IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

Society Military and Strategic Issues
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Guys,

How true or accurate do you think this article is from Hindustan Times. Can the PAF neutralize the IAF ? They have many more aircrafts than us.

CM, ABdali, Malik - what are yr views ?

Converting the IAF’s edge into air supremacy
Kanwar Sandhu
(Chandigarh, January 16)

Though neither India nor Pakistan has the kind of air power that the US used against Iraq during the Gulf War and in Afghanistan recently, both countries will aim for early control of the skies. Unlike in previous wars, this time the Indian Air Force (IAF) has a clear edge.
But what remains to be seen is how soon it can achieve mastery of the skies to make a land offensive successful.

The IAF’s superiority is unmistakable, not only quantitatively but also qualitatively – a complete change from the 1965 war. While India has 770 combat aircraft, Pakistan has only 350. Besides the multi-role Mirage-2000 variants, the IAF has two squadrons of the SU-30 multi-role aircraft, which ranks among the best combat aircraft in the world. The Pakistan Air Force’s (PAF’s) only multi-role aircraft of any consequence is the ageing F-16; according to one estimate not more than 25 of them may be combat worthy. “Moreover, in air combat, the F-16 is no match for India’s MiG-29s,” feels Air Marshal M.M. Singh (retd), former Air Officer Commanding-in-Chief, Western Air Command.

During the 1965 war, though the PAF appeared to have a qualitative superiority over the IAF, it did not have the numbers to attempt air supremacy while also providing close support to ground troops.

In 1971, the PAF in the east was no match for the IAF. A squadron of PAF fighters was heavily outnumbered and was rendered useless as its Dhaka air base was put out of action by the IAF.

In the west, the PAF showed rare coordination with the Pakistan Army in attacks on the Chhamb, Shakargarh and Sialkot sectors by launching ground attack and interdiction sorties. But the Pakistani brass did not fully exploit the PAF’s potential in J&K and also in the Jaisalmer sector in Rajasthan during its daring but ill-planned and ill-fated division-level attack. In contrast, in the same battle, the IAF flew numerous sorties to bail out a besieged company in the desert in Longewala.

Pakistan’s ambitious plan to double its combat aircraft squadrons to 27 (with eight squadrons of the F-16) did not materialise. Though structured for offensive strategy, it is handicapped by low numbers of aircraft. So it isn’t surprising that the PAF has now placed greater emphasis on air defence to hold its own in a short-duration war.

Prior to India’s Operation Brasstacks military exercise in 1987, the concept of air defence in the tactical area was tried out, following which a Joint Air Defence Control Centre was created. Since some low-level missile systems are operational now, this could prove useful.

O the Pakistani side, some new concepts of effective air support were seen during the Zerb-i-Momin exercise in 1989. The Pakistani move to create an Army Air Defence Command was a result of the exercise. How this will interface with the PAF remains to be seen.

Much will depend on army-air force integration during hostilities. During the Kargil war, irritants in army-air force integration were evident. Also, while India’s attack helicopters are with the army, they are flown by IAF pilots. On the other hand, Pakistan has increasingly gone in for the American concept and created an Army Aviation Corps in which the attack helicopters are not only with the army but also flown by army pilots.

Like in earlier wars, the PAF would be able to provide effective support to its ground forces. But the IAF clearly scores in counter air operations and offensive air support for its strategic plans. Says Air Marshal D.S. Basra (retd), former AOC-in-C, Southern Air Command: “The IAF from being a tactical force in the 1965 and 1971 wars is poised for a strategic role in any future conflict.”

Both sides lack effective air borne early warning systems (AWACS), which help in information and target engagement. There is a strong possibility of Saudi Arabia making its US-made E-3A Sentry AWACS available to Pakistan. Though there has been talk of Indo-Israeli cooperation in this field, it will be subject to US clearance. Meanwhile, both will have to make do with indigenous versions.

There will be also technological surprises in the field of avionics, night combat and laser designation of targets.

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India has an edge in numbers across the board. Thats no secret.
However, wars are fought by men, not by weapons. Dont go by the US attacks on Afghanistan. That was a video game...not a war.

Indian airforce, contrary to what the writer says, is one of the most poorly trained air force in the world. Their equipment is one of the most poorly maintained, as is evident from their average biweekly work accidents.

Simply put, what India gains in numbers, it lacks in quality. Hence, it will be an even paced war at best. Perhaps the only significant technical edge that India has is the addition of BVR on some aircrafts, which Pakistan doesnt. BVR enables pilots to target objects beyond their visual range, so that could be a minor factor. But Pakistans air defence is huge as well. So once again, the bottom line is, its an even matchup, to say the least.

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Akif I could not have said it any better!!

True!!!

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[quote]
Originally posted by The_Jackal:
**Akif I could not have said it any better!!

True!!!**
[/quote]

yeah! 1 muslim= 10^6 kaffirs and QED.

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in any case, title is amusing. author seems to believe that IAF has capabilities but no power while PAF has hell lot of power but no capabilities.

