[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Femme Fatale: *
I didn't get you.
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whatdo youwant from kaaba? whatdo you prayfor? good crops?
good health? others want samre thing from whatever they pray.
what thebig deal? what worries you if their "false god " dont give what they want?
Why do you keep coming back to the Kaaba? You have repeatedly told that muslims to not pray to the Kaaba or ask it for anything. It is just for the purpose of direction. All payers are made to Allah. Namaz is offered as a sign of gratitude to Allah for all that we have, for life itself, in this world and the next, for guidance and forgiveness. It is in the post-namaz dua that people ask for whatever they need/wish.
As for others praying to different Gods, well what can I say. I believe every religion encourages its believers to preach to followers of other religions except Jews. Every religion is the best in its own books. Muslims believe they follow the correct path, Christians believe they do, Jews believe they are the chosen ones, Hindus believe they are right. Whats the big deal about it? You tell me? Does it bother you? It doesn't bother me in such a way that I would distort someone elses view and repeatedly continue with something like..muslims pray to the kaaba, muslims pray to the black stone.
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so why worship cows, snakes, monkeys and rodents.
are they represting GOD too.
it doesn't make any sense.
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now some beleive God sends them written manuals and licence to kill others.
Does it make sense? Not to us!!
Worshipping of animals may sound stupid, but its certainly nonviolent and better than pleasing God by chopping heads, looting, distributing women and children and breaking down other's places of worship!!
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that British who conquerored India refused to go to temples
because of their horrible naked paintings. Yeah, in the beginning.
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Did hindus sent them an invitation to visit their temple?
And do the likes and dislikes of any invader holds any credibility?
Wot hindus paint in their own temples is none of arabs or britisher's business.
And wot is 'horrible' in seeing nudes?
Were you born with clothes on? and are you going to bring new life on this earth without dressing down??
Haven't you, phillistine, seen Rennaisance paintings by leonardo, michealangello, rapheals? Paintings of Ajanta and ellora? of Khajuraho?
Skin is beautiful, their is nothing wrong in admiring wot nature has given us naturally!!
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as Moses and his followers crossed river Nile, the river split into two for them and when Pharoah's tried crossing that river combined into one and all of them (Pharoah and his army) drowned. There are many other examples where God has shown His power, but you will only think of them as stories.
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changez, how old are you? You think a sea can spit into two? You think virgins can give birth? You think moon can slipt into two??
You think, god does magic shows for us, to show his power!!
you think, he is this desperate to be worshipped, that he has to bend backwards to prove himself ???
If yes than why has he suddenly stopped showing us his magic powers?
Bible is a set of fairy tales with no evidence or facts attached to it...you beleive in those tales, than you are nothing better than a six year old beliving in toothfairies.
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Corner stone in Kaaba is not for "pujaa paat". It is not considered "GOD", or "part of God".
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on the contrary "Hadschar al Aswad" is considered holy and thought to sent by god himself.
The fact is, it is just a meteorite. And its nothing but 'meteorite worship'. Since prehistoric times meteorites were considered by numberless cultures and peoples as the essence of the holy. Their heavenly origin as well as their unpredictable emerging with light appearances, sound and smoke were always impressive enough to drive the "shower of the holy" through each one witnessing such an event and freeze the the watcher in fear and respect. Naturally the remnants of such a spectacle, the actual meteorites, became holy stones, power and cult objects, which often were granted a relic like worship .
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This is the most half-baked nonsense I've read. Each muslim trying to prove himself/herself superior and each non muslim trying to provide a counter argument. Who the eff cares how one worships? Leave the damning to god, but no, some people are so supercilious they should be crowned prophets for their endless proselytizing!
The most dangerous people are those that are convinced they know God and his will. In fact they have his direct number and he has personally told them that he hates idolators. Yes, god must be capable of hate because his moral police on earth is capable of it. What pomposity!
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no mincing wordz!!! this is best of karina to date!! kudos!
