Re: I Want To Believe...
Desire to communicate with God is very natural and most people have sought for it. There is a saying of Allama Iqbal's father that one cannot be a beleiver unless every verse of Quran descends upon ones heart like it did on Prophet's s.a.w heart. To me this means that untill the religious philosphy becomes a part of oneself, one cant be a true beleiver.
One thing that most people agree on is that communiation with God has to come from within.
Re: I Want To Believe...
@Afaaf- I don't know. I am sure God is angered by our actions but how do I know God will judge us on the Judgment day? Maybe there's no judgment at the end, maybe God just let us be once we die. I don't know there are too many human attributes we have assigned to God.
@cricketplaya- I don't call anyone Jahil for their beliefs. I did mention that scholars confuse me to no end. Scholars argue among themselves as if one knows better than the other. Religious scholars are not scientists, their knowledge is based on interpretations. For all you know, someone could find YOU to be the best religious scholar depends on what that person belief system is like. I said NO to scholars a long time ago. Islam is meant for everybody to understand and if you need a scholar to make you a good human then good luck!
Anyways, I will look up the scholars you mentioned. It can't hurt. Thanks :)
@Ambassador1- Religion is a hell of a lot more complicated then rocket science, depends how you look at it. It could be simple for you but for someone like me, it's the one thing that I can't understand! How do I keep it simple?
If I needed or wanted relaxants, I wouldn't be here. How do you know how productive/constructive I am? I work full time and I go to school part time. Whatever time I have left, I use it to run errands. Maybe you are right, I need to just back off and relax, but it's hard to relax when there's so much you could learn and do. I will try relaxing, it's an option. Maybe it's about time I visit a doctor.
@Decent6Chora- I agree with that. :)
Re: I Want To Believe...
Some confusions regarding religions can be sorted out on a forum but trying to understand religion online may be difficult. Its better you probe practically by meeting people(religious) face to face and discuss with them and observe them regarding Islam.
How do I bring myself to believe in the idea of hell and heaven, angels, or any of that stuff. I have no peace. Yes, I am ex-muslim. I was born in a Sunni Muslim Pakistani family. I have done my research on pretty much all religions but none of them make much sense.
Miss_ Noland, you should not feel alone. I have had same issues going back years. Today, I'm at point that I have given up on religion because it make no sense to me at all.
Re: I Want To Believe...
^^ My sister never understood mathematics, she use to call it silly and ridiculous making no sense what so ever... does that believe of her and many like her make Mathematics ridiculous or non-sense... ofcourse not....
If a mind with limited capability calls everything beyond its understanding non-sense... than every other thing on the earth can be classified as non-sense
As far as No- land is standing, that is interesting situation, the confusion, the questions the existence of Allah all mighty, the desire to be in direct communication with him... No-Man you are lucky that you reached at this stage, now just work on it... you'll find what you are looking for, just keep yourself open.. analyze things, ask as many questions as you want... your answers shall be answered... pursue it, try to compile your answers and think on it, develop deep observation-skills... just hang in there it is matter of time don't lose the path not everyone is blessed with this state of mind...
Re: I Want To Believe...
I have seen many of my friends, questioning their faith in their youth (in my case, Hindus & Sikhs) - but ultimately they find the answers they were seeking and become strong & firm.
Trust God, you will get the answers you seek and become a better person.
Miss Noland you contact with true muslims near to you. And talk with them in Positive Sence.
Well let start over by reinforcing certain aspects. First and foremost. Lets give salam to each other.
Secondly, Quran and hadith you may have studied are all but theory to you unless you put it to practice. The satisfaction and peace you seek will not come within reach unless you act upon it. Studying and pondering upon is one aspect but not the culmination of it.
Can I ask you to do something if you do not already ? Start praying five times a day and make dua with each prayer. Push yourself to make an effort in this regard, you may not get all five but certainly try as many as you can. Don’t blindly pray, read up the translations and tafsirs of what you recite during prayer. Prayer is how Allah SWT has asked us to communicate with him and seek guidance from him. For that is the purpose of the reciting Surah Fatiha in prayer and also the reason that a prayer without Surah Fatiha is not accepted. Especially make Dua after each prayer. Your Dua means nothing if you do not realize that Allah SWT knows what is better for you more than you would know. Without this understanding you’ll be stuck on why aren’t my Duas answered. Sometimes what you ask is fulfilled but it takes some hindsight to realize that as well because it make not be immediate as you expect. When you pray try to find yourself calm and easy going. Don’t rush and try not to think about worldly matters, which will inevitably happen. It takes a real effort to find peace in prayer and that doesn’t just come. It has to be a conscious effort. Your intentions have to be the same as your actions.
