Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
r u talking about Genie in a bottle?
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Both religions agree.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Judeo-Christian teach that a person can be “possessed” by God’s Spirit and demons (according to Islam Jinns). Driving out the demons is “exorcism” in both religions.
Possession can be of Body and/or Soul of a person but not the person’s spirit.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
They are spirit. Not sure if a spirit is of any material. That’s the reason it can’t be seen and do other impossible things as per the laws of the universe/matter we live in.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
No, your own emotions. Can you put it in a bottle and detect and analise it with scientific tools?
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Possession can be of Body and/or Soul of a person but not the person's spirit.
Is there a difference between a soul and a spirit?
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
No. All other creatures mentioned in Bible are being depicted as male. It could though be that creatures not mentioned in Bible and which we do not know about might be female.
I have seen references to these "daughters of Allaah". I everytime assumed the Qur'an was sarcastic when using the phrase. What/who are these "daughters" referred to?
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Islam considers Angels as free from male / female distinction.
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Same with Christianity. Some Christians though believe that Angels (and demons) can have sexual intercourse with humans to produce a mixed offspring. I don't.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Still waiting on answers to:
Can the Jinns following Satan also repent and be saved?
How much of the knowledge of Jinns were known in the prophet Muhammad's lifetime and before? How much of what are told of Jinns were "new" knowledge?
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Can the Jinns following Satan also repent and be saved?
How much of the knowledge of Jinns were known in the prophet Muhammad's lifetime and before? How much of what are told of Jinns were "new" knowledge?
Is this addressed to me. Btw I am also waiting on my questions about Prophet Solomon PBUH kingdom, I hope you did not miss that post.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Yes.
All things/matter in this present universe has Body.
The Soul (emotions, will, intellect) lives in the Body. Both plants and one-cell “creatures” live, produce, grow. Having a soul is the difference between animals and plants. Once the body (vessel in which the soul lives) cease to exist (die), the soul can’t exist anymore.
The Spirit is what God blew into humans to make them different from animals. Only man from the normal created universe have a longing to interact with the Supreme Being. The spirit lives in the soul. Once the body cease to exist (die), the soul is still alive due to the spirit in it.
All is clearly shown in Genesis 1-2.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Would be nice if you could answer. Still working on Solomon - somewhat longer post. Need to get my bearings in order 
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
The kingdom of King Solomon was the high point in Israel’s history. They never again attained the size of country they dominated or had control over, it’s richness, etc. Since the Bible do not mention Jinns (as defined by the Qur’an), nothing is mentioned of King Solomon and Jinns helping him.
Short history of what is said of King Solomon (1King1-11):
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Solomon means “peaceful” and was therefor allowed to build God’s Tempel.
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One of King Davids sons and selected by David to be king after his death. Solomon also had to do David’s revenge for him after his death.
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When given a choice by God, choose wisdom to rule his people rather than wealth. God then gave him both.
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Some of his rulings are mentioned in the Bible, e.g. the two women each with a child, the one accidentally killing her baby and then claiming the other child as her own. Solomon asked a soldier to cut the living child in half and give each a part. The true mother then said the other woman can have the child without killing him while the other wanted the baby to be cut up. Solomon therefor identified the correct mother.
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Solomon studied various subjects (plants, animals, birds, etc.) and taught about knowledge. Various people and royalty came to listen to his knowledge and wisdom.
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Solomon built the first tempel of the Jews (same way the Tabernacle was build i.e. three in one) and installed the Arc in the innermost section. Afterwards God’s Presence filled the Tempel in the form of a cloud.
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Solomon build a big palace. Took him 13 years. The hanging gardens (one of the seven wonders of the ancient world) is atributed to Solomon.
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The Queen of Sheba visited Solomon’s court.
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King Solomon’s primary wife was a Egyptian daughter of Pharao (maybe arranged because of power sharing between two kingdoms). Solomon considered her to be number one among all his wives. He had 700 other wives from royal birth and 300 concubines.
