Whoever says the Kalima is muslim …
Like a kafir was under the sword of a sahabi and he recited kalima , but the Suhabi still killed him . Hazoor SW did’nt like it and said " did you know what was in his heart when you heard the Kalima" …
Re: Islam is only for Allah swt?
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*Originally posted by sabah: *
Why is active understanding of Islam so strongly discouraged by so many ppl?
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Islam strongly encourages learning religion....
Quran and Hadith have enuff matter to justify that and i dont think any knowledgable muslim wud deny it....
so what exactly do u mean????
who is discouraging learning Islam????
the non-muslims????
Army, when I clearly write that active learning is discouraged by people, I most probably mean ppl and not religion, no? Keep non-Muslims out of focus for sometime, we, Muslims are discouraging others in learning and discussing. As an example, look at how you respond to a critical question on Islam.
One more thing which shows our insecurities and inability to understand and gracefully explain our religion, is our focus on all non-relevant issues than the core issue, such as how the question is composed etc. There's absolutely no reason for getting defensive while talking about Islam, that is if you truly believe that it is the best religion with answers to every question a man can think of.
getting defensive about Islam is perhaps the biggest mistake the muslims of the current period have done....
gave others a chance to attack more....
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*Originally posted by sabah: *
MQ, your 99.9 claim is wrong, I've studied in a Muslim school and I can put my money on my claim that 90% of parents don't even know how to explain why we do the most basic things we do without threatening. My point is not to insult Islam, I'd rather want us to understand that we need to follow a different approach. Islam is a beautiful religion and can be preached with love and respect. Our inability to understand and peacefully discuss Islam is disturbing.
"This is not true.A very few ,and I mean few people teach religion that way."
Wrong, else you wouldn't see so my ppl jumping up and down upon every tiny borderline query on Islam, and still failing to understand what the original question was about. My observation is based on one Muslim school, one mosque I went to and two mosques my bother is going to. Kids can not contradict as adults can so any mullah should be able to counter that. What do you think they can ask at most? Why do I have to wear scarf? Is that too difficult for a learned person to answer to, given that he's talking to a child?
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lol.Well actually I have studied at Muslim schools and have taught at a couple of Muslim schools , have been to more than ten mosques so I do have an idea of what Im saying.Again I am not wrong.Any parent who brings up hell, will bring up heaven with their child.I dont know what type of people you've seen.
Ah but should we not voice our opinions when generalizations are a bit askew? I very much believe that kids should be taugh properly about all aspects of our religion.In fact kids love to learn, I have noticed so, and they love to ask questions.In truth I have noticed, that parents often depend on the masjids "molvi" and such to explain all this to the kids when the kids go for regular Quran classes.Parents should make an effort to have hadith classes at home.I know many parents who send their kids tothe masjids for these because they themselves are too busy.
Kids have so many questions, that might not always be answered at the class.It would be best if parents took maybe an hour or so out everyday to sit down and teach their kids about their faith.
Muslim Queen
I totally understand what you are saying. People do send their children to Masjids and have Faith in the Molvis to educate the child. This can be for all sorts of reasons.
Unfortunately, not ever parent has studied Islam the way it should be or possess adequate knowledge to teach at home. Teaching Islam to the child is not just an hourly thing. Islam is a way of life and is involved in every aspect of our lives. When both parents are in cognito with each other and their deen is strong, teaching the child becomes easier. The same applies to single parents and orphaned children regardless of their guardian.
Fortunately, things are changing within the teaching methods and more children are actually being taught with Tajweed including the Arabic language, so that they can at least understand what they are reading and reciting.
I personally believe that if the parents or guardians are practicing Muslims, then teaching becomes all that much more easier and enjoyable. We can actually answer the questions in the first instance!
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*Originally posted by sabah: *
ANS, chaand pehle samajh tau lete ke maiN ne kya kaha. Here, let me explain. When you tell your kids to pray, you tell them what? Namaz paRho warna jahanum ki aag meiN jalna paRe ga. Now kids understand fire and pain, and this unfortunately sticks with majority till they die. Hence they'll never understand why Allah wanted us to pray...