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Femme Fatale: *
Why do you keep coming back to the Kaaba? You have repeatedly told that muslims to not pray to the Kaaba or ask it for anything. It is just for the purpose of direction. All payers are made to Allah. Namaz is offered as a sign of gratitude to Allah for all that we have, for life itself, in this world and the next, for guidance and forgiveness. It is in the post-namaz dua that people ask for whatever they need/wish.
As for others praying to different Gods, well what can I say. I believe every religion encourages its believers to preach to followers of other religions except Jews. Every religion is the best in its own books. Muslims believe they follow the correct path, Christians believe they do, Jews believe they are the chosen ones, Hindus believe they are right. Whats the big deal about it? You tell me? Does it bother you? It doesn't bother me in such a way that I would distort someone elses view and repeatedly continue with something like..muslims pray to the kaaba, muslims pray to the black stone.
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dont worry allah loves evrybody
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*Originally posted by rvikz: *
even dictionarysays it is stone
Main Entry: Kaa·ba
Pronunciation: 'kä-b&
Function: noun
Etymology: Arabic ka'bah, literally, cubic building
Date: 1734
: a small stone building in the court of the Great Mosque at Mecca that contains a sacred black stone and is the goal of Islamic pilgrimage and the point toward which Muslims turn in praying
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perhaps it was also eneterd into the dictionary by someone of a limited knowledge (or a biased thinking) like yourself....
ever tried asking the muslims (realizing that almost no non-muslim has ever entered the holy place to actually see the kaab) to know what it really is????
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by soul: *
....
changez, how old are you? You think a sea can spit into two? You think virgins can give birth? You think moon can slipt into two??
You think, god does magic shows for us, to show his power!!
you think, he is this desperate to be worshipped, that he has to bend backwards to prove himself ???
If yes than why has he suddenly stopped showing us his magic powers?
Bible is a set of fairy tales with no evidence or facts attached to it...you beleive in those tales, than you are nothing better than a six year old beliving in toothfairies.
[/quote]
Beta, you are born some 2500 or more years late to witness what happened to people of Moses. Miracles have happened, we (Jews, Christians and Muslims) believe in it. You check your Hindu books, I'm sure you'll have some miracles listed there too.
God does not need to prove His strength or power to make us obey Him, He only showed SIGNS for us to believe His presence, even then people didn't believe in Him, now what do you call them? less than some 5 years old, right?
[quote]
on the contrary "Hadschar al Aswad" is considered holy and thought to sent by god himself.
The fact is, it is just a meteorite. And its nothing but 'meteorite worship'.
[/quote]
abay, kitni baar likhoon... are you rvikz or his clone? nobody worships this stone. God does not control this world only, even if you consider this "Hajr-e-Aswad" as a meteorite, we can still believe in that meteorite being sent by God. He controls universe, not just this earth.
The fact is that nobody even worships Kaaba, let alone Hajr-e-Aswad. Both entities are considered "sacred" only, but not "worthy of being prayed to", not "possess any power" etc.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Changez_like: *
Beta, you are born some 2500 or more years late to witness what happened to people of Moses. Miracles have happened, we (Jews, Christians and Muslims) believe in it. You check your Hindu books, I'm sure you'll have some miracles listed there too.
God does not need to prove His strength or power to make us obey Him, He only showed SIGNS for us to believe His presence, even then people didn't believe in Him, now what do you call them? less than some 5 years old, right?
abay, kitni baar likhoon... are you rvikz or his clone? nobody worships this stone. God does not control this world only, even if you consider this "Hajr-e-Aswad" as a meteorite, we can still believe in that meteorite being sent by God. He controls universe, not just this earth.
The fact is that nobody even worships Kaaba, let alone Hajr-e-Aswad. Both entities are considered "sacred" only, but not "worthy of being prayed to", not "possess any power" etc.
[/QUOTE]
did you ever ask the people coming out of mosque and temples
why you pray and what for?
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rvikz: *
what direction you pray to? what happens if you prayin opposite direction? worl going to clollapse? i can doexacltly what youare not suppose to do nothing will happen.