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

** Pakistani Air Force has won every encounter against the Indian Air Force**

                                                                                                                                                                        Indian resources have naturally refuted and denied PAF air superiority over the FIVE times larger IAF in the 65 and 71 wars. Indian and Pakistani claims and counter claims are pointless on this subject as they tend to be biased and blurred with nationalism. The only way to assess this is through the neutral and qualified international opinion, which has now become aviation history. Check out autobiography of Gen. Chuck Yeagers (yes, the one who broke the sound barrier), who 'refereed' the 1971 war and flew up and down the region collecting wreckage of IAF aircraft shot down by the PAF. Here is what he says, "the Pakistanis scored a three-to-one kill ratio knocking out 102 Indian jets and losing 34 of their own. I am certain about the figures because I went out several times a day in a chopper and counted the wrecks below. I counted wrecks, documented them by serial numbers, identified the components such as engines and rocket pods" Now he is not exactly a Pakistani, is he?

read more ...... **

NOTE: Follow rules, did you read'em?
**

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

Looks like an very old article, Pakistan is not limited on F-16's & Mirages. We have others things in our arsenal too. IAF pride is Su-30 as mentioned in the article, too bad they have only two squadrons. Pakistan has clear edge on air defense. Just a reminder PAF chief said last month they have capability to shoot down American/Nato drones + aircrafts + missiles.

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

" the average PAF pilot is almost certainly possessed of superior skills when compared with, say, an average American pilot. As to those who are rated above average, they compare favourably to the very best "

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Bhai Jaan, in 21st century its the machine which is going to provide the results. Men are just clicking buttons (after looking at manuals)

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hmmm manuals... i would like to see you to manoeuvre by reading a manual

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i was being sarcastic :p

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

ANALYSIS -- Air Battle

The Pakistani Airforce launch an attack (dawn at the very least as all their attack aircraft are day fighters only, A-5, F-6 and Mirage V's) on forward Indian air bases, headquarters and weapon storage facilities in an attempt to gain as much of an initial advantage in the air and over Indian ground forces as is possible.

One of the greatest problems that the Pakistanis would face would be to prevent detection of their force for as long as possible and then evade Indian SAM sites and air defence aircraft. This would be a very difficult task as they would be facing modern interceptors and air superiority fighters all with a look-down shoot-down capability and a BVR capability ( AA-10, AA-12 and Super 530D AAM's). Along with this they would face SAM systems based around the Akash SAM guided by a phased array radar, the SA-3 Goa, SA-6 Gainful, SA-8b Gecko, the S300 series and numerous hand held SAM's, as well as the ZSU-23-4 and Tunguska M1 self propelled AAA systems. Without effective jamming the Pakistani attack force would suffer serious losses, while the lack of an anti-radar capability will also limit their ability to permanently remove these threats. (Note:- other than the F-16 no other PAF aircraft has a credible ECM capability other than RWR's.)

While the initial attack would make some headway due to surprise, it is unlikely that once the initial surprise of the IAF has worn off that the PAF will be able to maintain any real air superiority for any length of time. I would expect that the initial superiority of the PAF over the battlefield to last no more than one maybe two days. This is due the lack of dedicated attack aircraft which can sustain an attack on Indian bases as well as the lack of an all weather attack capability other than the 38 F-16, however it is unlikely than the PAF would put their only modern fighter into a ground attack role when it would be required to counter the modern fighters of the IAF.

Currently the PAF have only 54 A-5C attack aircraft, this does not compare well against India's 89 Jaguars, 120 MiG 27 and over 50 MiG 23BN (an attack variant of the MiG-23). In order to reinforce their attack aircraft numbers the PAF will have to draw on their fighter stocks in particular the F-7, Mirage III and Mirage V (Note:- these are in the process of being upgraded with new avionics including radars). Another weakness in the PAF's attack fleet is the lack of a night attack capability with all their attack aircraft and fighter-bombers being day fighters only with the exception of the F-16 and to some extent the Mirage III. Another draw back of the A-5C is that it's main mission avionics is based on the SH-1J or ABS1A optical sight as does the F-6. This lack of a night attack and PGM capability will seriously damage the PAF's ability to maintain pressure on the IAF and the only way that Pakistan will be able to gain a initial air superiority is to maintain pressure on IAF airfields.

Without the ability to sustain intensive ground attack operations without weakening the air defence capabilities of the PAF, Pakistan would find itself in the unpalatable position of having to chose between not maintaining a complete air defence network and sustaining an attack on India or maintaining a complete air defence and giving the IAF extra time to recover and initiate a counter attack. Neither situation is totally acceptable as both require a gamble the first in that the PAF do not get caught short in their defence and the second in that giving the IAF breathing space will not result in a turning of the battle against them due to a lack of an offensive capability against the Indian Army. The Pakistani government has identified this problem and is planing the acquisition of 150 FC-1 fighter/attack aircraft this should go a long way to improving the PAF's offensive and defensive capabilities, Pakistan is also looking into the possibility of purchasing up to 80 Mirage 2000's or alike fighters. Although the FC-1 with only an 8g limit would still be inferior to the MiG-29, Mirage 2000, Su-30MKI and the LCA.

