…a country’s province legislature attempts to legalize discrimination? If it is not then what is it?
Re: Is it democracy when…
it is, if the constitution permits it.
Re: Is it democracy when…
So then the Pakistani constitution will be considered democratic because of its discrimination of Ahmadies?
Re: Is it democracy when…
this is like asking - sky is blue, so is my pencil sky because its blue.
Re: Is it democracy when…
No it isn’t. Its a simple case of legalizing discrimination. You stated if the constitution permits it, its democratic in nature. So i am asking does that work for Pakistan as well. You obviously will not say yes due to your own discriminatory views.
Here is the simple thing. You know I am referring to the 3 to 4 US states that have attempted to legalize discrimination against homosexuals. You are willing to defend that but when it comes to Pakistan you get your panties in a twist. Blind nationalism is like being a TTP supporter.
Re: Is it democracy when…
lol
Re: Is it democracy when…
Case in point.
Re: Is it democracy when…
give it a rest pal. read your post #3. makes no sense the way it is worded.
also, if you want to talk about US and homosexuals, why start with some crap about ahmedis in pakistan? 
Re: Is it democracy when…
Again case in point.
It’s a rather interesting question Zafra, and has at least 2 separate issues
1- what is right. By which scale or rules do we consider something acceptable or not.
2- if majority wants something, does it make it right, regardless of what is their logic/rationale to demand or support it.
Very tough questions in the context of democracy. For #2 I have always heard that if what the public is asking for is wrong then it’s the leaders’ role to educate the public and shape opinion and build support. Although even Greek philosophers wrote about the weaknesses of democracy in addition to all its virtues. Thus there are viewpoints that the level of impact an individual has is based on there level of knowledge etc, term used is meritocracy but that does not solve for the issue of regardless of who is voting, does a wrong thing become right if it gets a majority of votes.
#1 is what I struggle with all the time. What is right and what is wrong m. So for example, in US context why is struggle for legalization of marriage for homosexuals right but not polygamy? I don’t have an issue with either because it involves adults making decisions out of their free will,. Just like I can’t find a basis to oppose one, I can’t find the basis to oppose another.
What is happening in Kansas and was going on in Arizona until Brewer vetoed it was pretty lame.
Democracy is by no means a perfect system, in fact democratic system is more harmful in a society full of illiterates, than if it’s run through dictatorship or under a kingdom.
Re: Is it democracy when…
Good question.
There is no perfect. The discriminatory laws will be overturned. There are already dome States that allow gay marriage.
Who is leading the way? The much maligned liberals. Those who are champions of secular govt and equality for all.
Who is resisting it? The Right. Who go by Conservatives.
Is this limited to US? No. It is the liberals the world over who drag the backward looking conservatives forward. In every country.
So answer to you question. Is it a perfect democracy? No. Is it better today than it was even 2 years ago. Yes. 10 years ago? A resounding yes. 50 years ago? Are you kidding me?
Re: Is it democracy when…
^ I see the previous poster, had the same 1st sentence.
Respectfully disagree with the rest of the post. We tend to underestimate those who are illiterate. The power to change the govt. should rest with the people. Not with big brother. Something about people having their own elected union president?
Re: Is it democracy when…
what law is being made against ahmdies and in which province ?
Re: Is it democracy when…
The Pakistani constitution declares Ahmadis as non-muslims which perpetuates discrimination against them. Kinda like the issues of homosexuals in Russia.
What i find really interesting is that people actively blame Muslim countries for unequal rights regarding various minority groups. But when it happens in the US there is complete silence.
Telling.
Regardless X2 I completely agree that the will of the majority is always something that needs to be considered when it comes to minority rights. But when your elected officials are highly educated with a great deal of money that garner support from a democratic process yet wish to establish policies reminiscent of colonialism and slavery you really gotta wonder about the system in place.
The US is going down the path of the right far worse than Pakistan or most other third world countries. Uganda just criminalized being gay which begs the question which is worse.
Discrimination or criminalization.
I still finding it telling that nobody on GS brought it up when almost weekly there is a discussion of human rights abuse in Pakistan.
Re: Is it democracy when…
The term which is used for tyranny enacted through democratic means is “Dictatorship of the Masses”.
Most democracies have mechanisms in place to avoid this, though the mechanism only works in some of them - it is a supreme court that has the power to overturn democratic laws if found to be unconstitutional, ie to ensure that justice is always served regardless of democracy.
However, should the supreme court not be politically independent, it can often fail in its duty.
In theory, in an Islamic democracy, the equivalent safeguard is a court legislating on whether the government’s laws are Islamic in nature.
Re: Is it democracy when…
@post 15.
There are several liberal/ progressive movements that continue to fight for minority rights and fairness. A visit to dailykos.com should give any skeptic reassurance that a minority is at work trying to make the playing field level for ALL.
While liberal is a dirty word among conservative circles, it is on the backs of liberals progress is made. Everywhere. Including the US.
You may want to visit threads on Bill Moyer in this forum that do highlight issues. And highlight which segment is fighting to solve them.
Simply repeating the mantra that folks are silent abt the West issues is neither here nor there.
IMHO.