GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:42pm

The Kitchen House: A Novel

When a white servant girl violates the order of plantation society, she unleashes a tragedy that exposes the worst and best in the people she has come to call her family.Orphaned while onboard ship from Ireland, seven-year-old Lavinia arrives on the steps of a tobacco plantation where she is to live and work with the slaves of the kitchen house. Under the care of Belle, the master’s illegitimate daughter, Lavinia becomes deeply bonded to her adopted family, though she is set apart from them by her white skin.
Eventually, Lavinia is accepted into the world of the big house, where the master is absent and the mistress battles opium addiction. Lavinia finds herself perilously straddling two very different worlds. When she is forced to make a choice, loyalties are brought into question, dangerous truths are laid bare, and lives are put at risk.
The Kitchen House is a tragic story of page-turning suspense, exploring the meaning of family, where love and loyalty prevail.

This was the first book read by the GS Book Club. I will post the discussion questions, and then the reviews and comments by all those who read the book and participated

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:42pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

**DISCUSSION QUESTIONS:

1.) Why do you think the author chose to tell the story through two narrarators? Does this story belong to one more than the other?

2.) ***"Mae knows that her eldest daughter consorts with my husband...almost from the beginning, I suspected their secrets" **Why does the captain keep Belle's true identity from his wife and children? Do you think the truth would have been a relief to his family or torn them further apart? At what point does keeping the secret turn tragic?

3.) Consider Lavinia's history. Do you think the captain saved her life by bringing her to America as an indentured servent? Or do you think it was fate worse than one she would have faced in Ireland? What's the difference between slavery and indentured servitude?

4.) Marshall is a complicated character. At times he is kind and protective; other times he is a violent monster. What is the secret Marshall is forced to keep? Is he to blame for what happened to Sally? Why do you think Marshall was loyal to Rankin, who was a conspirator with Mr. Waters?

5.)***"I was as enslaved as all the others." *Do you think this statement by Lavinia is fair? Is her position equivalent to those of the slaves? What freedom does she have that the slaves do not? What burdens does her race put upon her?

6.) The relationship between Ben's wife Lucy and Belle....how does it evolve throughout the novel? Is is difficult for you to understand their friendship?*****

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:44pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

From llxll

[quote=““ll xx ll””]
POSSIBLE SPOILERS

1.) Why do you think the author chose to tell the story through two narrarators? Does this story belong to one more than the other?

I think if it was told from just Lavinia’s POV we wouldn’t get the whole story…especially since in the beginning she was sooo timid, plus she didn’t know everything. Even throughout the story Lavinia wasn’t aware of some things.

If the story was told just from Belle’s POV we again would have a very incomplete story. As Lavinia’s perspective brought a unique insight into both the “slave-world” and the “white-man’s world” which Belle’s POV alone could not have brought.

I think the author wanted us to have a very complete picture and that could only be accomplished by narrating the story through both points of view rather than just one.

I really don’t think the story belongs to one character more than the other as I said before, without either one of them the story would be incomplete

2.) **“Mae knows that her eldest daughter consorts with my husband…almost from the beginning, I suspected their secrets” **Why does the captain keep Belle’s true identity from his wife and children? Do you think the truth would have been a relief to his family or torn them further apart? At what point does keeping the secret turn tragic?

I think he kept belle’s identity from his wife and children because he was afraid it would tear his family apart. But I question whether that was a wise decision because the family was torn apart anyways.

Keeping this secret turned tragic when she was raped.

3.) Consider Lavinia’s history. Do you think the captain saved her life by bringing her to America as an indentured servent? Or do you think it was fate worse than one she would have faced in Ireland? What’s the difference between slavery and indentured servitude?

I am not sure if he saved her. I guess considering how timid she was …perhaps it was better to be an indentured servant. This is an interesting question…I don’t know how to answer it really, as i don’t know what Lavinia was like before her parents perished. Was she a strong girl? was she a fighter? the answer to this question really depends on knowing her personality before that tragedy changed her.

an indentured servant has to work a certain number of years before they are free.