Actually I would not view Islam as more modern. Maybe it puts a better buzz around it for people today however if you muse a little deeper about this thought of yours, its because there is truth in it that seems timeless. Not because it is more modern. Past, present and future are all functions of time. Modernity is subject to future events. 100 years from now we may not be as modern as we project ourselves to be. The truths about the fundamentals upon which Islam erects itself are not subject to time. I think if you give more specifics maybe I can make an effort to further elucidate.
Very interesting choice of words i.e. supernatural. We humans and everything in this universe is natural for us and we are subject to it. Supernatural is a relative term, many things in nature are not yet discovered or even explained, hence supernatural to us. There are certain things which are not subject to nature at all, for instance, Allah SWT. Afterall Allah SWT created natural phenomenon and bounds under which laws govern it. Why do heaven and hell, angels appears supernatural to you?
Would you not want people who live dishonest, cruel and hate filled lives to be questioned of their actions?
Salaam
Religion is confusing because the 'experts' (religious scholars) look at the Word of GOD (Quran) in light of the words of men (Bukhari Hadith & Sunnah) in order to abrogate clear Quranic verses and extract a certain meaning to support their innovations. This is what has happened with ALL religions. They have distorted the truth to conform to their wishes. Consequently, there are lots of wars, killing, poverty, hatred, and atrocities on earth. All in the name of religion.
[Quran 23:71] Indeed, if the truth conformed to their wishes, there would be chaos in the heavens and the earth; everything in them would be corrupted. We have given them their proof, but they are disregarding their proof.
If only people would just READ the Quran. After all, the first revelation was 'READ, in the name of you Lord', not 'RECITE'. Any parrot can recite words, but the verse says 'READ', which implies comprehending what you are reading. It is amazing how so many muslims say that 'you cannot understand the Quran', yet turn to man-made books to 'interpret' the Quran. This way of thinking blasphemously devalues GOD. It is a great insult to GOD to believe that HE does not know how to communicate with HIS own creations and 'NEEDS' pathetic little humans (scholars) to explain it. I guess they do not believe or trust GOD when HE tells them repeated in the Quran (sura 54):
[54:17] We made the Quran easy to learn. Does any of you wish to learn?
[54:22] We made the Quran easy to learn. Does any of you wish to learn?
[54:32] We made the Quran easy to learn. Does any of you wish to learn?
[54:40] We made the Quran easy to learn. Does any of you wish to learn?
peace
U seriously need to find something else to say. Every post of urs is nothing but heaping criticism on hadith. You’ve been proved wrong countless times. Whenever a discussion with requires evidence to supoport what you say your tail gets frozen stiff between your legs. Have some self-respect.
I’ve emboldened something in ur post. Kindly present historical evidence of where it says about the first verse being revealed. It doesn’t say in the Quran about which verse is the first verse revealed. The only place this is mentioned is the ahadith, which you keep denying yet all your reasons are always based on material borrowed from ahadith. I know your not going to reply or your reply will some accusation about following Bukhari and other hadith scholars. Truly, what a shameless attitude you have.
Peace Miss_Noland
You said,
".... The basic aspects of Iman don't make much sense but at the end, I so want to believe! ..."
The desire to believe leads to belief ... it is meaningless to extend the conversation beyond your desire to believe. Rationale and reason are only tools to bring about that "desire" to believe ... the rest comes with Guidance.
That ... no one can give you except God Himself. For the time being at least ... I don't think it is unfair to say that provided you really mean what you say about "wanting to believe" that this is the first step of belief which means you are already in the domain of those who believe.
Those people who are disbelievers hence are only so because they do not want to believe ... i.e. they turn away from guidance and belie it. You on the other hand by your own words cannot be the same as them.
Great Reply,
2 cents of mine, if a person start questioning the quranic verses and start asking questions e.g. starting from Sura’ul’Baqra 2nd ayaa (interpretation) “This is the book without any fault” now the the La’raib should be underlined and one can start from here.. how a book written by a Person (SAAW) who never received formal or in-formal education in this world can be without a fault/doubt?
This can be starting point for you No-Land..
This is what Allah swt has to say to you Miss Noland:
*
And if he draws near to Me an arm's length, I draw near to him a fathom's length*. And if he comes to Me walking, I go to him at speed
Subhanallah!
lol…You keep saying I have no argument, yet I keep quoting the Quran. You know…the word of GOD. Or perhaps you have forsaken the Quran for ‘other’ sources of religious guidance.
So, here I go again quoting consecutive verses in the Quran…and again, you are going to tell me I have no basis. That I have taken verses 'out of context, and that I need hadith to understand such a clear revelation from GOD.**[Quran 25:27] The day will come when the transgressor will bite his hands (in anguish) and say, "Alas, I wish I had followed the path with the messenger. **
**[25:28] “Alas, woe to me, I wish I did not take that person as a friend. **
**[25:29] “He has led me away from the message AFTER it came to me. Indeed, the devil lets down his human victims.” **
[25:30] The messenger said, “My Lord, MY PEOPLE (muslims) have deserted THIS Quran.”
