Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
Guys let me tell you Punjab govt has to pay around 43 lakh rupees daily to Turkish company bcz for first month its free travelling and then after month this project will earn finance
So means the project is in loss in its start :D
Anyhow Im not against this project .........But the timing of this project is not good and in long term prospect I dont see a good future
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
Good job done -
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
congratulations, great project
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
The project looks good but as Ali said government should 'facilitate' such projects but should not setup and operate such projects otherwise they become 'white elephants' soon.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
Shahbaz has this penchant for government sponsored social schemes. So much so that now PMLN looks like a socialist party more than PPP.
While many people like such government funded projects, I have always maintained that such projects are not in public interest in the long run.
The government is saying that people will get free rides for a month and then subsidized fares after that. Actually, nothing is either cheap or subsided. It is people's own money, which government has collected in other ways. Obviously the money is not coming from Ittefaq foundries.
Instead of fooling people with projects where a government spends people's own money on themselves (and get the "free" credit), a government's job is actually to create business friendly environment which results in job growth and increase in salaries.
BTW, the project itself may be good. The only thing I don't like is government intervention in it.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
While many people like such government funded projects, I have always maintained that such projects are not in public interest in the long run.
Agreed, if not properly run we could have another white elephant in the list. Its better that the government focuses more on governance and leave these kind of projects to the private sector. One pertinent example we already have is of Daewoo company with regards to motorway.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
Shahbaz has this penchant for government sponsored social schemes. So much so that now PMLN looks like a socialist party more than PPP. While many people like such government funded projects, I have always maintained that such projects are not in public interest in the long run.
The government is saying that people will get free rides for a month and then subsidized fares after that. Actually, nothing is either cheap or subsided. It is people's own money, which government has collected in other ways. Obviously the money is not coming from Ittefaq foundries.
Instead of fooling people with projects where a government spends people's own money on themselves (and get the "free" credit), a government's job is actually to create business friendly environment which results in job growth and increase in salaries.
BTW, the project itself may be good. The only thing I don't like is government intervention in it.
ummmm... it is a NORM in almost all countries that government either build infrastructure projects themselves or subsidize them. Almost ALL rapid transit systems in the world that I am aware of were initiated by the governments and either are run by government themselves, or government owns substantial shares in the organization running it or are operated by private parties which are heavily regulated and most of the times subsidized. Please provide me an example of a mass transit system anywhere that was developed by private parties, without government's massive help in either infrastructure development or in shape of heavy financial subsidy.
Self projection using these projects is wrong, and it is not Shahbaz Sharif's pocket that is bearing the cost. The idea that he got this DONE is an achievement and shows intent, which is lacking in most of our departments. At least it is not being called Shaheed Mohtarma Benazir Bhutto Bus Transit System. And do you remember the fanfare when the useless (and later stolen) fountain was installed off-Karachi coast?
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
My point was not just about transit projects but about the concept of government funded projects in theory.
Most of such rapid transit projects are in Europe, where most countries have socialist or socialist leaning governments. For example, Germany and France.
But just because these countries can afford to subsidize their projects, it doesn't mean that the theory of government intervention is accurate.
If you ask many people from these countries then they will say that a lot of their problems are due to the socialist policies of their governments.
Even US has a lot of such programs, like social security, food stamps, etc. And they have a lot of debate going on whether such programs are feasible when their government is facing huge budgetary deficits. Such programs are major chunk of these deficits.
It is understandable for a government to subsidize a project so that it takes roots. But doing so continuously is not good. And Shahbaz being a socialist continues to waste people's money on schemes like Sasti Roti, and Peeli taxi.
Such projects have cost people billions in rupees, but they continue to appreciate Shahbaz for fleecing them only to make himself look good.
this project as well looks nothing more than a political gimmick. Just like PPP's idea of Benazir income support program.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
My point was not just about transit projects but about the concept of government funded projects in theory. Most of such rapid transit projects are in Europe, where most countries have socialist or socialist leaning governments. For example, Germany and France.
C'mon... I asked you to find an example from the WHOLE WORLD. Rapid transit systems, Rail Mass Transit Systems, Highways, and such.
For now, find me an example of a rapid transit system in USA or Canada (hopefully you don't consider Obama socialist too) which is run without intervention of local government (intervention includes funding and subsidy).
Local governments ARE responsible for providing infrastructure for better transport. Pakistan desperately needs them. With so many cars already in place, we need more buses or rails or we'll all die of choking to fumes.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
ummmm... it is a NORM in almost all countries that government either build infrastructure projects themselves or subsidize them. Almost ALL rapid transit systems in the world that I am aware of were initiated by the governments and either are run by government themselves, or government owns substantial shares in the organization running it or are operated by private parties which are heavily regulated and most of the times subsidized.
It is the norm in countries where basic necessities are covered, and funding is available. Pakistan does not have the luxury of going for such projects at public expense, when basic necessities like power, gas, jobs are not even tackled, let alone covered.