4.) Marshall is a complicated character. At times he is kind and protective; other times he is a violent monster. What is the secret Marshall is forced to keep? Is he to blame for what happened to Sally? Why do you think Marshall was loyal to Rankin, who was a conspirator with Mr. Waters?

I felt very sorry for Marshall being neglected by his parents and being abused by his tutor plus having the weight of your sister’s death being placed upon your shoulders…I don’t know what all that could do to a person…

I cannot say whether he is to blame or not… i’m quite certain he didn’t intend for sally to die but the fact is she did and too at his hands

I think being abused by waters and neglected by his parents …perhaps Rankin was the only one who gave him some attention and didn’t abuse him and that’s why he felt a misguided sense of loyalty to him.

But i’ll admit while i felt sorry for him, i was glad for what happened to him at the end.

5.)*“I was as enslaved as all the others.” *Do you think this statement by Lavinia is fair? Is her position equivalent to those of the slaves? What freedom does she have that the slaves do not? What burdens does her race put upon her?

It is, i’m afraid…somewhat a very accurate assessment of her position. True she has a lavish lifestyle with Marshall, but she is not allowed to show affection to the people she cares about, she is not allowed to do anything for the people she cares about, she is not loved by her own husband…she is so alone…sometimes i feel like she was worse off than the slaves because of how lonely she was but at times i feel like she at least had the basic necessities, or did she? considering she didn’t feel safe or sheltered.

6.) The relationship between Ben’s wife Lucy and Belle…how does it evolve throughout the novel? Is is difficult for you to understand their friendship?

from belle hating both ben and lucy to her loving ben but stil disliking lucy to all of them living as one big happy family. Yes I must admit i find it difficult to understand but perhaps it is their circumstances that make this somewhat understandable
[/quote]

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:45pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

Hmmna:

""Hmmna"":

(Spoiler alert)
1.) Why do you think the author chose to tell the story through two narrarators? Does this story belong to one more than the other?

Both the characters had a lot of potential but I felt dissapointed in both. Belle didn’t add much to the story, most of what she narrated we were already told by Lavinia. And Lavinia was very hmm how shud I say.. Clueless. I mean the amount of stuff she didn’t comprehend. It may have been better to just really develop one character.

2.) “Mae knows that her eldest daughter consorts with my husband…almost from the beginning, I suspected their secrets” Why does the captain keep Belle’s true identity from his wife and children? Do you think the truth would have been a relief to his family or torn them further apart? At what point does keeping the secret turn tragic?

i don’t know why the captain didn’t tell his wife about belle. He was with belle mother before his wife came on the scene and it wouldn’t be that uncommon to have children with slaves out of wedlock. It was a tragedy all along. She had to serve her step mother and siblings as a slave. Her step mother loathed her because she though she was a mistress to her husband.

3.) Consider Lavinia’s history. Do you think the captain saved her life by bringing her to America as an indentured servent? Or do you think it was fate worse than one she would have faced in Ireland? What’s the difference between slavery and indentured servitude?

hmm I too dnt know about this one. Indentured servants as said above had to work a number of years before they were freed, so they were not slaves and were very aware of this distinction as were the slave owners.

4.) Marshall is a complicated character. At times he is kind and protective; other times he is a violent monster. What is the secret Marshall is forced to keep? Is he to blame for what happened to Sally? Why do you think Marshall was loyal to Rankin, who was a conspirator with Mr. Waters?

The characters in the book are either all good or all evil. Marshall was a victim of his circumstances. Abused by his tutor and neglected by his parents, He started out as a very interesting character but then became all evil. He got attention from rankin so was loyal to him. Sally’s death was a terrible accident.

5.)“I was as enslaved as all the others.” Do you think this statement by Lavinia is fair? Is her position equivalent to those of the slaves? What freedom does she have that the slaves do not? What burdens does her race put upon her?