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unfortunately thats human nature and applies to any other wlk of life including religion. let me give you examples
dont speed, warna TICKET MIL JAYEE GA
study, warna EXAM MAIN ZERO AAJAYEE GA
dont eat much fries warana motey ho jaoo gaay aur loog MOTA KAHEEN GAAY
chooree na kerna warna JAIL HO JAYEE GE
and i can keep on with the examples of daily life.
Now why dont we tell kids each time the after effect of speeding, not studying, not eating too much junk food etc ?
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*Originally posted by yarfraz: *
Whoever says the Kalima is muslim ....
Like a kafir was under the sword of a sahabi and he recited kalima , but the Suhabi still killed him . Hazoor SW did'nt like it and said " did you know what was in his heart when you heard the Kalima" ....
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do you know that there are actions with put a person beyond a pale of islam even if he recites kalima? the incident you mentioned is about we accept ppl as muslims when they say tehy are musilm as long as tehy do not show us by their actions that they are not muslim.
so is a person who goes and says that he /she will donate his /her first born to the grave of some saint if the saint gives him/her more children a muslim? you can consider him your brother in islam but he is not a muslim because he committed MAJOR shirk, asking a dead saint and giving him "mannat" (vowing on his name).
So 
Huzur :saw: wasn’t aware of what you just said?
When Huzur:saw: said " did you know what was in his heart when you heard the Kalima" … that means, no one except Allah has power to see what is in the hearts of people. And that is why no one except Allah has the power to declare someone ‘Muslim’ or ‘Kaafir’.
did i ever say that?
we dont say what in their hearts but WE DO say what we see. so if u see a kafir praying to a statue, do you say may be he is muslim in his heart? heck no, you say he is kafir.
when some one says kalima then we say yes he is muslim but if he goes and starts worshipping the dead he no longer is following the kalima he just recited which states that there is no ilah but allah, and he becomes kafir.
do you know about the sect named mujiah? read up on them for more information.
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*Originally posted by sabah: *
MM, I wasn't expecting you to either, want me to help or are you okay without the added knowledge?
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na its cool...
If someone truly wants to learn Islam then they shouldnt
be offended in the first place.. it's a learning process...
will add more..
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*Originally posted by ThandyMazaq: *
did i ever say that?
we dont say what in their hearts but WE DO say what we see. so if u see a kafir praying to a statue, do you say may be he is muslim in his heart? heck no, you say he is kafir.
when some one says kalima then we say yes he is muslim but if he goes and starts worshipping the dead he no longer is following the kalima he just recited which states that there is no ilah but allah, and he becomes kafir.
do you know about the sect named mujiah? read up on them for more information.
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And bin Laden being ...... ha .. you are gonna say A misguided MUSLIM or a Misleading Muslim or an Insane muslim ....
But still you are gonna give the last name of his description as muslim ... Are you gonna say "He is Kafir"? And Shia's acts in the eys of Sunnis being ........... And sunni's action in the eyes of shia's being ..... Ha ...... How ironic .. Action My Ass .... The act of Rasool nabiye karim ahmede mujtaba (SW)stays there ... How about Yazeed . He was a kafir or he was a Muslim of your description .... Dont give this $hit about some one being Kafir . If some one recites Kalima , Has a book named Quran is a muslim in my dictionary cuzz my dear Hazoor (sw) showed the best way to us .. How about Ismaili's or other sects Wahabis , barailvies , Ahmadis etc etc .. In each one's eye what are the other sects .. Kafirs or mis leading muslims ............ And you have a right to declare others kafirs ..... And yeah one other thing is being predicted that there are gonna be 73 sects near the end times ..... And only one is gonna be seperated and will be a true one and others are gonna be ............... lol and call me infidel now ...........
And one foot note .... I have seen Sunnis shias or what ever muslims going to peers and well and truely worshiping graves ... Just because they dont belong to one particular sect so you will probably gonna call them "Ignorant Muslims" ....... And you wont call them kafirs because you wont have a particular tribe to be blamed or you wont have a "Name" to be decalared as "Kafir"......
its the "cause and effect" thoery ..
you always take the worst possible situation and try to get away from it.. I want my kids to know what they will get themselves into if they dont' this and that
which statement would you tell your kid? (that will have MORE impact)
smoking is bad
OR
smoking kills you
i was never beaten or forced to pray .. i was led by example.. dad prayed so i joined him.. it made the habit for me ..
