Is eating lobster halal?

[suroor_ca02]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

lobsters are soo gooood

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

Riiiiggghht, so saying something is wrong when the Quran hasn't said so is sensible...

ok.

[mAd_ScIeNtIsT]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

@PyariCgudia

By the way, this maqrooh category is a funny category in itself. So these scholars have basically put themselves above the Quran and decided to prohibit something that the Quran itself did not prohibit? That’s great.

The way I see it, something that is classified as “makrooh” really just means “well we scholars think this should be avoided, cuz you wouldn’t want to go to hell for THAT…so yeah, we’ll just tell you not to do this thing, because that’s what we think”.

And its so funny how people are so concerned to follow such stuff!

You misunderstand the concept of makrooh.

Doing something makrooh means that there is no sin in doing that action, but that it still isn’t a good thing. Meaning that if you really love God and want to do only those things that please him, you wouldn’t do something that is makrooh. But God won’t punish you if you do something that is makrooh.

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

Doing something makrooh means that there is no sin in doing that action, but that it still isn't a good thing. Meaning that if you really love God and want to do only those things that please him, you wouldn't do something that is makrooh. But God won't punish you if you do something that is makrooh.

Woah, are you telling me that sins are not the only thing you can do that'll get God mad at you?

If God really loves X then he does not really love ~X.

If God really loves us not to eat Lobsters, then he does not really love us if we do eat lobsters.

See, if you invite in the concept of makrooh, you are effectively saying "hey, that's not good - because if you do the opposite, God really likes that!"

[Akif]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

@PyariCgudia

The only thing I can really think of is: That these critters have open circulatory systems, so their flesh is constantly flooded with their own excretion/urine.

Im not even sure that is a valid reason, even though that argument is used against pork as well. But then again, if youve been to a village in Pakistan, you will see how people interact with the excreta of cows and buffalos. Cattle routinely sit on their own excreta, and have it pasted all over their hides…and their handlers routinely pick up their excreta with their hands, make lumps out of it, and dry it to use for various purposes.

As for pork, its vividly disallowed in the Quran, so no supporting argument should be needed. And well, from what I read, seafood has been declared halal, with no exceptions, so no supporting arguments should be needed. Now we can go crazy trying to figure out what exactly is water game, and what isnt.

@gupguppy

some scholars say that the term only includes those creatures that live solely in water and excludes those that sometimes live in water and can sometimes live out of it as well…

Whales can live out of water as well. As a matter of fact, they can only breath when out of water. The only reason they cant live outside for extended periods is because of their enormous weight, and they need the bouyancy of the water to hold their weight.

[ahmadjee]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

PCG, these guys are just messing with you.

Makrooh is a term coined by Muslim fiqh scholars to describe a verb or noun that cannot be proved as halaal or haram and it is used for things other than dietary substances as well.

[mAd_ScIeNtIsT]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

@PyariCgudia

See, if you invite in the concept of makrooh, you are effectively saying “hey, that’s not good - because if you do the opposite, God really likes that!”

The logic is enshrined in Hadith. The specific example is divorce.

In the Sunan Abu Dawood, Book 12, Hadith No. 2171 is
**Narrated Muharib: **
**The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Allah did not make anything lawful more abominable to Him than divorce. **

This is corroborated in the Book 12 Hadith 2173:
Narrated Abdullah ibn Umar: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Of all the lawful acts the most detestable to Allah is divorce

It is possible for you to commit certain acts that displease God, though he will not bring punishment upon you for those acts.

Edit: I forgot the most relevant hadith! From An-Nawawi’s 40 Hadith:

**On the authority of Jurthum bin Nashir that the messenger of Allah said : **
“Allah the Almighty has laid down religious duties, so do not neglect them. He has set boundaries, so do not over step them. He has prohibited some things, so do not violate them; about some things He was silent-out of compassion for you, not forgetfulness, so seek not after them.”

The existence of a category of deed that is neither sinful nor pleasing to Him is clear to derive from the underlined part.