She was expected to be with the slaves and serve her masters as a child but in her teenage years and later on she was had a better status than them. I feel her burdens weren’t due her race but more to do with her gender and age. She was very vulnerable and young, not to mention naive/thick. From what she had seen the treatment of the slaves I dnt understand why it took her so long to get a grip of her situation. Also all the stupid misunderstandings with the Mr.B guy and the other guy she had a crush on.

6.) The relationship between Ben’s wife Lucy and Belle…how does it evolve throughout the novel? Is is difficult for you to understand their .

It is difficult for me to understand but I guess they didn’t have a choice.

my own thoughts overall:
it had too much tragedy. At the end I couldn’t stand it anymore. The characters lacked depth. I think this could have been an epic book as the story is different and Lavinia could have been much more than the airhead heroine she becomes.

some of the plot twist were very frustrating. Why did belle have to wait until captain was on his deathbed to get her papers? Why couldn’t Marshall have sex with Lavinia? What about her was so repulsive that he had to be drunk? At first I thought he was gay but he wasnt. The misunderstanding with her crush I dnt remember his name? And when she starts whining about bettie that when I skipped to the last chapter.

The prologue was very good though and the first few chapters had me at the edge of my seat as I was scared for the characters, and the fear was very well placed.

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:46pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

Muniya:

""~MuNiYa~"":

OMGGGGG I’m half way through and yes some of you are spoiling this for me.

I’ll answer the questions later - but can I just give my overall feel for the book??
Here are my issues:

the book is from a child’s POV (so far) but the writing and language are so mature. Belle writes her role but Lavinia is all adult. WAH?

The book kills off to many characters to fast and without adding to the plot.

Captures the slavery issue very well; but at times its shoving down your throat the ideologies of the author. For the most part we can agree that slavery sucked but these people were better masters then many. And what was the offside to being a slave? I loveddddddddddd that they killed Waters!! that was the one empowering act that made slaves feel like they were more then just servants.

Just to show two sides.. let you in Belle’s little head.

YES!! Why did he not tell everyone?! Sure would have saved Belle tons of trouble. Anyone else rooting for Belle and the new Stephen character they hired?

The rest of the questions I think don’t apply yet since I’ve not read far enough.

These was some deep questions Khatti asked… takes a minute to get thoughts in order.

But I agree with Hmmna… way to much tragedy.
I’m still halfway - not finished yet.

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:48pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

S02:

""S02"":

SPOILER ALERT!!! I have finished the book.

DISCUSSION QUESTIONS:
**
1.) Why do you think the author chose to tell the story through two narrarators? Does this story belong to one more than the other?**
Well, they’re the two narrators that don’t fit neatly into the “black slave” and “white master” categories, so there’s an assumption that their issues will be more complex. But I do feel that the writer doesn’t really follow through with the full potential of this. A lot about this novel has the feel of a “first novel” (so I wasn’t surprised when I read that this is indeed the writer’s first novel). It’s not just the above, but also the way the first person narrative works. First-person narrators require a lot of skill to not sound self-indulgent and whiny. In the beginning in particular this felt similar to the narrative style of the Twilight books. The writing isn’t that much better, it’s just that the subject matter is more worthwhile. Despite that, I did eventually enjoy reading the book (and I also enjoyed the Twilight books ) because the plot was engaging.

2.) “Mae knows that her eldest daughter consorts with my husband…almost from the beginning, I suspected their secrets” Why does the captain keep Belle’s true identity from his wife and children? Do you think the truth would have been a relief to his family or torn them further apart? At what point does keeping the secret turn tragic?
I don’t think the writer develops this reasoning enough. Why is it better to let her think that he has a mistress, rather than a daughter? The whole mess because of this secret. And it’s not just the Captain who keeps quiet, but Lavinia, Mae, Belle, etc. And why? With Lavinia, it’s just, “I thought about telling him and then I didn’t” over and over again. It’s a very frustrating failing in the plot, as there is no clear reasoning or motivation behind this secret that doesn’t need to cause as many problems as it does.

