If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

Interesting read.

Two recent events that have dominated the news – the death of Osama bin Laden and the tornadoes that ravaged the southeast – have brought to light one of the fundamental questions humanity has struggled with since the beginning of civilization: Why do we have evil, suffering, pain, illness and death in the world?

A classic question in theology asks how can a loving, yet omnipotent God permit evil and suffering in the world? The argument goes as follows: A God that allows suffering to continue is either a) not all-powerful (not omnipotent) and is thus unable to prevent the suffering; b) not loving because this God has the power to prevent suffering but is unwilling to do so; and/or c) not all-knowing (not omniscient) because God only is aware of the suffering after it has already occurred and it’s too late to prevent it. This problem of evil and God’s inability or unwillingness to do anything about it is known in theology as “theodicy.”

Two of the most common (and I think unsatisfactory) answers to this question are that God’s ways are “mysterious” or that God has an overarching plan that we cannot know.

I find it fascinating that you never hear the question of why suffering exists from a physicist or a biologist. Why? To the evolutionary biologist or the cosmologist (that is, the study of the origins of the universe, not the science of makeup aka cosmetology!), pain, suffering and even evil are absolute requirements for life as we know it to exist. Evolution only works because of a freedom implied in the natural world: a freedom of genetic mutation, a freedom of natural selection and a freedom of randomness. This freedom led to the existence of conscious humans, but by necessity the same freedom also causes cancer, disease and natural catastrophes.

Too often in history the human predicament (which includes our anxiety over our mortality, the suffering we experience in life and the problem of evil) has been seen as a result of our disobeying certain divine rules or as punishment for not believing in a particular religious doctrine. After Hurricane Katrina, for example, certain evangelical ministers claimed that the destruction of New Orleans was God’s punishment for the wickedness that took place in the city. Where are those ministers now that the heart of the Bible Belt has been struck by tornados? The reality is that God was not punishing New Orleans then, just as God did not just punish Tuscaloosa: predictable meteorological patterns did.

The problem of evil and suffering is only a problem when we view God as a supernatural Zeus-like being. If we instead understand God as the power of being itself (as I wrote in an earlier post here), then this problem disappears.

The question then is not how can God permit evil? God does not permit anything other than the creative state of being, which by its very nature includes freedom. Freedom is what leads to sin and consequently evil. Freedom also leads to growth and life itself. We can thus read the story of the forbidden fruit in Genesis as a metaphorical explanation of the inherent freedom within the world and our knowledge and experience of this freedom as the ultimate cause of suffering.

God, when understood as Paul Tillich’s “ground of being,” rather than a supernatural being who intervenes occasionally in the universe, allows for a power that supports all existence as its creative ground but does not make a choice as to which unfortunate events to intervene to change. The nature of existence (as grounded in God) is such that humankind is free. To be free, we must have the ability to do evil, to turn away from God, the true ground of who we are. Thus, the possibility (and reality) of sin is built into the very fabric of life.

To argue whether God could not have found a better mechanism for life and existence fails because it falls into the fallacy of seeing God as a supernatural being designing the universe as a watchmaker might (opening God up to the criticism of being an incompetent watchmaker) or playing with the universe in an ongoing chess game according to some divine plan (opening God up to the criticism of being a cruel chess master) rather than understanding God as the creative structure of existence itself. Thus, the problem of evil is ultimately one of perspective: from a micro view we may see the sufferings that happen in the world, but from a macro view we can understand that this suffering is part of the very fabric of the nature of existence itself – an existence that on balance is good.

This view of God is also one in which we can experience the divine directly as the center of our very selves. We can take comfort in that when we do suffer, God is present with us.

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

It seems Jeffrey Small has been googling some answers from Islamic websites he may have even stumbled across a GupShup post that was saying the same thing ... LOL

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

Without good there would be no evil, without poor there would be no rich.

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

good question in the thread name. I have not read the article on purpose, since I want to try and answer it myself without getting prejudiced.

  • If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

Let us stipulate and accept God exists.
Let is stipulate and accept there exists evil & suffering.

Then only three possibilities exist:

1) God is not powerful enough to prevent evil & suffering OR
2) God does not want to prevent evil & suffering OR
3) What we think is evil and suffering is not evil & suffering by God's definition

More seriously speaking, what Hinduism taught me makes a lot of sense here...which is:

god gave human beings the ability to discriminate between good and bad. If you don't use that faculty and do something bad you do evil which brings suffering sooner or later depending upon the type of evil.

for example, if you see a flame and move your finger away from it because your ability to discriminate tells you that poking your finger on th flame is not good and so bad, you'll do fine. No evil done, no suffering.

You go and poke your finger at the flame for whatever reason (showing of to gf = vanity) you're going to get burn and suffering results, immediately.

Or you use to flame to light up your cigarette - it gives you immediate pleasure but eventually catches up with you as cancer or lung disease or emphysema etc

but instead you use the flame to light a fireplace in cold or to light a candle for light or to cook - good things occur, right?

in all this, God is the same, the flame is the same. your actions are the only variable.

hence ultimately, it is about you, not God.