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you can even pray head-down-legs up, do whatever you want, its upto God to see and judge what you wanted to do and whether you followed His instructions.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rvikz: *
did you ever ask the people coming out of mosque and temples
why you pray and what for?
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I don't have to ask people coming out of mosque because I know why they pray. I never got chance to talk to people coming out of temples, so I don't know. There ain't enough sensible Hindus on this forum to ask, I have my knowledge of Hinduism whatever I gained from other books, sites and to limited extent from this forum.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Changez_like: *
I don't have to ask people coming out of mosque because I know why they pray. I never got chance to talk to people coming out of temples, so I don't know. There ain't enough sensible Hindus on this forum to ask, I have my knowledge of Hinduism whatever I gained from other books, sites and to limited extent from this forum.
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My dear Changezi, I could parade the most erudite hindu in front of you and you'd still say the same thing. Similary you could invite the most respected Maulana of the land to give an impassioned speech in front of hindus/jews/christians and they would listen politely then silently thank God for making them members of a superior religion. I've been to a few multi-mix theological meetings and they all end this way, trust me.
Does anyone beside me see the futility of trying to convince semi civilised people that they are inferior? Only tribals are willing to concede that and be saved.
Our precious time on GS can be more usefully spent on finding solutions to problems plagueing the world - like HOw to recycle your own rubbish in the food processor, or HOw to genetically modify Greeks to look like Bangledeshis.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by soul: *
this should include moslems too. They consider a black stone sacred. Just as rest of us who consider stone statue sacred....now if your arguement is, that black stone is not worshipped, but only allah ...than hindus too claim..they dont worship the statues but Bhagwan in that form.
So, how come you are allowed by allah...and not others?
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When our hindu freinds continue to ask us, why do 'muslims worship a black stone?', is it because they feel insecure about there own religion, can I ask? are not the muslims the best authority to answer that and for the upteenth time NO, we do not worship stones.
How can you compare Islam and hinduism in the first place, for one islam is the fastest growing way of life, hinduism on the other hand 25-50 yrs from now you'll only find in museums
apropos the black stone, aka hajr-e-aswad. isnt it true that it is actually a nabi who was somehow, for some reason, turned into stone or is that a fiction? what is the significance of hajr-e-aswad since it keeps recurring in the thread..
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by ravage: *
apropos the black stone, aka hajr-e-aswad. isnt it true that it is actually a nabi who was somehow, for some reason, turned into stone or is that a fiction? what is the significance of hajr-e-aswad since it keeps recurring in the thread..
[/QUOTE]
where did you get that one from? Satanic verses?
la hola wala toba toba
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ibn Sadique: *
Think the following Ayahs of the Noble Quran should answer all the above.
Of some messengers We have already told thee the story;of others We have not ; - and to Moses Allah spoke direct;- [Yusufali 4:164]
"To every people (was sent) an apostle: when their apostle comes (before them), the matter will be judged between them with justice, and they will not be wronged. (The Noble Quran, 10:47)"
"We did send apostles before thee, and appointed for them wives and children: and it was never the part of an apostle to bring a sign except as God permitted (or commanded). For each period is a Book (revealed). (The Noble Quran, 13:38)"
"We sent not an apostle except (to teach) in the language of his (own) people, in order to make (things) clear to them. Now God leaves straying those whom He pleases and guides whom He pleases: and He is Exalted in power, full of Wisdom. (The Noble Quran, 14:4)"
"For We assuredly sent amongst every People an apostle , (with the Command), "Serve God, and eschew Evil": of the People were some whom God guided, and some on whom error became inevitably (established). So travel through the earth, and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth). (The Noble Quran, 16:36)"
"Verily We have sent thee in truth, as a bearer of glad tidings, and as a Warner: and there never was a people, without a Warner having lived among them (in the past). (The Noble Quran, 35:24)"
We did aforetime send messengers before thee: of them there are some whose story We have related to thee, and some whose story We have not related to thee. It was not (possible) for any messenger to bring a sign except by the leave of Allah: but when the Command of Allah issued, the matter was decided in truth and justice, and there perished, there and then those who stood on Falsehoods. [Yusufali 40:78]
1) The Prophets of Allah (swt) were sent to all the Nations.