Claiming this project as a victory is similar to PPP claiming that the employment rate has risen in their tenure, as they have given jobs to 50,000 people. What they dont understand is that those 50,000 people will be paid out of the exchequer, and it will be a zero sum game for the public at large.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
It is the norm in countries where basic necessities are covered, and funding is available. Pakistan does not have the luxury of going for such projects at public expense, when basic necessities like power, gas, jobs are not even tackled, let alone covered.
Claiming this project as a victory is similar to PPP claiming that the employment rate has risen in their tenure, as they have given jobs to 50,000 people. What they dont understand is that those 50,000 people will be paid out of the exchequer, and it will be a zero sum game for the public at large.
I agree with you that education, health and basic necessities should be the priorities of governments. I was just replying to Khoji's assertion that government should not fund infrastructure projects at all.
My personal opinion is that education should be the first priority, followed by health. Infrastructure is an important part of government's responsibility too and lack of proper transport system hinders economic development. Power, Water, Sanitation and Gas are part of infrastructure as well. Delhi has a major poverty problem but the economy got a nice boost from the metro rail they installed over last few years. Mass transit systems (rail and public buses) also improve the air quality. We could not have Metro Rail systems because they require much more funding and electricity, both of which are short.
There would have been corruption in the project. There would be several deficiencies in the system but this is still better than the Chaudhries' Lahore Mass Rail Transit system that never could get past the feasibility study stages. I just hope this is the first, and within the next decade we have a network of such transport systems in all major cities. I would definitely prefer taking a bus to driving in the mad Lahore traffic, if it is convenient and accessible.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
I agree with you that education, health and basic necessities should be the priorities of governments. I was just replying to Khoji's assertion that *government should not fund infrastructure projects at all. * .
That is not what I said. You are reading between the lines.
I did not say that government should not FUND infrastructure projects. I said government should not RUN infrastructure projects. That is, there should not be government intervention or subsidy. Rather a project should be financially feasible enough to run itself without any help. Otherwise it will become a liability sooner or later.
Government subsidy is people's own money, which government has taken from people various other ways.
if government wants to provide people relief then instead of subsidizing projects like this, it can instead lower the taxes on petroleum products, for example.
who can argue that people don't need rapid transit system like this one? No one.
But if such a project is too luxurious for Pakistani people to afford without government subsidies then the govenrment probably should cut down the costs to make it economically feasible.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
لاÛورمیٹرو بس سے اچھا Ù…Ù†ØµÙˆØ¨Û Ú©Ø±Ø§Ú†ÛŒ میں شروع کریں گے،آغاسراج ˆ](http://www.express.pk/story/89604/)
http://www.paklinks.com/gsmedia/files/100227/karachi.jpg
Very good, Karachi really needs this type of service :k: chalo acha hay public par bhi paisay lagay ga.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
I know its useless to argu with ppl as every one is absoltely right but i think something is better nothing. Its Public money and if someone spending this money on them so what’s wrong? So, isn’t it better to spent money on public project rather then to keep in pocket like other politicians ? I know people’s hate always force them to criticizie others even if someone do a good job. Even Zardari did a great job by hadning over Gawadar Port Management to China but no one appreicated him rather then to pointing his faults. Yes he is corrupt and I also criticize him but why we never appreciate others on their good deeds ?
People starting actling like so called intellectuals and start saying health, educaton bala bla is more important so why this project ? This project has been completed so its better not to cry over split of milk. This was a basic need of Lahore and many people will get benefit from this services.
Another joke!
Aik Peer Sahib buhat naami garami thay leekan unn key bagum unn key tareef naheen karti thi aur har waqat nuqas nikalti thi 
Aik din unhoon nay hawa main urrna shuru kia aur apni khirki kay pass say guzray jahan par unn key begum khari thi 
thori dair baad ghar aay to begum nay kahan tum khaak peer sb. banay phirtay ho main nay abhi abhi aik shakhas ko hawa main urtay daikha hay kia baat thi uss key 
Peer sb. nay fakhria andaz main kaha woh main he tha 
Bivi nay foran mun banaya aur kaha tabhi main bhi kahon thairay mairhay keon urr rahay thay 
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
I know its useless to argu with ppl as every one is absoltely right but i think something is better nothing. Its Public money and if someone spending this money on them so what's wrong? So, isn't it better to spent money on public project rather then to keep in pocket like other politicians ?
Noone wants it to fail. But there has to be a proper feasibility study for such a major expenditure. Its public money after all. And for your comment that this money is being spent on the public, then why not follow PPP's lead, and provide each and every Pakistani a government job? Unemployment goes to 0, and its public money 'being spent on the public' in your own words.
Prioritization is very important. Otherwise it leaves the govt with no money for stuff that is far more vital. Do you even know how much in debt the Punjab govt is at this stage after the laptop scheme and metrobus scheme? Do you know how much in debt the central govt is? Dollar has touched 100, and forex reserves are at a level not seen in 10+ years. Metrobus will require a monthly infusion of 1 billion rupees for a long time to come, and guess where that money will come from?