3.) Consider Lavinia’s history. Do you think the captain saved her life by bringing her to America as an indentured servant? Or do you think it was fate worse than one she would have faced in Ireland? What’s the difference between slavery and indentured servitude? I don’t know that he saved her life. Her parents chose to leave Ireland, right? I assume this was during the famine, and they got taken in as indentured servants. Unlike a slave, an indentured servant is seen as a human who is not a possession. S/He works until a debt is paid and s/he can live freely.

4.) Marshall is a complicated character. At times he is kind and protective; other times he is a violent monster. What is the secret Marshall is forced to keep? Is he to blame for what happened to Sally? Why do you think Marshall was loyal to Rankin, who was a conspirator with Mr. Waters? Marshall is a vulnerable boy who seems to have been physically and sexually abused by Mr. Waters. Though Marshall hates Waters, his feelings become confused as he only has Rankin and Mr. Waters as white male role models. He also looks up to them for guidance and values. The captain abandons his family for money, whatever his good intentions, and allows it to be taken over by monsters. If he had bothered to get to know his son, rather than just assuming he was a bad kid, he could have remedied a lot of problems.

5.)“I was as enslaved as all the others.” Do you think this statement by Lavinia is fair? Is her position equivalent to those of the slaves? What freedom does she have that the slaves do not? What burdens does her race put upon her? Maybe her life is not as hard as all the others, but she is still a slave, a possession, a pawn in a lot of ways, especially after she agrees to marry Marshall.

**6.) The relationship between Ben’s wife Lucy and Belle…how does it evolve throughout the novel? Is is difficult for you to understand their friendship? **It’s not difficult to understand, actually. I think it’s one of the most “real” relationships. It’s the fact that Lucy let’s her guard down and reaches out to Belle, and Belle accepts and stops being defensive that they are able to be friends. It’s like a sister-wives kinda thing.

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:49pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

**The Kitchen House Discussion Blog Round **

The first blog entry with the discussion questions I posted on Monday didn’t get a lot of response (and thank you to the those who did!), so I’ll simplify things a little:

How would you rate this book? On a scale of 1-10 would “1” being you didn’t care for it at all, and “10” being you would rank it is one of your alltime favorite reads ever…
What are your overall feelings/thoughts/observations?

For me, I was drawn to this book because I love this period of US History (the whole “Gone With The Wind” syndrome I suppose, lol!)

It was a tough read, but I didn’t mind all the deaths or doom-and-gloom, because that is so indicative of this era. My heart bled for Marshall, it’s not hard to understand his dark side considering the abuse he suffered at the hands of his tutor. I do wish that Lavinia & Belle’s characters were a little more developed, I still don’t quite understand their bond/relationship…It seemed Lavinia was more connected with Mama Mae and her kids.

The whole dichotemy of indentured servitude vs slavery was also interesting. Because at the end of the day, Lavinia’s white skin was her pass to a decent life, no matter how many years she spent scrubbing the floors of the big house or sleeping on a pallette in the kitchen house.

Overall, I’d give the book a solid 7.

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:50pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

Gemini The Great:

[quote=““Gemini the Great””]
I missed the previous blog entry.. there should be sticky entries for blogs too!

SPOILER:
I havent finished reading the book.. I am probably halfway through but too many deaths already just make me cry and since the only tme I get to read is before bed, husband keeps telling me to put it down because I am sobbing I want to finish reading it, i want to see what happened at the end but at this point its making me too sad. I love Mama Mea’s character.. she is shown as such a strong woman like our nani, dadi-- been through it all but with a smile on her face! when she cries, I cry! I was initially skeptical about the bond between Lavinia and Belle, and even though I still dont understand whats going between two, I like their relationship!I like the community bond between all slaves, they sure have each other’s back like a family does and one person’s sorrow is everyones tragedy!

