recognize Israel and want to destroy it.
The time to destroy Israel is over. Israel is here and is going to stay.
Negotiate with Israel so that they withdraw from the West Bank and East Jerusalem.
The PLO and Fatah have accepted this.
Its time the broader Islamic world accept it as well.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
Negotiations are going to favor Israel and no one else. If they wanted peace, they would have withdrawn their forces already, but they don't want peace, they want power and control.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
and once they withdrew from southern lebanon, their soldiers got abducted and thousands of rockets are hitting their cities
withdrawing without a partner on the other side never works
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
But you have to understand, Hamaz and Hezbollah are not RADICAL MANIACS just pissed off at israel for no reason.
Hezbollah has two real and entirely legitimate grievances against Israel that are much larger than Israel’s grievances against Hezbollah.
First, Israel continues to hold Lebanese prisoners. Those are Prisoners of War (what do you call people held because they resisted an occupation if not POWs?) Hezbollah had repeatedly warned, for years, that if Israel did not release them, Hezbollah would have to seize some Israeli prisoners for an exchange. It is entirely believable that the seizure of the Israeli soldiers was in the works for months.
Anyone remember the POW hysteria of the 80’s in the US? The left behind stuff? Well this is the same, except that Hezbollah knows they’re in Israel. It’s not in question. What would you do to get your prisoners of war back?
Second, although Israel gave Lebanon some maps of the mine fields they left behind during the last prisoner swap, Lebanon and Hezbollah still don’t have maps to all of them. Which means people keep dying.
and about hezbollah being terrorists, Larry Johnson at No Quarter has said this:
"Hamas and Hezbollah attacked military targets–kidnapping soldiers on military patrols may be an act of war and a provocation, but it is not terrorism. (And yes, Hezbollah and Hamas have carried out terrorist attacks in the past against Israeli civilians. I’m not ignoring those acts, I condemn them, but we need to understand what the dynamics are right now.) Israel is not attacking the individuals who hit their soldiers. Israel is engaged in mass punishment.
How did Israel respond? They bombed civilian targets and civilian infrastructure and have killed many civilians. Let’s see if I have this right. The Arab “terrorists” attack military units, destroy at least one tank, and are therefore terrorists. Israel retaliates by launching aerial, naval, and artillery bombardments of civilian areas and they are engaging in self-defense. If we are unable to recognize the hypocrisy of this construct then we ourselves are so enveloped by propaganda and emotion that, like the Israelis, Hezbollah, and Hamas, we can’t think rationally. We can only think in terms of tribalism and revenge. "
source: http://www.shoutwire.com/viewstory/20618/Hezbollah_And_The_Rush_To_Judgement
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
But when it says on Hezbollah and Hamas mantra that they wish to destroy Israel, how can there be a prisoner exchange?
Thats like Nazi Germany and USA holding a prisoner exchange during World War II?
Why dont Hamas and Hezbollah recognize Israel's right to exist and after they sign a peace treaty they can negotiate for prisoners.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
They dont deny Israels right to exist, Israel denies Palestine right to exist.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
funny how people are being MURDERED there and here we don't back off from fingers pointing at each other while sittin on our butts on a comfy chair...tsk tsk on all of u!
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
wht have u done so far oh helpfull residrent of gr8 US-of-A…
mind to share ur heart-warming adventures where u single handed save the kidney of a dying arab while he was taking his last breaths…i’m sure that kidney must have found itself a good loving american citizen…ahh the possibilities are endless.i’ve heard organs of an arab are found to be of TOP QUALITY ONLY IF THEY ARE OUTSIDE THE BODY…:halo:
i hope israel finish it off this time whatever it started 20+years ago.1 less arab country…good for the world…:k:…
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
another Hitler on this board.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
saieen at least I am not sittin on my butt and throwing things off at people over the net 
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
u got to understand his way of being sarcastic :)
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
Combat means fighting...This isn't fighting...It's bombing cities and building in which innocent people live...
Ah, finally, you at least admit that killing of civilians not taking part in a combat is "killing of innocents" and should be condemned. No disagreement here. Israelis are committing crimes by attacking Lebanese civilians, whether it's deliberate aiming, or careless executation.
Let's just hope that you have the moral courage and honesty to express the same view next time a suicide bomb goes off at a civilian place in Israel too, or for that matter, in Pakistan, Malaysia, U.S.A, Britain of anywhere else. Too often I have seen you finding justifications and deflecting criticism when the attackers claim to be "muslims."
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
Quote an example & I will believe u. Y shouldnt he...??? This ntire world has become anti-Muslim, from canada to australia. If there is something known as self defense, then this is it. Name one sweet Muslim country that has bombed a mass jewish population, christian population, buddhist population, or any other religious population in terms of combat...??? NONE.
When governments become mere puppets, then the only viable solution left is in the hands of the learned himself.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
When governments become mere puppets, then the only viable solution left is in the hands of the learned himself.
with people like you pretending to be muslims, no wonder
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
When governments become mere puppets, then the only viable solution left is in the hands of the learned himself.
