Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@Shoor

Homosexuality when involving two consenting adults is the same as paedophilia where an innocent child is the victim of an adult person's perversion? Is that what ur trying to suggest?

Sorry, but he has been parochially trained to hate and doesn't even realize it is the writing of man not of GOD. For if GOD wanted to control sexuality he would have controlled **all **living beings on earth in their choice instead of giving humans freewill and free will to love and not the freewill to kill love. man err's in GOD's eyes when he uses Killing as a method to show love and veneration to GOD. And isn't that what a stone thrower does ?

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

[quote=babu_lahori]
Oh great,do u see straight ppl killing,bombing,condeming,judging,raping,pillaging,plundering others while homosexuals are angels or something?nice logic.
It has to do everything with their being gay.A straight person who is pedophile might not have a perference for the sex they chose,but these men targetted their victims,who knows if they planned this before the adoption,and that was the sole purpose.

Reread what I wrote, it appears your comprehension skills are lacking, perhaps english is not your first language.

It truly appears religious indoctrination does cause people to throw and kill others for their choice of LOVE. ALLAH gave humans FREE WILL to select and decide for themselves who they will surround themselves with and love and be loved by.
AndI never stated homosexuals are angels, ---- see your comprehension skills are very limited.:) even your responses are weak in argument or rational logic for a human who lives in the 21st Century and not the era of troglodyte mentality.

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@Lajawab

Well, what if the child is also consenting? Is it right then?

When Prophet married did she consent when 9? Muhammad was 52 and Aisha was 9 when they married and sexually consummated their marriage. Muhammad followed an Arab custom in marrying a child who had her first menstrual cycle
Aisha is considered an adult following her first menstrual cycle. He also taught that his followers were to follow his "sunnah" or lifestyle. Thus today, throughout much of the Mideast, girls as young as nine are often married by men old enough to be their grandfather.

[hareem01]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@uberalles

When Prophet married did she consent when 9? Muhammad was 52 and Aisha was 9 when they married and sexually consummated their marriage. Muhammad followed an Arab custom in marrying a child who had her first menstrual cycle Aisha is considered an adult following her first menstrual cycle. He also taught that his followers were to follow his "sunnah" or lifestyle. Thus today, throughout much of the Mideast, girls as young as nine are often married by men old enough to be their grandfather.

don't lie......go to religion forum and read the thread about getting married at 9....read all the posts including mine and Anwaar's.

[Lajawab]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@uberalles

When Prophet married did she consent when 9? Muhammad was 52 and Aisha was 9 when they married and sexually consummated their marriage. Muhammad followed an Arab custom in marrying a child who had her first menstrual cycle
Aisha is considered an adult following her first menstrual cycle. He also taught that his followers were to follow his “sunnah” or lifestyle. Thus today, throughout much of the Mideast, girls as young as nine are often married by men old enough to be their grandfather.

And your point is?

[Shoor]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@Lajawab

Well, what if the child is also consenting? Is it right then?

What do you think.

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

Here is some enlightenment and not parochial defence where truth is preverted .

I have used Bukhari's Hadith, translated into English by Dr. Muhammad Muhsin Khan, at the Islamic University in Medina. Bukhari's Hadith is considered authentic by the majority of Sunni Islamic scholars. It is second to the Quran in terms of importance. The central figure to approve and sign the translation is Dr. Amin Al-Masri, Ph.D. Cambridge University. He is the Advisor and Head of the Sharia Dept., at the College of Sharia and Islamic Studies in Mecca

From Bukhari vol. 7, #65 "Narrated Aisha that the prophet wrote the marriage contract with her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old. Hisham said: "I have been informed that Aisha remained with the prophet for nine years (i.e. till his death

Bukhari vol. 7, #88
"Narrated Urwa: "The prophet wrote the (marriage contract) with Aisha while she was six years old and consummated his marriage with her while she was nine years old and she remained with him for nine years (i.e. till his death

Bukhari vol. 5, #234 says

"Narrated Aisha: The prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six. We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Harith Kharzraj. Then I got ill and my hair fell down. Later on my hair grew (again) and my mother, Um Ruman, came to me while I was playing in a swing with some of my girl friends. She called me, and I went to her, not knowing what she wanted to do to me. She caught me by the hand and made me stand at the door of the house. I was breathless then, and when my breathing became all right, she took some water and rubbed my face and head with it. Then she took me into the house. There in the house I saw some Ansari women who said, "Best wishes and Allah's blessing and a good luck." Then she entrusted me to them and they prepared me (for the marriage). Unexpectedly Allah's messenger came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age."

