Originally posted by Masooma:
**zz says
"why did god have hotline with mohammad"
-1.God DID not have any sort of hotline with Muhammad(s.a.w),it wasn't only him, but Jesus,Moses,Abrahim, and rest gave the SAME message as Muhammad(s.a.w) did, the only difference is,he was the last prophet.**
How do u know. Just because he says so. Or a book says so. I can find a book saying Kalimata rode a tiger. One book is as good as another book.
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"why he did not send any messages to dogs, cats and cockroaches."
-2.Guess what!!! God did send a messenger to dogs, cats and cockroaches!HAZRAT SULAIMAN alai-he-salaam, he was considered the prophet of Jins,wild animals and was able to communicate with all these beings.But all these dogs and cats are not considered superior being like Mankind because God gave us brain, power to think and make decisions and rule the earth.
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Why should human beings rule the earth when they are so selfish and dishonest? Species after species are disapppearing due to constant intereference by humans.
So what did this prophet do to save the dogs. Did he introduce marraiges in them. Will he go around and stop dogs that will date a different male everyday and have sex with more than one dog on day or he told that while male dogs can do it, females better stay pious. Did he try to put dog females in burqa. Afterall, how can one blame male dogs not being able to control themselves when they see fermale dogs moving around with bare breasts. I am sure all of them will go to hell and Muslims are doing nothing to put dogs in burqa and save their morals.
**
"Is got male chauavanist and he sends messages only to human males"
-3. Yes, this is a very important question, as far as my understanding is concered ,WOMENHOOD is something which is never given importance in society, Man can never accept a woman ruling and considered more intelligent than him, in old ages women were treated like piece of garbedge, they had VERY LESS POWER, if there was a female messenger, she would have had to go out and spread the word of GOD and she could have been very disrespected in many ways, our prophet Muhammad(s.a.w) had to face all sort of difficulties, kafirs use to throw garbege at him, call him with bad names, Our prophet didn't have any son, Kafirs use to say, look he calls himself the messenger of Allah and his Allah can't even give him a son who can carry his name,but THEY WERE WRONG, kafirs said who will talk about Muhammad because he has no son, but look today Muhammad is known all over the world.
If there was a female messenger, first of all she would have been treated in very disrespectful ways , but male prophets did face all the hezards and still stood up
Muhammad(s.a.w) was a human being, he died like a human being, he felt pain when people cursed him out, Allah didn't give him super powers that if someone swears at him, that person will die, Muhammad(s.a.w) was tested by Allah and faced problems throughout his life.**
If the women have no power, it is duty of god to make them powerful, instead of having system where women can not even go out of house as in Afghanistan. Islam has made women more powerless than ever, due to its very male chauvanastic philosophy.
If god is all powerful he can send a woman messenger and make people respect her. Or even god finds himself/herself helpless against male chauvanism.
"why not a pig messanger and how do u know there has not been one"
-4.There hasn't be a pig messenger because pig doesn't have brain,and HELLO? we are talking about Islam here,not hinduism in which animals are considered superior than Man, you guys won't eat cow, but if a shooder comes near you , he is dead! EXCUSE ME BUT ISLAM GIVES MORE IMPORTANCE TO MANKIND THAN IT DOES TO ANIMALS
Pig has a brain, as much as dog has it. And should mentally retarded men deserve being saved or having religion. If they do, why not pigs.
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"Let us have logical dissection of myuths including ones in Quran"
-5. Dear what myths are you talking about, everything Quran stated is valid enough to be believed,the Prophets it talks about, History is the evidence that they existed, Jesus existed and so did Moses and ofcourse Muhammad(s.a.w)We are not the only people , did you ever get to read bible or torah?if not then do, what we muslims talk about, they talk about the same concepts.
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It is just one book versus other. I do not trust bible or Torah or Quran more than mills and boon novels.
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"Adam and Eve lived in heaven!! where it was"
-6. This is the speciality about us muslims, we believe in the unseen and so do christains and jews.The world hereafter, we haven't been there because we will be introduced to that world once we die.Adam and Eve lived there,because they were created there.That is where the mankind began.
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How do u know they lived in heaven. Where is heaven? how do u know it exists? When were u there last time?
**"Why god did not want them to eat apple"
-7.Allah didn't want them to eat apple,there are different philosophies about that,before we can answer this, we should answer WHY DID GOD CREATE MAN? God states in Quran, "Just recall the time when your Lord said to the angels, "i am going to appoint a vicegerent on the Earth", they humbly enquired, "Art Thou going to make such a one as will cause Disorder and shed blood on the Earth?We are already engaged in hymning Thy praise, and hallowing Thy name," Allah replied, "I know what you know not".After that He tought Adam the names of all things............" Surab Baqrah 30-33. After that when God asked angels to Bow to Adam, they all did but Iblis(who was not an angle but created from fire, a Jin) refused to do so.This was the beginning and the first enemy of Man was created. Allah could have put this in Iblis's heart and made him Bow to Adam, but no Allah didn't, He left it upto Iblis to decide what he wants to do, obey God or disobey, why??Only because Allah planned to do so. Allah wanted to create Earth and set man as the emperor, this whole thing was planned thats why He sent them to heaven and asked them not to eat a certain fruit. Quran says, Surab Baqarah "O Adam,you and your wife,both dwell in the Garden and eat to your heart's content wherefrom you will,but do not go near this tree; otherwise you shall become trangressors."(35-37)so this shows,it is not said that the fruit was apple, but it was a fruit.Satan tempted them with that tree and they disobeyed God.