I like reading historical books so I know I will finish it one day!

ps: were we supposed to finish reading the book by now?
[/quote]

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:51pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

Muniya:

""~MuNiYa~"":

I’m all for the blogs - the threads take away from the feeling of cosiness.

Back to the book.

Like Khatti, I love the history that the book brought with it. I wonder though how to point the living conditions depicted were. At this point Lavinia does seem more connected with Mama Mae then Belle - but Belle is young. 20 something and was kinda thrown into this whole mother role. What I wanna know is how and if Lavinia will get back to the plantation. Right now I’m to the part where she’s in Williamsburg.

Marshall - I’m not feeling anything for him right now. I feel bad about the Tutor situation but I’m one of those folks who doesnt believe in letting a bad situation define you. MOVE ON! its not right and its not fair but you only enlongate the misery but reacting over and over again.

ACHA so I have question for you guys.
Lets say we’re directing a movie for the book which actors would you choose for the following characters:

Belle (Halle Berry)
Lavinia
Mama Mae (Maya Angelo)
Papa George (Denzel Washington? or that guy with deep voice; in the commercials too)
Marshall (Liam Hemsworth?)
The Twins (Willow Smith )
Ben (the reading rainbow guy hehe)
Captain (the KFC Captain)

Feel free to add on.

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:52pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

S02:

""S02"":

SPOILER ALERT – I HAVE FINISHED THE BOOK

I ALSO JUST REPLIED TO THE FIRST BLOG POST.

1) How would you rate this book? On a scale of 1-10 would “1” being you didn’t care for it at all, and “10” being you would rank it is one of your alltime favorite reads ever…
I agree with your assessment, khatti. A 6ish. It was an enjoyable read, but I also don’t think it really fulfilled all the potential that it had. I think the story of characters like Belle has been told many times, but Lavinia’s is a lesser known tale, and there could’ve been a lot more about the indentured servants. And maybe more done with their intersection. Maybe if there were adults who were indentured servants that would’ve helped. I think overall the plot was interesting and kept me hooked, especially in the second half of the book. The writing was kind of average. Not bad, but not special.

2) What are your overall feelings/thoughts/observations?
I think I’ve basically answered this already, in my above response and the response to the last post. Basically, enjoyable read but not a life-changing book. I’m just glad to be reading again!

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 6:56pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

More discussions:

QUOTE=WendyDarling;bt803397]I’m half way through it too.
I really like the book so far, but it’s sooo soo depressing lol!!

I picture Lavinia as Lily Collins.

http://www4.images.coolspotters.com/photos/254318/lily-collins-and-the-blind-side-gallery.jpg

[/quote]

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 7:00pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

And more discussion:

""Hadeel"":

I’m so sorry I’ve been really busy and totally missed the other blog. anyways…

How would you rate this book? On a scale of 1-10 would “1” being you didn’t care for it at all, and “10” being you would rank it is one of your alltime favorite reads ever…

I’m going to give it a 7. I’ve read better books. This was a nice read but was too sad for my taste. Too many deaths were happening and every time i moved to the next page I would wonder who’d die now? I mean I started expecting deaths. Not really fun that way.

What are your overall feelings/thoughts/observations?

Like I said, a very sad read!! There were very little moments of happiness so wasn’t really balanced in that aspect. What I literally loved about the book was the details about the environment/houses/living standards and ways. That era and it’s details were mesmerizing. I would’ve liked to see a little more discussion on Belle and Lavinias relationship. The fact that we just had to go with the rule that ‘Belle was like Lavinias mother’ wasn’t too appealing. A little substance to this side of the story would’ve been nice. I liked the relationship of Lavinia with Miss Martha though.

About the question for actors playing characters:

Miss Martha can be played by Marcia Cross.