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

In addition to the believers who don't question I offer you more research:

FROM THE HADITH OF SAHIH MUSLIM VOLUME 2, #3309
Aisha reported: Allah’s Messenger married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house at the age of nine….

FROM THE HADITH OF THE SUNAN OF ABU DAWUD]
Abu Dawud's Hadith is the third most respected Hadith in IslamFrom Abu Dawud, Vol. 2, #2116:
"Aisha said, "The Apostle of Allah married me when I was seven years old." (The narrator Sulaiman said: "Or six years."). "He had intercourse with me when I was 9 years old

FROM THE HISTORY OF TABARI

Tabari wrote the most authentic Islamic history. It covers 39 volumes. Tabari was one of the greatest Islamic scholars and the greatest Islamic Historian]From Tabari, volume 7, page7

"....my marriage (to Muhammad) was consummated when I was nine....."

From Tabari, volume 9, page 131

"Then the men and women got up and left. The Messenger of God consummated his marriage with me in my house when I was nine years old. Neither a camel nor a sheep was slaughtered on behalf of me"......(The Prophet) married her three years before the Emigration, when she was seven years old and consummated the marriage when she was nine years old, after he had emigrated to Medina in Shawwal. She was eighteen years old when he died

FROM THE ENCYCLOPEDIA OF ISLAM, under "Aisha". (pub. by E.J. Brill).

"Some time after the death of Khadija, Khawla suggested to Muhammad that he should marry either Aisha, the 6 year old daughter of his chief follower, or Sawda Zama, a widow of about 30, who had gone as a Muslim to Abyssinia and whose husband had died there. Muhammad is said to have asked her to arrange for him to marry both. It had already been agreed that Aisha should marry Djubayr Mutim, whose father, though still pagan, was friendly to the Muslims. By common consent, however, this agreement was set aside, and Muhammad was betrothed to Aisha.... The marriage was not consummated until some months after the Hidjra, (in April 623, 624). Aisha went to live in an apartment in Muhammad's house, later the mosque of Median. She cannot have been more than ten years old at the time and took her toys to her new home

From the Muslim book "WOMEN IN ISLAM" by Said Abjullah Seif-Al-Hatimy, published by Islamic Publications in Lahore Pakistan:

"...(Aisha) She was the youngest of his wives. It is said that she was nine years of age when he married her."

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@hareem01

don't lie......go to religion forum and read the thread about getting married at 9....read all the posts including mine and Anwaar's.

I don't lie , it happened then and it happens today.

[CheGuvera]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@Anwaar Qureshi

We take the guidance from Prophet:saw: himself who said - and he was the the Truth-teller upon whom the truth revealed:

1. IF you see an evil, stop it with your hand.

2. IF you do not have power to do so, then stop it with your tongue by speaking against it.

3. And IF you do not have power to speak against it either then, atleast acknowledge it to be bad in your heart, and acknowledging in heart is the lowest level of faith.

---

1. Jihaad as in Qitaal or if a Islamic Sharia’ is rule of the land then by proper judiciary means.

2. Jihaad bil lissaan, Jihaad Bil Qalam etc.

3. Moderate Muslim

Homes, you’re being too gracious there regarding moderate muslims…those who question the wisdon of Quran don’t deserve to be on any level of faith…

[Lajawab]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@uberalles

I don’t lie , it happened then and it happens today.

We know the Prophet of Allah :saw: consummated his marriage with Bibi Ayesha at 9 years old…

What are you trying to say by bringing this up again and again?

If you find something wrong with it, then you should blame your limited understanding of the Islamic faith and your mental myopia…1.2 billion Muslims know that Bibi Ayesha had reached maturity when she was 9 years old and the marriage was perfectly fine and acceptable…And even today is very much acceptable…Except to those who choose to remain ignorant and are brainwashed by the western media into accepting aberrant as wrong and acceptable as aberration…

Culturally, it is not a norm as you claim…If the few isolated incidents indicate to you that every Muslim rushes off to marry off their daughter or marry a girl as soon as she reaches 9 then again it is an indication of a high level of your propensity to remain ignorant…

If the isolated incidents are indicative of a people then by this account every American and European nation is involved in the sex trade of trafficking little children and exploiting them…

Do not use ignorance as an excuse for your argument…In any court of law it is the weakest argument…

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

[BANGLADESH

The Hanafi school is the predominant madhhab in Bangladesh.

]The Constitution was adopted on 4 November 1972. An amendment to the Constitution under President Ziaur Rahman in 1977 removed the principle of secularism that had been enshrined in Part II: Fundamental State Policy, replacing it with "absolute trust and faith in Almighty Allah." The Eighth Amendment of 1988 inserted Article 2A, affirming that "[t]he state religion of the Republic is Islam, but other religions may be practised in peace and harmony in the republic." Some women’s groups challenged this move on the grounds that it risked exposing women to discriminatory laws.