That was the beginning on the existence of Mankind on this Earth.
"Why he didnt explain him what he means rather than ordering"
Honestly, i don't get you?God didn't explain why he shouldn't eat that fruit?Well God tought Adam everything, gave him brain, allowed him to make his decisions,God could have taken away his power to make decision and do whatever God tells him to do?Why didn't he do that?Why did Allah gave him freedom of choice?
If you can answer these questions only then you will understand why God didn't explain him, God wanted to test Adam because now when Adam knows Iblis is his enemy, how well does Adam use his brain, will he listen to Iblis or God.
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I believe there is no respect in this story. God id behaving like headmaster. 'dont touch apple'. No questions to be asked. No wonder adam and eve left such a god. good for them. i think any attempts to go back to such a dictatorial god should be foiled, if the story is true.
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"Cant god treat umans with respect. in that case why he asks humans to respect him"
I'm sorry to say, but this is a very stupid question.There is no comparison between GOD and human beings.We were created to respect our creator.God doesn't need us to respect Him, he can make us do anything he pleases but this is all His plan, he gave us brain, to think about Him, praise him with understanding that how Powerful Almighty is.
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he may be powerful or maybe not. Unless he is going to treat me with respect, i see no reason to respect god. Why respect god, just because he will send me to heaven and give 72 virgins. No good reason, I say. It is like licking upto Hitler cuz he will give me some money. I need better reasons to respect god, and this story shows he is not worthy.
*"how did adam and eve come to earth after expelled from heaven was it a space shuttle"
How do we die?what happens to us when we die?Think about it, does our sole flies out of us or it sits in an aroplan or is it helicopter?Dear, we are talking about Godly powers,shuttle,helicopters,aroplans HE doesn't need all these because man created all this by using his brain and GOD gave us this brain of ours,if there was no brain, there won't be any helicopter or a shuttle.
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I think unless we know where this heaven was, whether in our solar system or outside, difficult to know how they came to earth.
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"does god still stick to heaven and keep an eye on earth,what is his machinary to do it"
-Once again i would repeat myself, we are talking about Godly powers not human creation.If he can make a statue made out of sand and water walk,talk,eat,grow He can do anything.Machinary?you kidding me?that is why HE IS GOD because he doesn't need any sort of machinery.
Gosh!!you need serious help!should i laugh at your stupidness or pitty you?
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I would trather say a few laws of nature are running the show. Do we really need god. High time for god to retire.
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"whom did adam and eve's children marry. or they had sex with their brothers, sisters, father and mother? how disgusting."
-Yes indeed, very disgusting but dear you will be shocked to know that only because of that disgustfullness you are here today.Eve use to give birth to twins at a time, and every twin married not his/her twin brother but the opposite sex brother/sister from the next pair.This was by the order of God, Eve was created from Adams body, was she his daughter?NO! that was the bigenning of man kind, but still that wasn't as disgusting as SINGLE woman marrying 5 brothers,when she has other choice.
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if u really want to give a set of folk stories to people and teach them morals, why tell them that entire mankind is grown out of incestuous relationship.
Again why did mohammd marry 9 or thirteen women when he had choice to leave with one. If Draupadi's case is vulgur, so is Mohammad's.
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ZZ you say:
"masooma, given the zeal with which u r dissecting the stories about hindu gods, i would like to know if u believe that adam and eve lived in heaven, ate apple and came to earth. if u believe that, what is ur problem believing that kali mata rode a tiger and killed a few deamons. the later story sounds more plausible to me"
Yes i believe in Adam and Eve and that they lived in heaven because its not what only Quran says but bible, torah also state the same FACT!!
If kali mata existed and rode a tiger is true then why did such a powerful lady die?And zz bhaiyai you admitted yourself that hinduism keeps on changing its beliefs.And why does your god looks so scary?gods are to bless children or scare them?I dont know about others, but when i see the pictures of all those gods of yours, its more of a scary view than impressive.
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If I make Kenu reeves a god, will it be more acceptable to u.
Again 3 books saying same folk story does not make it true. As I said u belive Jesus is alive. If a person born 2000 yrs ago is alive, why cant kalimata ride tiger. U see people in circus riding tiger while u know none who lived 2000 years.
If one of ur prophets could talk to various animals, Kalimata could ride tiger. At least we see people riding tiger in circus. We dont see anyone talking to animals.
[This message has been edited by ZZ (edited August 11, 2000).]