so much so that when i get tensed i just start praying no matter what.. it helps.. religion is fun my friend.. make it fun and IT IS A PART OF EVERYONES life even those who claim to have no religion..
trust me.. whenever we get into problems we remember Allah
:)
SISTER RAZEA SAID IT ALL >>>>
"" and you know what..its not all about jannat either. Prayer is the ultimate line of communication between you and God. i mean, God hears you no matter what, duh, but...when you get into..and i mean..get into it..you urself will feel that connection. if you pray salaat because ONLY because you HAVE to..then you are fooling urself. salaat is more then that. you should do it because you WANT to. because you NEED to. when kids are little, they don't always understand this. but you should always explain to them, that besides jannat and avoiding hellfire..your duas are going to someone who has laid down rules in life for you, in your best benefit. He is the one who will ALWAYS be there for you, no matter what. Even if things go wrong in life, and you think God has disappointed you..and its all over..it's not. That everything good and bad in life is a test. a test of faith. when you are praying salaat, you are praising Him for all He is..and for all He has made you, and in your duas..you can always ask for His help. I grew up thinking, if i pray..i will get what i want. that i should only pray if i want something really bad. and of course, if you want something, you should ask for it in your duas from God. and remember, everything God does for you, is in your best benefit. So if you get what you want, or if you don't get what you want, it was all decided in your best benefit. but to only pray when you need or want something really bad, is also essentially wrong. We must praise our creator at all times, and it doesn't take much out of my day..5 times..to praise Him. He is my ultimate caretaker, and my life is in his hands. Nobody but Him. Mentioning hellfire too many times, can just instill fear into the child, tell the child he should perform salaat not only out of fear..but mostly..out of love for Allah swt. Love, because He will always look out for what He created before we entered this life, in this life (whether in good times or bad), and of course after this life. ""
Bro, have a little respect for God, doesnt matter whose God ur talkin abt here. This is y everyone wants u 2 b banned. And u would hv been on any other forum but this one, since the admins here were spinless before and stubborn now. Just be a little more respcetful and honoring when talkin abt God n religion. Really, its just the basics of decency and morals which u fail 2 understand.
bin laden is a “misguided muslim” ?subhanallah…may allah guide us all and prevent us from accusing mujahids of being misguided.
any how, any one who worships graves is KAFIR, he is not misguided he is not “mislead” he is KAFIR.
you can come up with all sorts of crap about kalima being the only condition of islam but let me tell you one thing
If you ask them (about this), they declare: “We were only talking idly and joking.” Say: “Was it at Allâh, and His Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) and His Messenger (SAW) that you were mocking?” (At-Tawbah 9:65)
Make no excuse; you have disbelieved after you had believed. If We pardon some of you, We will punish others amongst you because they were Mujrimûn (disbelievers, polytheists, sinners, criminals, etc.). (At-Tawbah 9:66)
this ayat was revealed when some muslims made fun of muhammad :saw: and his companions. even though they were believers before they joked (in the ayah it is stated that you disbelieved after believing) but their joke took them out of islam, they still had the kalima. so brother before you defend grave worshippers please open your eyes to the fact that there are some things that make one get out of islam even with out their knowledge.
O you who believe! Raise not your voices above the voice of the Prophet (SAW), nor speak aloud to him in talk as you speak aloud to one another, lest your deeds may be rendered fruitless while you perceive not. (Al-Hujurat 49:2)
so the sahabas were told that all their deeds would be rendered useless if they raised their voices over the rasuls :saw: they had kalima didnt they?
yes sinners are not kafir, they are muslim but grave worshipper and ISMAILIS are kafir. i do not doubt that for a second. they claim that their imam knows when the day of judgement will happen and who so ever believs that is a kafir, infact any one who even believes that even muhammad :saw: knows when is the day of judgement is gonna happen is a kafir too.
So you did’nt declare Bin Laden A kafir yet … Yeah yeah good pace . Go On go On . Shias left or hmmmm Wahabis left … Thekay dar of Islam Sahib , Once I dould’nt control my bladder and pee’d under a tree … Fraz Kafir ?
Oh Com’on declare jihad against me . And what about yourself , You are farting in Public now … What does it make you
Huh
Evolution is not a mere theory any more nor a testimonial proven fact but a fact based upon circumstantial evidences.