2) Some of Nations strayed into error after having received the Message. Their Messengers will be Witnessess against them.
3) All the Messengers sent are not mentioned in the Quran, but have been acknowledged to have been sent to other places, whose story has not been related.
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Very good response........i agree with u :K:
nadia, the topic is not on judaism and christnity. if you want to start the topic on them go ahead...i will post my views in it.
Hazrat Adam(AS) was the first human and first Prophet of God.
Allah(SWT) revealed his religion Islam to him and told him to
convey and communicate to his descendents. And to teach them that
Allah(SWT) is one, the creater, the Sustainer of the world; and that
he is the Lord of the Universe and He alone should be worshipped and obeyed; that to him they would have to return one day and Him alone
they should appeal for help;that they should live righteous lives in accordance with God's pleasure and that if they did so would be blessed and if they didnot they would suffer both here and in the hereafter.
PartI
Those of Adam's descendants who were good trod the right path, but those who were bad abandoned their father's teachings. Some began
to worship the sun, the moon and the stars;others took to the worship
of trees, animals and rivers.Some believed that air, water, fire, health and all the forces of Nature were each under control of a different god
and that favour of each one could be won by worship. In this way ignorance gave rise to many forms of polytheism and idolatory, and scores of religions were formulated. This was the age when Adam's progeny had spread over globe, and formed different races and nations.
Every nation had created a different religion for itself, each with rituals of its own.
God-The one Lord and Creator of Mankind was forgotten. every kind of evil custom grew; many evils began to be considered right and many right thing were either ignored or condemned as wrong.
Mr real ak, I think you are right. Many false theses of hindus today are a part of the museum, we had sati pratha, not long back we were very conservative against low casts, all foreigners were malechh for us. And we know to live with the new, that is our survival and how much we are afraid of islam, you are right, I am afraid of a taleban state, I am afraid of sharyat code non sense, I never want to live in an Islamic state, I want to reveal you a secrete that many of my muslims friends also do not want to live in a an islamic state.
At this stage God began to raise Prophets among every people. Each one reminded his people of lesson they had forgotten. They put an
end to idol-worship and the practice of associating other deities with God(shirk), did away with all customs of ignorance, taught them the right way of living in accordance with Gods pleasure, and gave them laws to be followed and enforced in every society.God's Prophets were raised
in every land and among every people. They all possessed one and the same religion-THE RELIGION OF ISLAM.
There is common misconception, that Islam owes its origin to
the PROPHET MUHAMMAD(blessings of Allah and peace be upon him)
and some of the writers even go to the exetn of calling him(SAW),the
founder of Islam. This is a travesty of truth of truth. Islam has been the
religion of all Prophets of God and all of them have brought the same message from him(SWT). Prophets have not been the founders of Islam;
they have only been messengers of it. Islam consists of Divine Revelation conveyed to mankind by truthful Prophets.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by chelaramani: *
Mr real ak, I think you are right. Many false theses of hindus today are a part of the museum, we had sati pratha, not long back we were very conservative against low casts, all foreigners were malechh for us. And we know to live with the new, that is our survival and how much we are afraid of islam, you are right, I am afraid of a taleban state, I am afraid of sharyat code non sense, I never want to live in an Islamic state, I want to reveal you a secrete that many of my muslims friends also do not want to live in a an islamic state.
[/QUOTE]
It was in May 17,1954, that the U.S Supreme Court ruled
that color discrimination in Universities was unjust and against
the principle of equality of man. Please note 1954.
"O people verily your Lord is One and your Father is one. All of you belong to Adam,and Adam was made of clay. There is no superiority
for an Arab over a non-Arab nor for a non-arab over an Arab;
nor for a white coloured over a black coloured nor for a black skinned over a white-skinned,except in piety. Verily, the noblest among you is
the most pious"
Oration of the Holy Prophet(SAW) on the occasion of Farewell Pilgrimage.
This was presented to MANKIND some 1400 years ago.