how many of you educated in madrassa?

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
21

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Talwar: *

Yeah, and some retards enjoy naming themselves after condiments ;)
[/QUOTE]

Yes Mr Talwar
I will answer u in a very civilised manner ;)

Actually I tried every name under the sun , but all were taken it was near lunch time and I was quite hungry ..... and what do I find on the table Poodenay_ki..... so I just gave it a try and it got accepted .
i am not givin clarifications to u its rather all the ppl who asked me.

PS Mr talwar if there is allot of information above and u cant take it all in one go ... tell rizvik to translate or rephrase it in simple english for u .

22

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ana: *
Any ideas on where to start?
[/QUOTE]

Check out the Human Development Foundation. You may want to get involved with our education initiatives.

23

Gudia

I justy noted the name of one organisation which has numerous education initiatives in place in Pakistan. The group is US based and is looking at grassroots level and self sustaining programs including schools in rural areas as well as urban "kacchi abadis" You should look into it.

to the rest. can we please just keep this discussion clean of personal attacks..and not let our headaches, hunger or temper affect the discussion of an interestng subject. Thanks

24

Zulfi - that is no way to talk to a lady O Foulmouthed One. And I do know about Madrassahs, esp. rural gaon/poat-based ones. I do NOT like them.

Fraudia - I already am an HDF member (and btw u have told me about it twice). Any other ideas?

25

When I was young I used to go to the madrassas after school to learn quran recitation from Maulvi.

These western idiots have just given maddrassas a bad name.

26

Am I seeing curse words on the forum? Since when are those allowed?

Honestly, D.A. Zulfi, you can be polite ya know. After all, Ana is a lady. And that's no way for a acha muslim to talk to a woman.

O wait, are u even supposed to be talking to a woman?

shakes head at silliness and walks away

PS. Fraudia, that is very interesting! Could you provide me the name of that foundation? We're thinking of forming a PSA here out at the University and perhaps PSA can help them out?

27

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Poodenay_Ki_Chutney: *

Yes Mr Talwar
I will answer u in a very civilised manner ;)

Actually I tried every name under the sun , but all were taken it was near lunch time and I was quite hungry ..... and what do I find on the table Poodenay_ki..... so I just gave it a try and it got accepted .
i am not givin clarifications to u its rather all the ppl who asked me.

[/QUOTE]

That's one of the first probably honest answer from the other side. Why not, nice name. Like that stuff and it's healthy too.

28

[QUOTE]
When I was young I used to go to the madrassas after school to learn quran recitation from Maulvi.
These western idiots have just given maddrassas a bad name
[/QUOTE]

exactly man. These freggin' people had never even heard the word
madrassa pre 9-11.

Now these so called literate minds of the west (including muslims) are
making futile debates over madrassas. Why? because they teach
Quran..... Ana finds rural area madrassas bad and deosn't like'em,
so this gives her the right to stereotype the nation and the world's
madressas.

29

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ana: *
Fraudia - I already am an HDF member (and btw u have told me about it twice). Any other ideas?
[/QUOTE]

good. I dont think you had told me after the first time i told u that u were involved with HDF or I missed it. Anyways, there also is pakistan educational fund. Othe rthan that u and your family can also establish scholarships for underpreviliged children to go to different schools.

30

This is a very interesting subject,i wonder if someone could tell me what the Pakistani system is for education?

Does the goverment help at all,or is it either pay or go to a madrassa?

31

I study in a Madrassa in the UAE, which not only has the Hifz e Quran and strong Islamic teachings but it is also one of the most famous O and A level Exam Centre in the entire UAE. British Education in the light of Islam! (BTW, every school is called a madrassa in the UAE ;) )

32

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Braveheart: *
This is a very interesting subject,i wonder if someone could tell me what the Pakistani system is for education?

Does the goverment help at all,or is it either pay or go to a madrassa?
[/QUOTE]

Braveheart

government schools are very inexpensive..at all levels. elementary, secondary, even university education. At an elementary and secondary level schools suffer from low funding, etc. There are good, mediocre and bad government schools.

There are many private schools that supplement government schools, some of these private schools are very expensive, others are affordable by your average middle class person.

Then you have madrassas, and there are madrassas of all kinds, some charge nominal fees, some are free, some are the type where kids live there some are the type where kids only go study there.

So why madrassas..

the 2 major factors are that the government and private school system is not available to everyone..cost could be an issue, proximity can be an issue especially in rural areas, and the biggest factor is family situation and dynamics. the middle class in Pakistan is not as large as people may think..there are many poor people living hand to mouth who cant afford the schools either due to cost or more often due to opportunity cost.

We have seen, heard or read accounts of child labor in Pakistan..now if your kid is also an important bread winner for the family, will you really send him to school? some do..many dont. In this case..people..usually the poor and uneducated ones, just send them to madrassa for a few years..while the kids work as well..just so their kids will learn something and at least understand the religion etc.

The other breed of madrassas, the ones where the kids study as well as live, usually make the family offers like..your son will be educated but you will have no expense, the lodging, boarding etc is paid for by the madrassa. The get funds from donations as well as fundraising activities.

To put things in perspective..in pakistan some poor people almost sell their kids into child labor..i.e. some carpet weaving place will offer some guy some money and say now your kid works for us etc etc. Many people have taken that money because that way their financial condition is improved and their kid is working in an industry. Madrassa's taking over seems much better of an option.

madrassas served a great purpose, they helped educate orphans, as well as kids from poor families who either could not afford to send kids to another school or could not afford the opportunity cost of the kids schooling. Madrassas also supplemented religious education for kids going to regular schools..and served like "sunday schools"

But every institution if not monitored or regulated has a capability to be abused. Fanatics have used this as a platform because who is really bothered right now what they teach the orphans or the poor kids, these are the kids that society had turned its back on. Extremists who inflitrated this system used it to their advantage because no one else was looking, no one else could be bothered. I mean you are talking about a country where there are begger rings..kids are crippled and left on street corners to beg..and earn money for ring leaders. if society as a whole would consider thatan issue but do little to stop that..would they really care about kids in some sort of educational institute?