It can be expected that both the PAF and IAF will take serious losses, with the PAF suffering losses of 30-50% and that IAF losses of 15-25%. The major advantage that India has is that it currently has a far greater number of modern aircraft in comparison to Pakistan. Unlike the last war the two countries will not be equipped with aircraft of similar capabilities with the Indian fleet being based around the MiG-29, Mirage 2000H, Su-30MKI, Jaguar and MiG-27M (with 125 MiG-21's to be upgraded to the MiG-21-93 standard that will give it the capability to carry the AA-11 Archer, AA-10 Alamo and AA-12 Adder AAM's). While the PAF is based on the F-16 Block 15 OUC, F-7 (MiG-21F) and the F-6 (MiG-19S Farmer-C) carrying the AIM-9 Sidewinder.

The PAF also lack any BVR capability which would be vital in both escort and air defence, although Pakistan is thought to have acquired 500 AIM-7 Sparrow's the do not have a launch platform for them as the only F-16's capable of launching the AIM-7 is the F-16 Block 15 ADF of the USAF. Currently Pakistan is looking into purchasing a BVR weapon from Denel, to counter India's acquisition of the AA-12 'Adder'.

While there is the belief that Pakistan would receive support from Islamic countries, it is possible that this aid would not be substantial, but rather clandestine in nature. This is due to the fact that most of the Arab states are now equipped with American and European aircraft and would seriously damage their relations with the West were they to get involve in a foreign conflict. This could result in restrictions on military aid as occurred to Saudi Arabia when their F-15's had their bomb racks held in the US when Israel expressed concern. Secondly there has been a massive increase in tensions between Islamic states and Israel and also between Islamic states. With this in mind it is unlikely that any of these states would want to damage their own security to help someone else. Currently Iran and Afghanistan are on the verge of open conflict after the massacre of nine Iranian diplomats and several thousand civilian supporters of opposition forces, in such a war Pakistan would definitely get drawn in. It also must be remembered that there is extreme tension between the Shiite and Sunni sects across the Islamic world and any war between a mainly Shiite and Sunni country could result in a fracture in the Islamic world.

In spite of this it is still probable that Saudi Arabia may loan Pakistan an AWACS aircraft as Russia has previously done with the Tu-126 Moss. It is also probable that if Saudi Arabia were to send Pakistan an AWACS that they would also send along at least one squadron of F-15 interceptors as escort for the AWACS as well as to defend the AWACS in operations. While an AWACS if would be a massive improvement in Pakistan's air defence capability, it is unlikely that Saudi Arabia would send more than 1 and without an airborne refuelling system and because of post flight maintenance the AWACS would probably be limited to 1 flight per day (with 12 hours on patrol). It is also possible that the United Arab Emirates would provide help in the form of Mirage 2000's. Another potential vulnerability of the Pakistani air force is its dependence on ground controlled intercept's, any attacks on control towers, command and control centres and the use of communications jamming could cause significant problems to airborne units which would find themselves isolated and due to the lack of effective radars unable to engage the enemy. This type of tactic would be particularly effective at night as it would allow Indian fighters to engage Pakistani units at long range at relatively low risk.

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

Wow this is an old article. Look to give you a general idea of how prepared we are. For every one sortie the IAF runs, we can run three. Meaning we can get more aircraft off the ground, into battle and faster than the IAF.

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

Pakistan has a splendid air defence command as well......and during a war scenario, IAF would have to cross at least 3 lines of air defence in order to make any headway. I wont say that PAF can overpower IAF, but at the very least, they can neutralize them, despite IAF's larger numbers. Our weak point, if any, is our navy. PAF and Army are far better trained and better equipped.
and in a war scenario, id be surprised if any executive decisions are deferred to zardari or gillani. It will very likely be Kayani in control.

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

Calm down war-lovers. Why can't you understand we need to find this menace TOGETHER. Jihadis hate you and Jihadis hate us. Let's kill em together.

KUCH PAL HUN TERE SATH ,,,,,,,,,,,
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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

you fight your extremists/jihadis/hindutva terrorists, and we'll fight our jihadis. how's that for a plan?

as long we dn't support each other's enemies to settle scores and get browny points and work with a sincere will to eliminate terrorism, both nations will succeed.

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

This is what we have been preaching from last sixty years but to no avail. Your country is not under your democratically elected officials but the chagrined armed forces. I would ask all of you to read these four articles on wikipedia to see the carnage caused by the war b/w out countries:-

Indo-Pakistani War of 1947
**
**Indo-Pakistani War of 1965

Indo-Pakistani War of 1971

*Kargil War
*
Though the reviews are in our favor but that is not the point, what I want to show is the no. of casualties on both sides. **

NOTE: Lets stick to topic at hand.
**

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Wow, I thought you were somnolent when you wrote it. Read "*List of aircraft of the Indian Air Force*

" on wikipedia and you will understand that as far as numbers and quality is concerned your country is on the back foot and ya it doesn't insinuate at all that your pilots are more brave or skilled than ours, it is just because there is no proof for that and we Indians don't indulge in the allegation business.:)

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Re: IAF Capabilities vs PAF Power

NOTE: Lets stick to topic.