I am giving two example of violence done in the name of Islam, and here's your opportunity to condemn them and prove that you are consistent in your thinking:
(a) In all the beheading videos, the act is accompanied by shouts of 'Allah o' Akbar' which obviously gives the impression that it is being done in the name of Islam. Now you being a passionate Muslim that you seem to be, does your interpretation of Islam allow for such beheadings of people taken captive, civilians or not? 'YES OR NO' A long winded justification or deflection with moral relativism that 'this was the last resort' will be taken as YES.
(b) The 9-11 bombings for which Osama and his followers taken claim of on video, as well as the 7-11 bombings in London for which the bombers have taken claim of in videos shot before the attack, were presented as if they were being done in the name of Islam. Can you categorically say that they were against the teachings of Islam? No long winded justifications with moral relativism please. It either is a crime, or it isn't. Make up your mind.
I don't know you enough to guess how extreme you are in your thinking, but these so called jihadi criminals have deprived us of our ability to engage in peaceful protests about various political conflicts in the world. Their violent vigilantism has diluted the credibility of legitimate grievances of people stuck in various political conflicts around the world.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
The sad thing is, not only these violent viglantes have hijacked Islam, they also spew hatred toward Muslims who don't follow their violent ideology. It might not be too long before Lajawab makes an entry calling you or me a 'Mod Muslim' being fed by the Westerners, while conveniently forgetting where he makes his living and pays his taxes.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
(a) In all the beheading videos, the act is accompanied by shouts of 'Allah o' Akbar' which obviously gives the impression that it is being done in the name of Islam. Now you being a passionate Muslim that you seem to be, does your interpretation of Islam allow for such beheadings of people taken captive, civilians or not? 'YES OR NO' A long winded justification or deflection with moral relativism that 'this was the last resort' will be taken as YES.
(b) The 9-11 bombings for which Osama and his followers taken claim of on video, as well as the 7-11 bombings in London for which the bombers have taken claim of in videos shot before the attack, were presented as if they were being done in the name of Islam. Can you categorically say that they were against the teachings of Islam? No long winded justifications with moral relativism please. It either is a crime, or it isn't. Make up your mind.
I don't know you enough to guess how extreme you are in your thinking, but these so called jihadi criminals have deprived us of our ability to engage in peaceful protests about various political conflicts in the world. Their violent vigilantism has diluted the credibility of legitimate grievances of people stuck in various political conflicts around the world.
a) No. Islam condemns such acts and it not Islamic at all.
b) Killing innocent civilians is a crime. Islam teaches you not to attack women or elderly in war. Soldiers only.
Now, I have 2 questions for you. Short answers only please.
a) Did you meet those beheaders and confirmed their religion was Islam by giving them an Islamic test? How are you so sure that what media shows is true and they were really true practicing Muslims, not arabic speaking people taking Allah's name and beheading civilians. And don't tell me that militant group X claimed the responsibility and verified it. Anyone could start up (or make up) their militant group in the name of Islam.
b) This relates to my first question: Have you met Osama and had a first hand interview with him where he admitted that he's behind all these attacks and he is insane who's attacking civilians for no reason?
It ticks me off when people start believing everything media (western) feeds them.
Re: Israeli Defense Forces combat footage over Lebanon
a) Did you meet those beheaders and confirmed their religion was Islam by giving them an Islamic test? How are you so sure that what media shows is true and they were really true practicing Muslims, not arabic speaking people taking Allah's name and beheading civilians. And don't tell me that militant group X claimed the responsibility and verified it. Anyone could start up (or make up) their militant group in the name of Islam.
No I didn't meet them, and I shouldn't have to. They claimed (on video) to be Muslim by using Allah's name. As long as Muslims like you disassociate yourself from these acts, there's nothing to complain about then. It's not for us to decide who is a true Muslim or not. Those guys were apparently raised Muslims, they thought they were Muslims, and we don't care about that. All I want to hear from my fellow Muslims that such acts are not sanctioned by Islam. You apparently said it, congratulations.
[quote]
b) This relates to my first question: Have you met Osama and had a first hand interview with him where he admitted that he's behind all these attacks and he is insane who's attacking civilians for no reason?
It ticks me off when people start believing everything media (western) feeds them.
[/quote]
I don't need to meet Osama. He has released videos and audios condoning these attacks as well as claiming responsibility for it. NOw you may say that they were fake, and I'll give you answer to both of them.
(i) Tapes were real, Osama is responsible: All I want from you and fellow Muslims is to say that these acts are unacceptable and should not be done in our name.
(ii) Tapes were fake: All I want from you is to say that these acts were unacceptable and should not be done in our name.
I am happy that you don't condone violence. But let's also try to fix the problem with overwhelming majority of Muslims who present justifications, reasons, and background of these terrorist attacks. You want to save Islam and Muslims? Save it by disassociating your religion and yourself from acts that YOU KNOW aren't in line with the teachings of Islam. Imagine if someone went around the city robbing people in your name, wouldn't you want to actively denounce him and announce disassociation. These terrorist criminals (whoever they are) find ideological refuge among Muslims by using the name of Islam. We need to stand up against them, and not provide them this refuge.