As elsewhere in South Asia, much of the Muslim personal law is unlegislated, the basis for the law being classical Hanafi fiqh except where this has been amended by legislation. The minimum ages of marriage are 21 for men and 18 for women. The legislation provides penal sanctions for those who knowingly participate in the contracting of an under-age marriage, but does not invalidate such marriages.

INDONESIA

, SCHOOL OF FIGH:
The majority of the population is Shafi’i Muslim. There are also Ahmadi minorities. The other recognised religious minorities are Roman Catholic, Protestant, Hindu and Buddhist. There are also significant minorities following tribal religions; they are not afforded any official recognition

The Constitution was promulgated in August 1945. It does not adopt any official religion, but Article 29(1) provides that "the State is based upon the belief in the One, Supreme God", also embodied in the Pancasila. Article 29(2) guarantees freedom of religion

The minimum marriage age is 19 for males and 16 for females, with provision for marriage below the minimum age, subject to judicial discretion and parental consent.

PAKISTAN

The predominant madhhab is the Hanafi, and there are sizeable Ja’fari and Isma’ili minorities. In 1974, then-Prime Minister Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto finally conceded to a long-standing campaign waged by conservative religious elements agitating for the official designation of Ahmadis as non-Muslims.

The third Constitution was adopted on 10th April 1973, suspended in 1977, and re-instituted in 1985; it has undergone numerous amendments over time. It was suspended again in 1999 and remained suspended at the time of writing.

]Article 1 of the Constitution declares that Pakistan shall be known as "the Islamic Republic of Pakistan" and Article 2 declares Islam the state religion. In 1985, the Objectives Resolution contained in the preamble of the Constitution was made a substantive provision by the insertion of Article 2A, thereby requiring all laws to be brought into consonance with the Qur’an and sunnah

The minimum marriage age as the Act currently stands is 18 for males and 16 for females. Despite the provision of penalties for contracting under-age marriages, such unions are not rendered invalid.

HAREEM01 CARE TO EXPRESS WHAT THE ABOVE IN RED MEANS ?????? I guess I am proven right again.

Just so it is not confusing, if parents go ahead and marry off their little GIRL , well thats bad, but what is done is done and the MARRIAGE STAYS. Therefore HAREEM01 on behalf of those little girls what is a little girl to do against all those ADULTS who state her marriage in not invalid? I guess she remains obedient, covered from head to toe, told to walk softly, breed a child every year, forget about her education for she will remain obedient and subordinate to her man for she has been told GOD will find her favorable. So much for piety and parochial establishments.

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@Lajawab

We know the Prophet of Allah :saw: consummated his marriage with Bibi Ayesha at 9 years old…

What are you trying to say by bringing this up again and again?

If you find something wrong with it, then you should blame your limited understanding of the Islamic faith and your mental myopia…1.2 billion Muslims know that Bibi Ayesha had reached maturity when she was 9 years old and the marriage was perfectly fine and acceptable…And even today is very much acceptable…Except to those who choose to remain ignorant and are brainwashed by the western media into accepting aberrant as wrong and acceptable as aberration…

Culturally, it is not a norm as you claim…If the few isolated incidents indicate to you that every Muslim rushes off to marry off their daughter or marry a girl as soon as she reaches 9 then again it is an indication of a high level of your propensity to remain ignorant…

At least we know when you support the concept of pedophilia.

If the isolated incidents are indicative of a people then by this account every American and European nation is involved in the sex trade of trafficking little children and exploiting them…

Do not use ignorance as an excuse for your argument…In any court of law it is the weakest argument…

However, the west has removed it from their religious thinking and CIVIL LAW PROTECTS LITTLE GIRLS, UNLIKE IN ISLAMIC COUNTRIES TODAY, WHERE RELIGION SAYS PEDOPHILIA IS OKAY IN CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES.

IN THE WEST CIVIL LAW SAYS NO CIRCUMSTANCE ACCEPTABLE TO MARRY A 10 YEAR OLD, 11 YEAR OLD , 12 YEARS OLD , 13 YEAR OLD, 14 YEAR OLD AND 15 YEAR OLD. AT 16 PARENTAL CONSENT REQUIRED OTHERWISE MARRIAGE IS INVALID.

**So , FROM your response if your 9 year old daughter has her period its will be OK to marry her to “grandpa’s friend”. ssssssssshhhhhheeeeesh , **

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

LAJAWAB THE WEST HAS PROBLEMS OF SEX EXPLOITATION ALSO LIKE THEY HAVE IN ISLAMIC COUNTRIES AND LOTS OF OTHER COUNTRIES.

