Guys, whats wrong with being a manual laborer and why would you think they are all sketchy? Why put all of them in the same group? Woh bhee to insaan hotay haen. I have some relatives who are manual laborers. Just education and money don't make anyone better, isn't it about character?
MS i c
Can you guys explain to me what does this "go to your accomplish" other than keep the girls locked up physically, developmentally and culturally. Particualrly those that live in the west. How can you possibly succeed as an individual if you cannot interact with 50% of the population, hence forgoing 50% of opportunities.
That's great for you Munni. You can 'go to your room' and then talk to naa-mehrems like me here. And if we are both feeling a staring session is warranted, then we can switch the webcams on too. It's a win-win situation.
I simply dont understand this attitude of letting your sons stay in the same room when older women are also in there, but not allowing your daughters in the same room, even when they are modestly dressed. It's one thing if I myself feel uncomfortable about it, but if I am forced to go in the other toom, yet still allowed to work and mingle with people outside of the home, it just makes one think.
Dont want to start too many topics in the same thread. smile
p.s. I live in the U.S., and experience this here.
How can you possibly succeed as an individual if you cannot interact with 50% of the population, hence forgoing 50% of opportunities.
That's very true plus it's just really akward to not be allowed to talk to ..or be brainwashed into feeling very uncomfortable talking to half the people in the world!?
It's pretty wierd for us guys to be brought up that way too!? lol
Well it's not quite the same.. but I spent my teenage years in Pakistan after having grow up in the US.
I've got some relatives that are like that. Watching their kids grow up that way they really just damage them psychologically
Plus I would feel so uncomfortable going to their house...and these were close relatives!? No one ever explained anything and I was still pretty much a kid.. it was just don't look there, don't go there, don't talk to them?
Even now years later I feel very uncomfortable around any kind of muslim gatherings.
Then at school my friends would ask ..do you have any cousins? And I would say yeah but I don't even know them?!
.. I mean how can you even function in the real world if you are supposed to avoid half it's population?
You know its basically another form of oppression ..basically to control women and make them dependent on men. If they are not allowed to do anything or learn anything they have no choice but to rely on a man to do everything for her.
As far as men staring at everything being the reason you should go to your room!?
Well in Pakistan I know they all certainly do!? lol That's not fair cause you're not responsible for their behavior. Restrictions should be put on men.
This is really common in Pakistan, I always found it odd but I guess for them they found it odd that I wasn't zipping into the other room to avoid any gair mard. However, to be honest, in Pakistan I think it means something, in such a closed society the guys to oggle and will say stuff...I don't find the men here to be that bad. On the flip side, when we went to Dubai, I was all americi friendly and responding until i realized in a couple hours the men all directed their qustions to my husband, to be respectful..so I went to the quiet agreeable, obedient wify on the side while in dubai/pakistan.
Waqas, I agree with you. My husband (he's raised in Canada) and I have talked about this alot and that we end up not knowing what's ok when in a large mixed muslim gather because you want to make sure you're not being rude to the "conservative' people there...it makes for awkward interactions....
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*Originally posted by Matsui: *
Can you guys explain to me what does this "go to your accomplish" other than keep the girls locked up physically, developmentally and culturally. Particualrly those that live in the west. How can you possibly succeed as an individual if you cannot interact with 50% of the population, hence forgoing 50% of opportunities.
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I have a friend who was raised conservatively, she's 43, ABCD, religious and grew up in a small town in Ohio, with a VERY small muslim community, she says to this day she doesn't know what/how to talk to men, at work, at the store, even her friend's husbands whom she's known for 20 years....and she hates that she is like this.
It's common.
I find it odd that some people find this odd. :-D
I asked Ammi yesterday why she didnt let me in the kitchen, just to see if maybe Ammi would give an explanation. Ammi ne kahaa ke, "I didnt want him staring." Then went onto some other topic. sigh I lub my mommy. smile
Thanks for the replies, apparently a lot of other girls experience this as well.
Overall, I am very happy with how my parents raised me (Mash'Allah), even if some things dont make sense all the time. smile
On the flipside, it's not a bad idea letting you know who's here from time to time. The countless times I've made an ass out of myself waltzing into a room where I didn't know we had visitors seated. the uncles always look a little shocked.
Well, here's a revolutionary reply for you all. If I had been blessed with a daughter and we had male workers in the house...well of course my girl would be dressed modestly. But living in a western society, I would not exclude her, nor would I attempt to have any type of separation of the genders. It isnt a cultural reality in western society.
SO....
if there were a male worker in my house and he ogled my daughter, I'd fire him, give him a good dressing down and throw him out of my house.
Men mostly respect women here, have grown up mixing with them and do not "lose it" when faced with a young woman because it isnt a novel experience to SEE a young wonan. But of course there are exceptions. I would not "punish" or exclude my daughter but rather punish and exclude the disrespectful ogler.
Well, I havent read the complete thread as it's too long but as per your question. I think your parents need to grow up. It's commendable that you accept what they tell you as you cant refuse cz they are your parents but I think you must try talking to them about this. Explain them that it stresses you and that you would like to have a more polished and developed opnion about the issues going on and would like to share with them bcz you are a part of that house. If they are sensible enough, they would understand your point.
Tell them these ways of theirs (cutting you off from those issues) is effecting you negatively and would not let you grow and learn different things. Also that you feel alienated and that it's turning you into a shy person. Discuss with all honesty and if they are good and caring parents, they must revise these patterns.
Thanks God my parents, especially my father, had very good and positive approach towards bringing up his daughters. He did not follow the old fashioned, gross ways that would leave negative impact on us. I think I am whatever I am because of him and my mom.
It is the opposite with me Munni. I have to take care of everything at home - phone not working, AC is dead, plumber, gardener - whatever have you - I have to be the one who talks to the guy and explains what is wrong 
Right now I gotta go home and figure out what is wrong with the satellite channels!! haaye Rabba!!