These are things which He has not made sinful for us out of mercy, but which He would prefer we not do.

Islamic scholars later came up with the term “mukruh”, meaning “detested”, to describe these things.

[gupguppy]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

@Akif

Whales can live out of water as well. As a matter of fact, they can only breath when out of water. The only reason they cant live outside for extended periods is because of their enormous weight, and they need the bouyancy of the water to hold their weight.

in other words, for all intents and purposes they can’t and don’t live out of water…

[gupguppy]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

@mAd_ScIeNtIsT

You misunderstand the concept of makrooh.

Doing something makrooh means that there is no sin in doing that action, but that it still isn’t a good thing. Meaning that if you really love God and want to do only those things that please him, you wouldn’t do something that is makrooh. But God won’t punish you if you do something that is makrooh.

but there may be a reward for leaving it

@mAd_ScIeNtIsT

The logic is enshrined in Hadith. The specific example is divorce.

In the Sunan Abu Dawood, Book 12, Hadith No. 2171 is
**Narrated Muharib: **
**The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Allah did not make anything lawful more abominable to Him than divorce. **

This is corroborated in the Book 12 Hadith 2173:
Narrated Abdullah ibn Umar: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Of all the lawful acts the most detestable to Allah is divorce

weak hadiths… the first is clearly a mursal report – its narrator Muharib never met the Prophet (saw) and so the chain is incomplete…

the second appears fine but in fact contains the same hidden defect… it turns out to be another mursal report from Muharib (even though Abdullah ibn Umar’s name is given as an authority)…

also recorded by al Daraqutni with a weak chain…

al Manawi in Fayd al Qadir, Ibn Hajar in Fath al Bari, and Hafiz al Mundhiri in al Targhib point out the above defect/s

Edit: I forgot the most relevant hadith! From An-Nawawi’s 40 Hadith:

**On the authority of Jurthum bin Nashir that the messenger of Allah said : **
“Allah the Almighty has laid down religious duties, so do not neglect them. He has set boundaries, so do not over step them. He has prohibited some things, so do not violate them; about some things He was silent-out of compassion for you, not forgetfulness, so seek not after them.”

From memory… I recall that al Nawawi recorded the weak version of this report (as above perhaps?) or through a weak chain… there are other versions more authentic or that support the above which are recorded in Mustadrak al Hakim I believe… I’ll try to look it/them up later if I can…

In any case, i think your conclusion based on this last report is erroneous if you think that the line ending “… so seek not after them.” is categorising these things as makruh… but back to you on that one as well… pushed for time right now…

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

Thank you gupguppy.

Pigs do not have open circulatory systems! They are mammals!!!

Good grief.

[CheGuvera]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

@Fraudz

can u tell me which fiqah allows it so i convert to that fiqah when I go to have me a lobster.
this sort of knowledge is important, had i not converted to fiqah e jafaria on weekneds during college, i would be a very gunahgaar insaan. knowledge saved me.

You can convert to Catholicism…sub halyal ho jaiga…heck even if you screw up just make a confession, repent and what not and pay off the Church…

[Agent_Smith]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

and remember Jesus died for your sins so that you can commit all the sins you want and still get away with that. .

[gupguppy]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

coming back to this for what it’s worth…

@mAd_ScIeNtIsT

Edit: I forgot the most relevant hadith! From An-Nawawi’s 40 Hadith:

**On the authority of Jurthum bin Nashir that the messenger of Allah said : **
“Allah the Almighty has laid down religious duties, so do not neglect them. He has set boundaries, so do not over step them. He has prohibited some things, so do not violate them; about some things He was silent-out of compassion for you, not forgetfulness, so seek not after them.”

