I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

[Ghost14]

I want to pose this question to people who consider themselves religious but are inconsistent about observing all rituals/rules: why wouldn’t you follow Islam to the letter? If you are 100% sure that it is the path to Jannat, then not following even a single rule is akin to throwing away a winning lottery ticket. Why would you risk that? More importantly, why would you ignore Allah’s rules if you know them to be true?

I have reservations about religion and consider myself to be agnostic, but at least I’m honest enough to admit to myself that I have doubts, or that I disagree. The only difference between myself and the “bad Muslims”, is that they (at least publicly) proclaim to be Muslims, and follow along with culture/religious views; my lifestyle is probably not very different from people like this, yet I would be met with more hostility from practicing Muslims.

[redvelvet]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

You're not a bad Muslim, Ghostie. You're just .....spiritual.

[Ghost14]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

Thanks broski. Now gimme my RV special: paragraph laden with wise and sensible advice/input (unless the topic is feminism in which case RV will report you to the cops for being a man).

[redvelvet]

Re: I’m a bad Muslim/don’t follow all the rules

Relax. The latter half of the parenthetical caveat does not apply to you.

[queer]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

diwana can explain this well. i hope he shows up soon. aao diwana aao.

scatters birdseed

[Ghost14]

Re: I’m a bad Muslim/don’t follow all the rules

@redvelvet

Relax. The latter half of the parenthetical caveat does not apply to you.

Yet you reported me to the cops…woman logic?

No stop derailing my thread woman, I already won.

[redvelvet]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

HEY!!! At least I addressed something from your post. Queer's the one talking about bird seed. What relevance does that have? And I get accused of derailing. :(

[KaafHaaYaaAynSaad]

Re: I’m a bad Muslim/don’t follow all the rules

Salam

I made a thread like this, some time ago: http://www.paklinks.com/gs/religion-and-scripture/495455-sad-state-of-affairs-pakistanis.html

Khair, I agree with you. The state of Ummat is very bad. We’re just Muslims by name. We were born into a Muslim family, so we’re Muslim. I mean, the most important part of our deen is prayers, and majority of the Ummat couldn’t care less about that. SubhanAllah. They’ll pray Friday to Friday and call themselves Muslim…

If you try to tell these things to some people, their reply is, “Stop judging other. Look at yourself.” Allah has said to enjoin good and forbid evil. Even if your intentions are pure, they get offended because they know they’re wrong, but don’t want to admit it.

If Muslims are thinking they’ll get to Jannat just because their name is Muhammad or Aisha, then they’re in for a surprise. Let’s wake up before it’s too late. It only takes one moment, a hit from a car or a stroke, and you’re gone. There’s no turning back.

May Allah give us all hidayat.

[Ghost14]

Re: I’m a bad Muslim/don’t follow all the rules

@KaafHaaYaaAynSaad

Salam

I made a thread like this, some time ago: http://www.paklinks.com/gs/religion-and-scripture/495455-sad-state-of-affairs-pakistanis.html

Khair, I agree with you. The state of Ummat is very bad. We’re just Muslims by name. We were born into a Muslim family, so we’re Muslim. I mean, the most important part of our deen is prayers, and majority of the Ummat couldn’t care less about that. SubhanAllah. They’ll pray Friday to Friday and call themselves Muslim…

If you try to tell these things to some people, their reply is, “Stop judging other. Look at yourself.” Allah has said to enjoin good and forbid evil. Even if your intentions are pure, they get offended because they know they’re wrong, but don’t want to admit it.

If Muslims are thinking they’ll get to Jannat just because their name is Muhammad or Aisha, then they’re in for a surprise. Let’s wake up before it’s too late. It only takes one moment, a hit from a car or a stroke, and you’re gone. There’s no turning back.

May Allah give us all hidayat.

I agree with you that simply calling yourself a Muslim does not make it so, but I my question was directed more at the reasons people don’t practice the religion they claim to belong to. I consider myself a person of principle, so if I claim to believe in, or stand for something, I do it. No excuses.

I don’t mean to attack people, and I really do want to understand why this gap exists, so please post if you feel comfortable.

[diwana]

Re: I’m a bad Muslim/don’t follow all the rules

queer will not be disappointed. He is sooo waiting for me to answer here.

You got questions, I got answer. j/k.

---

Coming to this post:

@Ghost14

I want to pose this question to people who consider themselves religious but are inconsistent about observing all rituals/rules: why wouldn’t you follow Islam to the letter? If you are 100% sure that it is the path to Jannat, then not following ** even a single rule is akin to throwing away a winning lottery ticket.** Why would you risk that? More importantly, why would you ignore Allah’s rules if you know them to be true?

I have reservations about religion and consider myself to be agnostic, but **at least I’m honest enough to admit to myself **that I have doubts, or that I disagree. The only difference between myself and the “bad Muslims”, is that they (at least publicly) proclaim to be Muslims, and follow along with culture/religious views; my lifestyle is probably not very different from people like this, yet I would be met with more hostility from practicing Muslims.

How about you start from not judging anyone?