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 7:07pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

Continued:

[quote=““Gemini the Great””]
there are so many fathers and mothers who leave their children behind and never bother about them.. I can picture them being stone hearted back then too so it really doesnt surprise me that the masters didnt care much about their slave children (sounds so wrong typing it but I can see it)
[/quote]

khattichic · March 25, 2014, 7:08pm

Re: GS Book Club- The Kitchen House Discussion

Muzna:

""Muzna"":

**SPOILER ALERT!!! I have finished the book.

DISCUSSION QUESTIONS:**

1.) Why do you think the author chose to tell the story through two narrarators? Does this story belong to one more than the other?
The concept of using these two unique characters was likely to provide a contrast in points of view. Unfortunately I didn’t find that the author was able to do justice to either of them.
I found the story to belong more to Lavinia simply because there was more narrative devoted to her than to Belle.

2.) “Mae knows that her eldest daughter consorts with my husband…almost from the beginning, I suspected their secrets” Why does the captain keep Belle’s true identity from his wife and children? Do you think the truth would have been a relief to his family or torn them further apart? At what point does keeping the secret turn tragic?

I think the captain was well aware that in his time and likely in the next few generations to come, the offspring of master and slaves were not to gain favour in society. He probably felt that Belle would have a better chance in her own community if the relationship was not made public.

His wife, having come from the city and an elite family, was already going to face significant challenges adjusting to life on a plantation so he probably thought that adding his illegitimate, half-black daughter to the mix would not have been conducive to a successful union and family. in short, the captain knew that the time to fight against the wave was not now.

3.) Consider Lavinia’s history. Do you think the captain saved her life by bringing her to America as an indentured servant? Or do you think it was fate worse than one she would have faced in Ireland? What’s the difference between slavery and indentured servitude?

I think he did, in fact, improve the potential for a good life for Lavinia. Her parents had already made the decision to come so it was obvious that conditions there were not good. (This can also be confirmed by reading up on the history of Ireland.)

While she faced different struggles, I think that Lavinia’s character grew in ways that it could not have had she remained in Ireland.

4.) **Marshall is a complicated character. At times he is kind and protective; other times he is a violent monster. What is the secret Marshall is forced to keep? Is he to blame for what happened to Sally? Why do you think Marshall was loyal to Rankin, who was a conspirator with Mr. Waters? **
Marshall’s character is the typical, tragic “unloved and deprived of attention child” that acts out. Unfortunately his fate is sealed when Mr. Waters arrives and ultimately Sally pays with her life for everyone’s transgressions against Marshall.

His loyalty to Rankin can be attributed to what “norm” Marshall likely saw around him. With everyone willingly playing their designated roles except the captain, Rankin represented authority, manhood and conformity to societal rules of the time. Marshall needed that stability.

**5.)“I was as enslaved as all the others.” Do you think this statement by Lavinia is fair? Is her position equivalent to those of the slaves? What freedom does she have that the slaves do not? What burdens does her race put upon her? **

The question is a good one. If pressed I would have to suggest that she was an enslaved as the others…to different masters at different times. In childhood she was enslaved to ignorance. Even as she grew and schooled she seemed to remain ignorant to the potential that she had…only thinking about breaking out on her own every once in a while. Perhaps the author couldn’t decide whether to show her as a strong character that might have driven change or as a weakling that succumbed each time to temptation and the easy way out. (i.e. agreeing to marry the old widower, forget his name, believing in Marshall when she should have known better, her addiction to “the drops”.)

**6.) The relationship between Ben’s wife Lucy and Belle…how does it evolve throughout the novel? Is is difficult for you to understand their friendship? **

Not difficult at all to understand their friendship. Belle was happy to have Ben’s attention at any cost. Until Belle’s will was broken with the rape, she resented Lucy…this was a symbol of the fire that she had within her. Once the rape happened she had pretty much accepted her fate: she belonged neither here nor there and she seemed to let it go at that. It became easy for her to resign herself to whatever happiness life was able to bring her way after that.