it turns out the hadith is weak… even though al Nawawi himself said it was hasan/good but an analysis disproves this…

it has three chains of transmission… two contain narrators (Asram ibn Hawshab & Nahshal al Khurasani) whose reports are rejected and are even accused of fabricating hadith so they can be discarded outright… the third chain (as recorded by al Daraqutni which is the reference given by al Nawawi, and also by al Baihaqi and others) contains at least two and possibly three defects in its chain: (1) it is disconnected; (2) it contains Dawud Ibn Abi Hind whose hadith reporting faded in later life according to Ibn Hajr in al Taqrib (1817); and (3) according to Ibn Rajab it is sometimes reported as a saying of the companion Abu Tha’laba rather than a hadith of the Prophet (saw)… (for further details see Ibn Rajab’s Jami al Ulum wa al Hikam Vol.2, p.150, and Muhaddith al Albani’s Gayat al Maram, 4)

The existence of a category of deed that is neither sinful nor pleasing to Him is clear to derive from the underlined part.

These are things which He has not made sinful for us out of mercy, but which He would prefer we not do.

Islamic scholars later came up with the term “mukruh”, meaning “detested”, to describe these things.

erroneous conclusion even based on the above weak hadith, but when we consider the authentic version the error is even clearer…

“What Allah has made lawful in His Book is halal and what He has forbidden is haram, and that concerning which He is silent is allowed as His favour. So accept His favour for Allah is not forgetful of anything. He (the Prophet) then recited: ‘And your Lord is not forgetful.’ (19:64).” (recorded in Mustadrak al Hakim – who said it is sahih, Musnad al Bazzar – who said it is sound, and al Tabarani’s Mu’jam al Kabir. Authenticated by al Haythami in Majma al Zawaid 1:171 & 7:55)

so the things Allah remained silent about are permissible, NOT makruh…

perhaps mAd_ScIeNtIsT’s point is better proven with the following hadith?

“That which is lawful is plain and that which is unlawful is plain and between the two of them are doubtful matters about which not many people know. Thus he who avoids doubtful matters clears himself in regard to his religion and his honour, but he who falls into doubtful matters falls into that which is unlawful, like the shepherd who pastures around a sanctuary, all but grazing therein. Truly every king has a sanctuary, and truly Allah’s sanctuary is His prohibitions. Truly in the body there is a morsel of flesh which, if it be whole, all the body is whole and which, if it be diseased, all of it is diseased. Truly it is the heart.” (al Bukhari and Muslim)

[FrozenFire]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

@SheikhSahab

Come on if it is Haram then Zibah it and make it halal and eat it.

lol ^^ why dont u do the same thing with Pigs?

[Jal_Pari]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

its all soo confusing what's makrooh and what's haram..sometimes it all comes down to personal choice based on common sense...i peronally feel disgusted and get goos bumps even by looking at crabs and lobster or any other shell fish stuff...some people even call mashrooms makrooh...i don't know where it came from....but i remember when dogs used to urinate on the ground out side our house and after few days...large mashrooms would come out of that place...ewww...i know those are poisoneous mashrooms and very different from what we have in stores...but still...i have never eaten mashrooms becuz of that thaught.

[suroor_ca02]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

^ lolz @musroom, jp.

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

I click on this thread every time just because I can almost taste the wonderful taste of buttered lobster just by looking at the conversation.

[desibanda]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

heck come on over to maine we have the best lobsters in the world :k:

[desibanda]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

jao tumhein lobster nahin khana hai to mat aao

[Agent_Smith]

Re: Is eating lobster halal?

@Jal_Pari

its all soo confusing what’s makrooh and what’s haram..sometimes it all comes down to personal choice based on common sense…i peronally feel disgusted and get goos bumps even by looking at crabs and lobster or any other shell fish stuff…some people even call mashrooms makrooh…i don’t know where it came from…but i remember when dogs used to urinate on the ground out side our house and after few days…large mashrooms would come out of that place…ewww…i know those are poisoneous mashrooms and very different from what we have in stores…but still…i have never eaten mashrooms becuz of that thaught.

hmmm, that’s why we don’t mushrooms in Pakistan besides Pizaa hut.