Feasibility and priority...2 key words.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
Shahbaz Sharif is a drama queen, all his previous schemes such as sasti roti etc went down the gutter causing billions of losses to the government. Instead of this drama he should have spent money on reducing load shedding.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
jasos, there is no doubt the project will help people. Any such project with ANY intention will provide some benefits even if it is laptop, Benazir Income Support etc but you MUST prioritize the projects otherwise you will miserably FAIL. Just tell me if you don't find the below figures shocking:
The economics behind the Lahore Metro Bus Service
This is reckless spending which matches the obsessive behaviour of emperors from not so democratic times. PHOTO: AFP
According to the Punjab government, 30 billion rupees is the amount of money spent on the Lahore Metro Bus Service. The actual figure may be a lot more, but let’s just take their word for it and apply a bit of perspective to it instead.
Overall the entire allocated money for Punjab development is Rs63 billion which means that 50% or half of the development budget of Punjab was spent in Lahore.
This excludes the cost of the numerous underpasses and overhead bridges that were built in Lahore.
Compare this Rs30 billion to the Rs16.5 billion allocated to the health sector for the entire province of Punjab. Just imagine if this same budget, allocated to the metro service was spent on the health sector instead.
A state of the art hospital like the recently developed Rawalpindi Institute of Cardiology was built within Rs2.8 billion, taking that as our benchmark, we would have been able to build 10 such hospitals with the RS30 billion spent on the Metro Bus!
An interesting perspective, right?
Compare this with the Rs25 billion development budget for education in Punjab for the current year. From this 25 billion a total of Rs5 billion was spent on giving away laptops. Although the goodwill gesture behind the act remains, pragmatism is in severe dearth. Unfortunately, the schools in this country lack basic infrastructure, sanitation and clean drinking water – laptops are a far off dream.
Some may think Punjab as a province is able to afford such shenanigans but a close look at the economic situation of the province gives a very different picture.
In these hard economic times, under the PPP government, it is Punjab that is the worst performing province.
The province’s annual average growth rate of 2.5% between 2007 and 2011 lagged far behind the 3.4% for the rest of Pakistan, according to the Lahore-based Institute of Public Policy (IPP). Over 83% of the Rs783 billion Punjab budget for the current year will be financed by federal transfers and 12% by provincial tax revenue.
The more worrying factor is that Punjab is generating very little revenue of its own and the provincial government has completely failed to address this problem, in fact it is making it worse by spending billions on projects which will further strain the treasury.
Interestingly, very little is being said about the running cost of the Metro Bus Service as the costs have not been ‘calculated yet’ but conservative estimates are that the subsidies would cost the government a minimum of Rs1 billion a year.
This project has the potential to become another state owned bleeding giant.
This is reckless spending which matches the obsessive behaviour of emperors from not so democratic times. Pakistan is set for harder times economically and the leaders are demonstrating absolutely no sense what so ever or any serious intent to address the actual problems this country faces.
I believe that the Metro Bus Service has nothing to offer this country except further economic misery.
[FONT=verdana, geneva, lucida, lucida grande, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]Read more by Faraz here, or follow him on Twitter @feeraz_khan
Do you think it's wise to spend Rs 30 Billion on this project when entire Punjab's HEALTH budget is only Rs 16 Billion
Is it also wise to spend Rs 25 Billion on education but Rs 30 Billion on half a city?
Also spending 20% of education budget on laptops? Fact is that no one would have noticed if Rs 5 Billion was spent on improvement of schools. Another fact is that no one would have noticed if Rs 30 Billion was spent on improving health or education facilities but obviously whole Pakistan watched when Rapid Bus project was launched so we know exactly why these sort of projects are initiated.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
C'mon... I asked you to find an example from the WHOLE WORLD. Rapid transit systems, Rail Mass Transit Systems, Highways, and such.
For now, find me an example of a rapid transit system in USA or Canada (hopefully you don't consider Obama socialist too) which is run without intervention of local government (intervention includes funding and subsidy).
Local governments ARE responsible for providing infrastructure for better transport. Pakistan desperately needs them. With so many cars already in place, we need more buses or rails or we'll all die of choking to fumes.
The transport department in most countries is either run by the government or regulated like you have mentioned. The issue we have in Pakistan is that the project's that go into the hands of government usually turn into white elephants (like Railways, NHA and PIA) after a while; the reason being corruption, incompetence and over staffing etc. Keeping in view Pakistan's circumstances I believe it would have made sense if it were run in the private sector with the government watching it closely. The government has spent a substantial amount on this project and no one would want it to go down the drain. I'd like to know more about the feasibility study of this project and how the government plans to run it for the next 5 years.
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
http://www.express.com.pk/images/NP_LHE/20130212/Sub_Images/1101753770-2.gif
Shayad kay tairay dil main uttar jay mairi baat :hinna:
http://www.express.com.pk/images/NP_LHE/20130212/Sub_Images/1101753770-2.gif
Re: I want to appreciate Shahbaz Sharif - (Metro Bus)