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

It does not answer the suffering part then , why do , earthquakes , tornadoes , epidemics kill indiscriminately ? Why would a baby die of a disease ?

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

The mistake people make is they put god in a framework of human being, god is not human or think like human.

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

So what is your point ? :konfused:

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

when i was young i used to make lego worlds , once when i finished with them i experiment all sort of things to break it, destroy it,
whatever i wanted to do
because if i wont destroy it prince has nothing to rebuilt or save
now inead of me GOD is controler this world is like lego to HIM
if suffering is fineshed from the world than what will be the diffrence between world and heaven???

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

excellent question. But the principle that answers is the same and consistent. This may turnout to be a lengthy one but I will try.

Natural catastrophies are simply the continuation of the natural process (that God invoked if you are a believer). For example the planet, the oceans and currents, weather, the tectonic plates, the mountains....all of them (were) formed in a particular configuration that enabled life. But that process cannot stop - when sunshines, water has to evoporate; when it condenses it has to rain; when it rains water has to flow; when water flows muds has to be washed; when mud is washed tree has to fall....

The baby affected by disease and epidemic - the key here is why epidemics occur which again can be explained everytime by a combination of natural & manmade factors using above.

The other part of the question - why that baby? what bad thing did that baby do to die so young? This is a trickier question and depending upon whether you subscribe to Hindu philosophy, and to what degree and what parts of it you subscribe to (note I did not use the term 'believ' but the term subscribe to' also note it is the Hindu philosophy i am talking about and not the religion), one or more of the following will apply:

1) karmic cycle from across births; the Hindu puranas have numerous direct references of events that happen to babies and children because of prior birth actions. There are even cases where the effect of certain actions are measured to several births due to the enormity of the good or bad deed.

2) we as present day human beings are very self centered and apply only our points of view; therefore we miss the big picture. An example: from a cosmic (not the best word but cannot think of the better one) perspective a baby may dying is neither a good or bad thing by itself. For example when a deer gets hit by a car it is a wasteful death from human perspective and therefore we feel bad. But (assuming you are not a vegetarian) if an animal is killed to be food, would you feel bad about it? Ofcourse from a human perspective, it is very difficult for us equate a baby and a deer. God's perspective may be different.

3) There is also the concept of attaining freedom from the birth-death cycle to reach and unison with the God. In that respect, there cited cases where death acts as a fast track. Again very difficult to accept for human beings but not difficult to comprehend.

Somebody once said and I only partly remember, the physical properties of matter - mass and energy- that maintains integrity (eg: a building standing as built) is also the same that cause decay (eg: a building is not only designed to stand, but the very same design is what causes it ultimately fall in a particular way). We like the 'standing' part and dislike the 'falling' part.

PS: As I read my post it occurred to me that it may not be easy or possible for everyone to appreciate or accept 'karmic cycle'. so I'd add following:

Forget karmic cycle. It is by now well understood by all that a man and a woman can do certain things before they conceive a baby, that can materially, significantly and even corporally affect the baby that hasn't even yet been conceived. and then there are certain things that can be done after the baby has been conceived but before entering each stage of formation & birth ....and so on. So you may ask, how is it fair for that baby if its dad smoked and drank heavily and that led to a weak of diseased baby being born?

Because a baby is an effect, it can only be that of its causes. Surprisingly this is well understood in almost all cultures and accepted in all religions I know of (and I don't know them all). We always say 'I am xyz son of so&so, grand son of so&so, coming in the clan of so&so etc...John*son *)

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

Yep LaP it is lengthy , I will read it at bedtime.

Comparing God with a kid who takes joy in messing up or breaking toys is blasphemy. :ast:

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

:konfused:

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

you see suffering from a human viewpoint and you try to put allah(swt) into same framework of human viewpoint.

You are limited in ability and thought so as humans we cannot come to a definite conclusion why god allows these disasters.

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

you consider it suffering if you thing world is only place, and i consider it as Allah will as this life in not eternel.
you may see suffering there but not beyond.

by the way do we ask same questions from ourselves for things we take for granted.

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

Even if I consider this world a temporary abode and believe in that there is an after life it does not answer the question why would Allah's will be to make Allah's own creations suffer ? The truth is that you do not have answer to this question for those who do not believe in Allah. You can believe in whatever you want , but others are not bound with your beliefs . Are they ?
So to those who do not believe in what you believe in , you have to come up with an answer they can understand.

By the way I ask the same question from myself for things we take for granted , like why I have two hands not four , why I have two eyes not two behind my head , it would make life so easy. If I had for hands I could be more efficient. If I had two eyes behind my back , nobody could stab me from my back. etc.
How does questioning myself for the things I take for granted answer the questions " why do , earthquakes , tornadoes , epidemics kill indiscriminately ? Why would a baby die of a disease ?"
If it does , please explain to me , I would be highly obliged and it will strengthen my eman and it will help me answer these questions to non believers.

Re: If God is All Powerful, Why Must Evil and Suffering Exist in the World?

God is the creator of everything. So, if God did not create evil, ppl be like Hes not God since he cannot/unable to create evil.