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King Solomon’s wives (some being pagan and having all sort of gods) finally led Solomon astray. He started to errect pagan/idol places for them to worship (no wonder he said a nagging wife is like a dripping roof in his Wisdom Book).
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Solomon instituted harsh taxes and semi-slave labour on the Israelites in order to sustain his grand living and to be able to do all his building projects.
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Because of the idolatery in Solomon’s days, God decided to split the nation of Israel after Solomon’s death.
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At the end of King Solomon’s reign and death it does seem from the Bible that God was no longer impressed with Solomon. Various Christians believe Solomon died as sinner and will go to Hell.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
All things/matter in this present universe has Body.
The Soul (emotions, will, intellect) lives in the Body. Both plants and one-cell "creatures" live, produce, grow. Having a soul is the difference between animals and plants. Once the body (vessel in which the soul lives) cease to exist (die), the soul can't exist anymore.
The Spirit is what God blew into humans to make them different from animals. Only man from the normal created universe have a longing to interact with the Supreme Being. The spirit lives in the soul. Once the body cease to exist (die), the soul is still alive due to the spirit in it.
All is clearly shown in Genesis 1-2.
Soul is called Rooh in our belief and there is really no distinction between soul and spirit. They are used synonomously however I am sure some Fuqaha may disagree on this. Let me quote a hadith and Quranic ayah on this matter.
‘Abd-Allaah ibn Mas’ood (may Allaah be pleased with him), who said: “Whilst I was with the Prophet SAW on a farm, and he was resting on a palm branch stripped of its leaves, the Jews passed by, and some of them said to others, ‘Ask him about the soul.’ Some of them said, ‘What urges you to ask him about it?’ Others of them said, ‘Don’t ask him in case he says something you dislike.’ But they said, ‘Ask him,’ so they asked him about the soul. The Prophet SAW kept quiet and did not respond to them, and I knew that he was receiving Revelation, so I stayed where I was. When the Revelation of the aayah was complete, he said (interpretation of the meaning): ‘And they ask you [O Muhammad] concerning the rooh [the spirit]. Say: ‘The rooh: it is one of the things, the knowledge of which is only with my Lord. And of knowledge, you (mankind) have been given only a little.’ [al-Isra’ 17:85]” (Reported by al-Bukhaari)
There are definitely things known about what is done with the rooh when we die through ahadith however that in no way distinctly draws a picture of the rooh but simply makes us aware of some attributes and happenings.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
- The Queen of Sheba visited Solomon's court.
This is something I would be interested to know because this story is reinterated in Quran as well and this where we can find the mention of Jinns in Prophet Solomon PBUH kingdom.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Can the Jinns following Satan also repent and be saved?
How much of the knowledge of Jinns were known in the prophet Muhammad's lifetime and before? How much of what are told of Jinns were "new" knowledge?
1 - Yes Jinns can repent and be saved. It is implicit from the ayat or ahadith, which tell us that there can be muslim Jinns.
2 - Jinns have been known according to Islam since Adam was created since we believe that Satan is a Jinn. I do not know whether I can quantify how much knowledge was known though. Older traditions state (per Ibn Kathir - Stories of Prophets) earth was inhabited by Jinns and they just like us humans caused much mischief. Angels were sent to drive the Jinns away before Adam was sent down to the earth. And btw we believe that Satan was not evil from the beginning but in fact Satan was one who worshipped in the company of angels till he became arrogant at the creation of Adam. He had thought he is superior to Adam because he was composed of fire and Adam of clay, which is another evidence that he was of the Jinn since Angels are not made of fire according to our belief. The belief in Christianity might come from the fact that Satan worshipped in the company of Angels and hence the Fallen angel belief. What do you think?
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
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we believe that Allah gave Suleiman (as) a choice between kingdom, knowledge and wealth, and he chose knowledge and being pleased with his choice, Allah granted the other two to him as well…
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Quran says that synogogues were built by Suleiman (as) with the help of jinns who worked as labors for him…
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Quran says that when Sheba visited Suleiman (as), a jinn said that he wud bring her throne to Suleiman (as) so he can show he the throne as a proof of his power…
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Quran mentions that the jinns working for Suleiman (as) did also build statues for him, but does not mention the purpose…
but since Quran praises Suleiman (as) to be a righteous messenger, it cannot be idols for worship… -
Quran does not show any such thing about Suleiman (as), instead it praises Suleiman (as)…
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we can never think such a thing like Suleiman (as) being a sinner…
indeed Allah was very much pleased with Suleiman (as) as is mentioned in the Quran…
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
Thanks for the info.