These verses refer to people whom satan duped AFTER they became muslims. Then, immediately after, the Prophet Muhammad will say to GOD, “My Lord, MY people have DESERTED THIS Quran.” If you pay close attention to the first verse (25:27) you will notice the duped muslims will say 'alas, I wish I had FOLLOWED THE PATH WITH THE MESSENGER”…and what path was that?.. well, 25:30 above should answer that question for you, if you are a sincere heart.
I do not post responses for you. You have already made up your mind and are blinded. I put what the Quran says for others on this forum who think for themselves. If I started trusting your opinions of Islam, I would be the one saying verses 25:28-29 (stated above) on the day of Judgment.
Peace
^ Then what's the point of having a functional brain? We naturally resist things we don't understand, no?
*so that human being uses it. so that you don't need to walk withGod's little finger.
*
If you don't call a friend for ages as a example, will he ever come to you with a helping hand curing all your problems? What means "When I sometimes ask to God for giving me an answer"?
What kind of an answer are you expecting? And only sometimes? If you need signs to prove his rationality, truth and existence you need to communicate with God daily. He gave you a functional brain to understand his words. He says pray five times to me and make dua daily. I will come and answer. If you don't even have 1 hour for God in a 24h day. What can you expect?
man proposes, god disposes...
nothing is contradicting with the Qur'an...Contradicting are the minds.
Re: I Want To Believe...
Miss Noland!
Great answers above among some not so great answers.
Belief on anything religious comes from heart not mind. Religion is not science.
You have a great noble quest and one just needs to continue to search for answers with open heart.
You mentioned certain items of beliefs which are not 'physical' or 'material' like believing on heaven hell, day of judgment etc.
Now, you mentioned you believe on supreme being. That is also not physical or material.
You might be believing it on the basis of circumstantial evidences.like the earth, moon, day and night, weakness and powers of being human etc.
All religions talk about hell, heaven or whatever.
When someone believes on God then it is easier to believe on the rest.
one other lesser way of thinking is:
Not believing does not help so why not believe? It might help!
*Certainly if hell or heaven are there, believing on them will help. If they do not exist then what is the loss? Believe on them and go on to do the good work in this world! At least you got your peace of mind this way.
*
Re: I Want To Believe...
Thanks everyone..... I appreciate all your comments. I don't have a whole lot of time to try to do everything at once but I will start out with praying and reading the Quran again (perhaps with an open believing mind this time). I am NoT going to any scholar nor am I keen on reading Al-Bukhari complilation of Hadith, I have read them before and something doesn't feel so holy about them.
P.S. I am thinking of joining Peace Corps or AmeriCorps. I am in the process of finding more information about the events and places I can volunteer.
Re: I Want To Believe…
One of the excellent question that i ever came across on any discussions. Before saying anything .. just let me tell you .. I came across the same situations … I was restless. The only thing that i could do is to do research .. ..
Like you have done and you have came up to the conclusion that islam is the best among all .. thats the conclusion that you can get after your research .. and your peace is not gona be achieved from this research. The peace that you are gona get is just because of belief .. that you have to build up ..
Regarding your anxiety and questions that comes to your mind when you learn more about islam .. the simples answer that i have concluded is that .. everything of islam makes sense and if it does not then its just becuase of that we don’t have enough mentality (sha’oor) to think about it .. to understand this concept .. try to imagine or try to create a living creature by yourself .. .. not matter what kind alien you will create on paper .. you will definiiitely try to make its eyes, ears, mouth etc .. WHY? because its our unconcious believe that every living thing must have these things. Even our imaginations are bound within the boundaries of this world then how come we can understand the concepts of 7 skies, the heaven and the hell ?? think about it.
now come up to the thing justifications .. .. i can explain you about it but then its gona be too long .. in simple words .. .. we try to make a judgemental statement on what we see and we totally overlook what reason it may have or what result it will give.
There is nothing like free cup of coffee, if God is gona make you happy then he will gona test you enough to give you the Gift that is for you .. and during that testing you make judgmental statements that “Why me” .. etc .. .. something related to that i wrote in my blog on the following post .. Can we really change our destiny? Something for life
Ever since i realized this reality, you would not believe how blindly believe in God and Quran. There is a difference between “saying” " i believe in God" and “believing” I believe in God and it only comes with patience and trying to look at your life from different perspective.
I hope this thread will help you 
P.S:
forgot to answer your question “what if there is no judgement day”.. .. lets prove this mathematically .. there could be 2 options ..
1: judgment day
2: no judgment day .. ..
if you don’t pracitce your religion then you are going to be screwed if there is gona be judgment day .. bt if you practice then you are okay in both cases .. so what is desirable? a 50% probablity or 100%?