What do u guys think?
should we move this to society and culture?
good topic though.
initial thoughts.
society and environmental factors have a great part in crime. That is why groups or areas that get caught up in the vicious cycle of crime keep churning up criminals generation after next and ghettos become fertile ground for criminals.
are they the only crminals then? not at all, you will see people from affluent backgrounds with a decent family get into all sorts fo stuff. What influences them, the company they keep? what they get exposed to?
I ams ure criminologists and psychologists have written books on this subject. I would be surprised if the correlation did nto exist or was weaker than what I think it is.
Having said that..can we blame these factors...surely, to some extent, they do play a big role. But its not something that families and schools cant overcome if they dont want to. In the end if you are able to instill a sense of good and bad in a person maybe he will make teh right choices no matter what social pressures he may be facing.
[This message has been edited by Fraudz (edited July 18, 2002).]
SO true Mr.Fraudia, I just keep wondering that what could we possibly do for such criminals..
well prison system can be a reform system if run properly. The prupose of prisons should not be just to throw crminals behind bars but to try to have them mend their ways. Unfortunately prison is like the "graduate program" of crime for criminals, once they go in they keep getting worse.
How can one seperate criminals who will never repent and straighten out no matter how hard one tries vs those who need ome guidance and support to straighten themselves out.
yea u r right, but don't even talk about prison system especially in Pak one who once got there will regret it for his whole life,then the society ppl they bring the worst out of them.At the end u don't even know who to blame foe all this,the police says something and the friends and then family..it just keeps getting worst then ever.The whole system is going in the wrong way..
Society is where we learn everything from.
You say that family can stop things like this. Family can socialise you when you are a child but when a child is shown the bigger picture what a parent says becomes less relevant and once you hit your teens it is the society around you that decides your behaviour.
Our parents didn't bring us up to smoke, drink etc but most have done it.
Society is where a woman learns what it is that makes a woman beautiful.
Society is where a man learns whether it is acceptable for him to drink.
Society is where we get our ideas. Environment is where we learn. If society is based around crime then that is what you learn. No matter what parents say.
Society is what influences people. If you look at Pakistan for example western culture is the reason you now see girls prancing around in short skirts, not because mum said so.
I know this was specific on crime but i just thought i'd say that everything anyone does revolves around society which includes crime.
mods can u mave this thread to Cul?
I know that I have the most powerful brain but I just don't know how to use it! :~(
sheikh
society has its impact, no doubt at all. But if the parents are able to instill a sense of wrong and right, maybe people would be able to handle the pressures of society better and even if they give in, know that its wrong and may mend their ways.
I ll be brief
NATURE & NURTUE
by nature i mean thwe dna of each genetic code we are born with
By"nurture" we mean the environment from mothers lap to our friends peers & media we pay attention too ...computers, dvd ,video cinema, magazines, concerts, clubs, bars ,gangs, hang outs,... everything influence though we make choice from the litiny of things b/c one cannot have all the time for all the things one bears towards things one chooses to .
So no one thing can be blamed its not only genetics although there may be vulneberility towards addiction to alcohol infamily but choice of drinking is persons RESPONSIBILITY cannot tbe excused b/c father was alcoholic.IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE REASONS NOT TO GO NEAR IT ...
You could not be more wrong. Alcoholism runs in the genes. Kind of like when cousins’ marry
YOU COULD NOT UNDESTAND
If you dont take ALCOHOL no matter if all your 23 pairs of chromosomes is Alcoholic …how the hell can you be suffering from Alcoholism ..nincompoop??
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/confused.gif
And i am not about to give you lecture on ALCOHOLISM & GENETICS & Dominant Recessive Inheritence …
Go see the last discussion in CRNR Archive..about Cousin Marriage for my latest PROOF unrefuted that there is nothng genetically wrong …other social legal & personal preferences aside .Only half baked Hindian scientists talk like you
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/devil.gif
[This message has been edited by Gymnasophyst (edited August 08, 2002).]
Fraudia
Parents can bring you up and teach one Islamic values and cultural values even but why is it that most go astray from that.
After your parents come peers, media etc which give you a completely different viewpoint on life and really the parents views begin to stop mattering. Academically parents provide primary socialisation while peers media etc bring about secondary socialisatin which is the main type. Parentsbring up their children, no girlfriend, no drinking but then society encourages these through its many mediums and Muslims choose these over parents ideals.
Parents need to bring children up better I agree. Most bring us up with blind faith where we are told what is right and wrong but not 'why'. So when we are confronted with something new we take it on sometimes out of curiousity or peer pressure. Parents can be influential but in reality in a soceity like the ones we are in, it is difficult for a Muslim parent and many get it wrong.
sheikh
I have seen ppl do all kinds of stuff in in US and UK, as well as Pakistan and Saudi Arabia.
Peer groups and society at large has an influence, but if you buold the foundation right external influences will nto find a very recpetive audience.
I agree a parents job is very tough, not just for msulim parents but for any parent, no parent wants their kid to get into drugs, violence or catch STDs, butit happens. Thus parents should be much more active in their kids lives and help build a good foundation from the start.
are there not people who give in to per pressure but then realize its of no use and revert to their usual self?