How about you don’t look at others or not compare yourself with others to make yourself look better?

How about not calling someone a blanket term of ‘bad muslims’ if someone is following many but not following one single rule of religion in their lives.

In one breath you agree with others that they are sure of their beliefs of going to Jannat, but next you throw stone at them by saying, Oh dude! you missed one rule so you are risking that promise be fulfilled.

And then I love when people say:

I do this and that but at least I am honest to admit it to myself.

No sir, you are not admitting to yourself, you want the whole world to praise you for being ‘honest’ and all-admitting your weakness.

It is like you want people to like you for whatever you believe in but on the contrary, don’t spare a moment in judging others.

[KaafHaaYaaAynSaad]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

↑Is that at me?

[diwana]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

@KaafHaaYaaAynSaad

↑Is that at me?

No. It was to OP' post which I quoted.

Didn't mean to kill two birds with one stone. ;)

[Ghost14]

Re: I’m a bad Muslim/don’t follow all the rules

@diwana

queer will not be disappointed. He is sooo waiting for me to answer here.

You got questions, I got answer. j/k.

---

Coming to this post:

How about you start from not judging anyone?

How about you don’t look at others or not compare yourself with others to make yourself look better?

How about not calling someone a blanket term of ‘bad muslims’ if someone is following many but not following one single rule of religion in their lives.

In one breath you agree with others that they are sure of their beliefs of going to Jannat, but next you throw stone at them by saying, Oh dude! you missed one rule so you are risking that promise be fulfilled.

And then I love when people say:

I do this and that but at least I am honest to admit it to myself.

No sir, you are not admitting to yourself, you want the whole world to praise you for being ‘honest’ and all-admitting your weakness.

It is like you want people to like you for whatever you believe in but on the contrary, don’t spare a moment in judging others.

Nice paragraph, but you missed the point. Spectacularly.

Some people who claim to be religious lead lifestyles which do not follow the religious teachings. Why do they do that?

I’m not talking about “dude you missed one rule” (you just made that up), but the general lifestyle. The only reference I made to “one rule” was that if you know Islam to be true, why knowingly break even a single rule? My point was that in practice, the only difference between me and people who do what I described, is that I say I’m agnostic or unclear about my views, while they say they are 100% Muslims, yet lead lifestyles similar to, or less Islamic, than mine.

And this is not something you could answer unless you are one of those people. I’m just curious as to how/why people justify their lifestyles with their beliefs. I’m not saying that everyone who does this, drinks and dates etc, but even something like not praying regularly is not following Islam; why would you do that (not pray regularly) if you are a self proclaimed Muslim?

[diwana]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

@Ghost14

Nice paragraph, but you missed the point. Spectacularly. ** Some people who claim to be religious lead lifestyles which do not follow the religious teachings. Why do they do that? ** I'm not talking about "dude you missed one rule" (you just made that up), but the general lifestyle. The only reference I made to "one rule" was that if you know Islam to be true, why knowingly break even a single rule? My point was that in practice, the only difference between me and people who do what I described, is that I say I'm agnostic or unclear about my views, while they say they are 100% Muslims, yet lead lifestyles similar to, or less Islamic, *than mine. *

And this is not something you could answer unless you are one of those people. I'm just curious as to how/why people justify their lifestyles with their beliefs. **I'm not saying that everyone who does this, drinks and dates etc, but even something like not praying regularly is not following Islam; why would you do that (not pray regularly) if you are a self proclaimed Muslim?**

Thank you.

I got exactly from your post and specially what your title suggest.

You keep judging but keep denying at the same time.

First: there is no one who says I am 100% muslim. You (not necessarily you but people who do) just assume they believe this just to be able to bash them.

Second: No one feels proud of breaking religious rules if the person is truly somewhat religious.

Third: Why expect others to be following 100% of their own beliefs, when agnostics (and many atheists) would not follow 100% of their beliefs? Why double standard? Why be so strict when it comes to religious people but relaxed when it comes to agnostics/atheists people?

Fourth: What benefit one can really get other than thumping one's chest when looking at others or giving examples of others to prove one is right?

Why not focus on the life you want to live than pointing finger on other?

Fifth: If someone says "Yes I am agnostic" does that mean that person has a God given right to judge religious individuals? I mean if someone is 99% muslim. So what? That does not make agnostic any better. Two unrelated life styles. Right?

Sixth: How about just defend your beliefs without mixing it with other person's acts and lifestyle? Throughout your argument you keep talking about religious or half religious people. Not really warranted or necessary.

Lastly: Please explain what you meant by red part when you said "than mine". I think I know what you meant. Just need confirmation. Thanks. :)

P.S. "Ha Ha you are not 100% muslim look at me I am agnostic and admit I don't know if there is God or not. We are 'same' or "I am better."

No sir that is not how anyone should think.

[Ghost14]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

Thank you.

I got exactly from your post and specially what your title suggest.

You keep judging but keep denying at the same time.

First: there is no one who says I am 100% muslim. You (not necessarily you but people who do) just assume they believe this just to be able to bash them.

Second: No one feels proud of breaking religious rules if the person is truly somewhat religious.