BUT UNDER THE WEST IS A FEARSOME WARRIOR AGAINST SUCH SEX EXPLOITATION WITHOUT USING GOD TO PROCLAIM WHEN IT ACCEPTABLE AS IN SOME COUNTRIES I HAVE NOTED FOR YOU. NUDGE , NUDGE , WINK , WINK

HERE IS SOMETHING ELSE TO ENLIGHTEN YOUR MIND AS YOU DO TEND TO THINK EVERYTHING DONE QURANIC IS PURE.

In the Pushtu-speaking areas of West-Pakistan, the unavailability and deprecation of women have encouraged the alternative practice in which the love objects are young boys and homosexual love is part of popular folklore.

In the Pukhtun code of romantic love differs from that of the troubadors and the Baluch in one essential: perhaps because of pervasive relations of hostility between men and women, the loved one for Pukhtun men is quite often a boy or handsome young man. Homoerotic relationships were much more common a generation ago than they are now, since Western influence has brought a sense of shame about homosexuality, at least among the more educated. …] In 1977, homosexuality was very much less in evidence in Swat than it had been. Dancing girls had replaced dancing boys, and transvestites had become rare. Nonetheless, the first sexual experience of many, if not most boys, is with one of their passively inclined peers, or with an older man who is a confirmed bedagh. Older men still may cultivate a handsome young protégé who will accompany them everywhere, though the practice is hardly universal. Male beauty is much admired and the same word, xkuili, or beautiful, is applied to both men and women. Pukhtun poetry is often frankly homoerotic, following the Persian model”.:)

Next time you go for a stroll, just take a look around.

[Puchi_Kuchi]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

If any of my kids turned out to be gay nauzubillah, inshallah it will never happen, I would get them therapy, try to help them psychologically..turn them away from this sickness, bring them back to faith and if they still insisted it was their way of life i'm sorry but I would not want to be part of their life any more

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@Lajawab

And your point is?

Just establishing your pedophilic boundaries.:(

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@Puchi Kuchi

If any of my kids turned out to be gay nauzubillah, inshallah it will never happen, I would get them therapy, try to help them psychologically..turn them away from this sickness, bring them back to faith and if they still insisted it was their way of life i'm sorry but I would not want to be part of their life any more

If they are strong, educated and confident they won't need you either.:)

[Puchi_Kuchi]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@uberalles

If they are strong, educated and confident they won’t need you either.

Then that would be their loss, but me being with them while they would be commiting homosexuality would be me compromising their morals. I cannot and will not agree to it wether its my own flesh and blood.

[Lajawab]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

@uberalles

Just establishing your pedophilic boundaries.

While reasserting your own homosexual tendencies?

I seriously doubt you are a little girl but a guy who feels like one when happy…

And please…When talking to me don’t bring up what the west considers as OK or not OK…The west also considers incest in some of its parts as being OK…

For the west it is OK to nuke civilians, carry out genocide on lesser races and threaten with extinction anyone who doesn’t see their way…And it’s all documented…So I don’t consider what the west considers OK…The west also happens to think of Bush as a capable leader full of conscience…

So please…Leave your homosexual western indoctrination at the door when arguing with any Muslim…History is proof of such flash in the pan ‘enlightenment’ which later falls flat on its face a la Nazi Germany come and go…

I follow a timeless creed…Such idiotic and delusional dogma as the west seems to inspire and spout to shallow people today has been faced by Muslims many times before…They are gone…We remain and will keep remaining…That is the promise of God…

So follow fool’s gold whereever there is more shine…You won’t be the first and you certainly won’t be the last…

And I suggest you come out of your little girl persona and come as you are, dude…No one is going to molest you…People here have pretty good taste…

[uberalles]

Re: Gay couple sexually abused boys they were fostering

[quote=Lajawab]
While reasserting your own homosexual tendencies?

Ah , I see you can not come up with credible discourse to counter my debate and have resorted to venting insults and vitrolic diatribe. Typical angry position taken by many who are loosing the battle of debate and information. Perhaps me challenging on your pedophilic perameters has hit a core. So far you have proven to enlighten muslims like me and many other women and girls that pedophilia iwithin certain religious criteria is permissible and condoned while homosexuality between two consenting adults is abhorrent. Not wonder why thinking and writing of young girls being married has led you to BUSH ..... I am correct again about the view points you vehemently support.:) for you edification, i am a proud, confident , heterosexual ismaili **woman ----three words **which obviously frightens you whether we know you are around or not.:) :) :)