Mdarassas serve a great purpose, they fill an important gap left in our educational system, but they need to have some sort of oversight and regulation to see that kids are treated right and kids are really learning.

There is a madrassa in an area where my grandfather used to live. the kids always did fundraisers, were polite, well mannered and decent people. I had been asked on a number of occassions to go talk to them about UK or USA and answer their questions about life and all here as part of their social education program. I know other madrassas like this exist. We can not use the abuse of this system by extremists as a reason to just shut them off..regulation and management is the key.

33

regulation and management is the key.

You and I accept this. But when Mush's government stands up and says that all Madrassas must register with the government to operate, you have mullahs vowing to kill Mush in the name of Islam, for he has done ill by wanting to regulate the upholders of the Faith and it does not go down well in Heaven!

Seriously, it seems to me at times, that whenever someone tries to do something Good in that country, they get threatened with Death!

34

Thank you Mr.F for your enlightenment.It would seem that Musharef would be wise to regulate these places,it is easy to see how they have been abused by extremists.

35

Gudia

There are a couple of things here

1) Aside from government there has to be a public uproar about this. We are too apathetic..if it does nto affect me or my family, I will nto do anything about it..thats the type of sentiment that exists. You may think something is wrong or bad but not take a step to stop it.

2) The violence and death threats...meant to keep people away, and meant to scare the people already involved in initiatives to sort issues, not just this one..but others as well. we dinn care about the madrassas or who was there because it did not affect us. the sectarian violence..how many of us thought it was bad, talked big about it over tea and papay..but that was the extent of our efforts. and sadly how many of us have been so manipulated that we let stuff go by..look at sectarian violence.

3) The real religious leaders, the real scholars, they have to take an active role in it and be open and public about this stuff. Their silence means we only hear the rantings of the quasi religious-political power hungry folks who use religion only as a political tool.

Braveheart

Thank you for your interest in this topic. Regulating these would be a rather involved job..diff madrassas follow not just different sects but different schools of thought within that sect. Imagine southern methodist, cathlolics, anglicans, 7th day adventist, mormon etc et schools being regulated by a "religious" group would some catholic institute be okay with a southern methodist group telling them what to do. In an area where there so much sectarian strife, mistrust and violence, that is not the solution.

The answer in my view is to have an oversight body in place which is not religious in nature...new wings within existing educational authorities and boards which regulate regular schools. I had discussed this at length with Musharaff's brother and asked him to pass it on.

36

You don’t have too. You naturally are :hehe:

37

You know The Mush's brother?

dazed

38

yeah he lives in my city, very nice guy

39

This was posted in a difff thread by Pakistani Tiger..I thought thsi was pertinent to the discussion in this thread too. I had missed these news..

btw madaris is the plural of madrasa.

No help to Madaris Without Registration: Ordinance Okayed; NCC, Girls Guide Disbanded

quote:

ISLAMABAD, June 19: The federal cabinet here on Wednesday approved the promulgation of "Madrassah Registration Ordinance 2002" to regulate religious schools by bringing them under normal educational system of the country.

According to the ordinance, Madaris will seek registration with "Pakistan Madrassah Education Board" and the respective Provincial Madrassah Education Boards. They have been prohibited from receiving Zakat, or financial assistance, grant, donation or other benefit from the federal government or provincial governments unless registered under the ordinance.

Minister for Information and Media Development Nisar Memon told reporters at a briefing that the ordinance would come into force immediately. "One of the objectives of introducing this regulatory mechanism is to control those religious schools which had been subjected to militancy," he added.

According to the ordinance, any one who wilfully contravenes any of the provisions of the ordinance will attract closure of the Madrassah or a fine, or both. "The details of fine are being currently worked out," Memon said.

Madaris refusing to register themselves with education boards to be set up by the government would not be allowed to operate, the minister said.

The cabinet meeting, which was presided over by President Gen Pervez Musharraf, also decided that religious schools would also facilitate teaching of science, mathematics, English and Urdu, providing an opportunity to the students to enrol in the professional educational institutions if they so wished.

Every registered Madrassah, according to the ordinance, will maintain accounts and submit annual report to the respective education board. A registered Madrassah will not receive any grant, donation or aid from any foreign sources or allow admission to foreign students or make appointment of teachers without valid visa and No Objection Certificate from the Interior Ministry.

The minister said that all the four governors who also attended the meeting, were asked to complete the process of registration in six months time.

The minister said he did not think that the government had chosen a path of confrontation with religious parties by seeking registration of religious schools. "In the first place, it is a hypothetical question whether there will be any confrontation, as the purpose is to bring religious schools in the mainstream," the minister said.

Responding to a question, Nisar Memon said he could not say about the exact number of Madaris. "But it seems that they run in thousands," he said, adding that it would take some time to know about the exact number of religious schools.

Asked whether these schools would be subject to certain audit and taxation, Nisar Memon said he had no idea about it, and that he would reply this question at some other time after getting details from the officials concerned.

In reply to a question, he said curriculum of religious schools would be like that of other educational institutions of the country.

40

rvikz, now that you got some insight about madrassahs, can you share your experiences in the VHP/Shiv Sena Mandir that you attended in the past? How do these mandirs train you to bake Muslims alive in ovens? Do the charge you, or do you just gladly volunteer when you hear the words 'kill Muslims'?