Third: Why expect others to be following 100% of their own beliefs, when agnostics (and many atheists) would not follow 100% of their beliefs? Why double standard? Why be so strict when it comes to religious people but relaxed when it comes to agnostics/atheists people?

Fourth: What benefit one can really get other than thumping one's chest when looking at others or giving examples of others to prove one is right?

Why not focus on the life you want to live than pointing finger on other?

Fifth: If someone says "Yes I am agnostic" does that mean that person has a God given right to judge religious individuals? I mean if someone is 99% muslim. So what? That does not make agnostic any better. Two unrelated life styles. Right?

Sixth: How about just defend your beliefs without mixing it with other person's acts and lifestyle? Throughout your argument you keep talking about religious or half religious people. Not really warranted or necessary.

Lastly: Please explain what you meant by red part when you said "than mine". I think I know what you meant. Just need confirmation. Thanks. :)

P.S. "Ha Ha you are not 100% muslim look at me I am agnostic and admit I don't know if there is God or not. We are 'same' or "I am better."

No sir that is not how anyone should think.

If someone is 99% Muslim, they may as well call themselves agnostic, because the only thing making them Muslim is the fact that they grew up in an Islamic culture/household. People should think and reflect on their lifestyle. I'm not talking about infractions due to chance, but deliberate lifestyles which conflict with Islam.

I never said an agnostic view is better, you're inferring that based on your prejudices. And what rules do agnostic or atheists not follow in your view?

How many religious people do you know that date, or drink, or don't pray, and may not even fast during Ramadan, but are quick to question others' viewpoints (religious vs spiritual)? That's conformance and hypocrisy at its finest. You're actually suggesting that it's ok for me to drink, or date, but as long as I say that I'm sorry, and that I'm trying to be a good Muslim, all is well. Well sir, that's not ok. Have the balls to follow your own rules. And if that's being judgmental then fine, I'm being judgmental. But I would still like to know why people lead such lifestyles.

[diwana]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

If someone is 99% Muslim, they may as well call themselves agnostic, because the only thing making them Muslim is the fact that they grew up in an Islamic culture/household. People should think and reflect on their lifestyle. I'm not talking about infractions due to chance, but *deliberate lifestyles which conflict with Islam. *

I never said an agnostic view is better, you're inferring that based on your prejudices. And what rules do agnostic or atheists not follow in your view?

How many religious people do you know that date, or drink, or don't pray, and may not even fast during Ramadan, but are quick to question others' viewpoints (religious vs spiritual)? That's conformance and hypocrisy at its finest. You're actually suggesting that it's ok for me to drink, or date, but as long as I say that I'm sorry, and that I'm trying to be a good Muslim, all is well. Well sir, that's not ok. Have the balls to follow your own rules. And if that's being judgmental then fine, I'm being judgmental. But I would still like to know why people lead such lifestyles.

Again judging others?

Are you agnostic on your own or because of others?

Why hell bent on trying to make someone completely unrelated people to include them in agnosticism?

You said you are agnostic.

You said you want to see religious people 100% religious since they claim to be. Not true.

You try to put conditions on religious people when you have no right on them at all.
And yet you complain why people question religious or spiritual viewpoint? Isn't this hypocrisy?

Like I said, live your life as you want.
Why even worry about others?

Why not have "balls" to defend your beliefs on your own thinking and research?

Close your eyes and think who you want to be for YOU not for OTHERS.

Why do piggy ride on others to justify your beliefs?

[queer]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

i agree with every word lord diwana has scattered randomly into the above post - piggy ride and all.

refils birdseeds

[Ghost14]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

Again judging others?

Are you agnostic on your own or because of others?

Why hell bent on trying to make someone completely unrelated people to include them in agnosticism?

You said you are agnostic.

You said you want to see religious people 100% religious since they claim to be. Not true.

You try to put conditions on religious people when you have no right on them at all. And yet you complain why people question religious or spiritual viewpoint? Isn't this hypocrisy?

Like I said, live your life as you want. Why even worry about others?

Why not have "balls" to defend your beliefs on your own thinking and research?

Close your eyes and think who you want to be for YOU not for OTHERS.

Why do piggy ride on others to justify your beliefs?

I'm not trying to convert anyone. Again, you're making things up. I'll cut it down for you so you don't get confused by all the words. Just answer these:

1) Should people follow everything in the Quran?

2) Are you this open minded about "live and let live" when it comes to gays or other minorities?

[CM]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

People should follow what they wish. They shouldn't make excuses for their own personal inadequacies and failures saying that the faith is wrong. If you are a **** up its not the faiths fault. Its your own goddamn fault.

[diwana]

Re: I'm a bad Muslim/don't follow all the rules

I'm not trying to convert anyone. Again, you're making things up. I'll cut it down for you so you don't get confused by all the words. Just answer these:

1) Should people follow everything in the Quran?

2) Are you this open minded about "live and let live" when it comes to gays or other minorities?

No idea why you keep doing the same which I pointed out repeatedly. Sorry but maybe you don't know what you are doing.
Start living your own beliefs.

:)