This discussion don’t fit in any of the topics still to be discussed except maybe Salvation or Judgement, so I think we can spend a little time here.
The concept of Islam with soul=spirit, is contrary with Judeo-Christian teaching. Is it clearly defined in Qur’an that the soul = spirit? What is the difference between an animal’s soul/spirit and mankind’s? I actually think that the Qur’an agree with the Bible and you might be wrong in interpreting it. Both mention God blowing His spirit into mankind when He created/made them - exactly the same as Bible explains it. Only the Bible states what then happened and the Qur’an not. Even the meaning of the two words are different in English, so possibly the two should also not be equal in Islam?
Anyway, Hebrew and Arabic are from the same root and it is not strange that the word for spirit in Hebrew is ruach. Often when the Bible mentions “spirit” it is meant the two together. The Bible states that only the Holy Spirit can distinguish between the two as they are so bonded together (similar as the body/soul which no man can part only by death).
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
The two scriptures differ in that the Bible only states that she came to visit Solomon because of knowledge of his wisdom; they had some conversations and dined together; she was impressed and they exchanged presents and went back to her country.
There exist all sort of other stories about the two relating how Solomon even sired offspring from her but this is not sourced from the Bible.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
What I wanted to know is whether the concept of Jinns was something new taught by the prophet Muhammad and whether the people living in his age and before, already knew and told stories of creatures called Jinns.
Did the prophet gave clear guidance on what/where/who Jinns are or did he teach the people something completely new?
Both faiths teach the same except that the sin itself differs. Islam say he sinned w.r.t. his attitude towards Adam while Christianity say he sinned w.r.t. his attitude towards God.
Christianity and Judaism teach so much different to Islam on this subject (not even mentioning any creature closely resembling Jinns). The Bible clearly in various places indicate that Satan was a senior angel.
Re: Interfaith Dialogue (Angels and Jinn) - Islam and Chrsitianity
This discussion don't fit in any of the topics still to be discussed except maybe Salvation or Judgement, so I think we can spend a little time here.
The concept of Islam with soul=spirit, is contrary with Judeo-Christian teaching. Is it clearly defined in Qur'an that the soul = spirit? What is the difference between an animal's soul/spirit and mankind's? I actually think that the Qur'an agree with the Bible and you might be wrong :) in interpreting it. Both mention God blowing His spirit into mankind when He created/made them - exactly the same as Bible explains it. Only the Bible states what then happened and the Qur'an not. Even the meaning of the two words are different in English, so possibly the two should also not be equal in Islam?
Anyway, Hebrew and Arabic are from the same root and it is not strange that the word for spirit in Hebrew is ruach. Often when the Bible mentions "spirit" it is meant the two together. The Bible states that only the Holy Spirit can distinguish between the two as they are so bonded together (similar as the body/soul which no man can part only by death).
I do not think I would agree with that i.e. spirit and soul being two different entities in Islam. I do understand what you are talking about and that is a thought among many scholars in Islam as well i.e. what is difference between us and animals in terms of a soul.
Rooh has different meanings in Arabic however spirit and soul are the same thing from the best of my knowledge in Islam. It does coincide with the Christian concept. What may coincide is that Life and Soul or Spirit are different things. Life is present in all living things whereas Rooh is only in us and this is what differentiates us from living beings such as animals.
As far as Allah SWT blowing his spirit into Adam is concerned, the difference lies in the fact that you are reading in English whereas when read in Arabic it refers to a third person so they are not really the same when compared to ther verses. I cannot understand Arabic as a first language so this statement is based on explanations I have read before. If some here is knowledgible enough in Arabic to explain this, it would greatly appreciated.