Re: Future of FATA
And why they are attacking the people i mentioned earlier? Are these people responsible for USA attacks and drones?
And look what their brothers in faith did with innocent people in Nairobi, Kenya?
Actually that is done by all extremist parties in Pakistan (in or out of FATA), we need to start de-radicalization, de-weaponization of the country (all inclusive, political parties, extremist parties, militants etc.)
Re: Peace Dialog with taleban
Who will protect KP or later on Punjab from these lead brained "brothers" when KP falls as well? Plus, would afghanistan "allow" an independent FATA for whatever ability that they have to undermine it?
have some shame!!!
Re: Future of FATA
I wish it was that simple, once you have gangsters seeing benefits in easy money, easy power they are not going to let it go so easily.
We need to go back to Pakistan of 1960s, 1970s... I wish we could delete the history from 1980-2013.
These things happening since 1983 in Pakistan in one way or the other.
Can you share me instances of this religious extremisim against pakistani government/attack on pakistani forces pre 2001?
Re: Peace Dialog with taleban
have some shame!!!
Do i look taliban to you?
Re: Future of FATA
Can you share me instances of this religious extremisim against pakistani government/attack on pakistani forces pre 2001?
TNSM in 1994?
Re: Peace Dialog with taleban
have some shame!!!
Do i look taliban to you?
Taliban... shame... oxymoron? :D
Re: Future of FATA
A lot needs to happen, I agree. We need to start correcting things, and that would be one part of it. FATA is part of problem too, and we need to correct that one too, it needs to follow same rules as other parts of Pakistan.
I wish it was that simple, once you have gangsters seeing benefits in easy money, easy power they are not going to let it go so easily.
We need to go back to Pakistan of 1960s, 1970s... I wish we could delete the history from 1980-2013.
TNSM in 1994?
Not relevent as TNSM is Not in FATA and also pakistan army was rescued by Mufti nizam shamzai who helped in clearing the roads.
Re: Future of FATA
Can you share me instances of this religious extremisim against pakistani government/attack on pakistani forces pre 2001?
The Pakistani government ruled the area indirectly through local agents prior to 2001 - there was no Army or Frontier Constabulary there to attack.
Re: Future of FATA
Can you share me instances of this religious extremisim against pakistani government/attack on pakistani forces pre 2001?
Pakistani people are not separate from Pakistani army - pre 2001 there were numerous attacks on other faiths since 1983.
Re: Future of FATA
I would be in favour of laying landmines along the the KP-FATA border if it would enhance the security of our civilians and soldiers
Re: Future of FATA
Can you share me instances of this religious extremisim against pakistani government/attack on pakistani forces pre 2001?
TNSM in 1994?
Not relevent as TNSM is Not in FATA and also pakistan army was rescued by Mufti nizam shamzai who helped in clearing the roads.
You talked about religious extremism and Pakistan, you didn't ask specifically for FATA.
Re: Future of FATA
You talked about religious extremism and Pakistan, you didn't ask specifically for FATA.
Sorry for not clearly mentioning that. i wrote **this religious extremism **in context of the subject.
[QUOTE]
Pakistani people are not separate from Pakistani army - pre 2001 there were numerous attacks on other faiths since 1983.
[/QUOTE]
People of FATA are also pakistanis. please share instances of terror attacks by people from FATA. Why i am asking is that in my opinion this extremism and hatred against pakistani army is due to our operation/atrocities in FATA.
Re: Future of FATA
Have you heard of the hadess where it is stated that do you kill women, elderly, kids and do not destroy crops and trees in war?
Re: Future of FATA
People of FATA are also pakistanis. please share instances of terror attacks by people from FATA. Why i am asking is that in my opinion this extremism and hatred against pakistani army is due to our operation/atrocities in FATA.
"Our" operation started AFTER TTP began terrorizing local populations.
Re: Future of FATA
"Our" operation started AFTER TTP began terrorizing local populations.
Bao Bihari is technically correct, actually.
After the Afghanistan Taliban were overthrown in Afghanistan, Pakistan recognised the American-backed government in Afghanistan as the legitimate government authority over all of Afghanistan.
After losing the battle of Tora Bora, many elements of the Afghan Taliban, particularly Pakistani, Arab, and Central Asian militants fighting for the restoration of the Afghan Taliban rebased themselves in the FATA where they often had family connections, having married into local families in the 80s and 90s.
From the FATA, they began attacking across the border into Afghanistan.
Pakistan's military moves into the FATA began as an attempt to stop the FATA from being used as a springboard for attacking American and Afghan troops. Pakistan's public position was, and remains, that the Karzai government and its American backers represent the legitimate authority in Afghanistan. As such, Pakistan was not going to allow its territory to be used for activities attempting to overthrow Karzai and eject the foreign soldiers.
The objective was to arrest or chase out the non-Pakistani militants living there who were involved in cross-border attacks. The individuals were, however, very tied into local social structures and the FATA quickkly devolved into a civil war, with pro and anti government tribes fighting it out, with army involvement.
The TTP emerged several years later, as an anti-government movement which draws significant support from specific tribes in the FATA.
Re: Future of FATA
I think Pervez Musharraf said that he had asked americans if he should deploy troops in FATA but they had said that it wasn't needed. I think the pakistani army itself should have proactively deployed in FATA to prevent taliban from taking hold. FCR is crap in itself in the 1st place, but in a security vacumm the better military trained taliban just killed all the levies or political agents that opposed them and FC (the police of the area) just sat by while they took over the area.
Ultimately, it is pakistan's fault since pakistanis are dying in the thousands and the economy is bleeding due to not tackling a law and order problem after 9/11. The establishment, political parties etc still haven't learned anything from the experience but I guess that is what you get for raising a jahil qaum whose education is rattabaazi. These people elect similar people to power and also themselves become leaders and part of the army and establishment. There is no long term thinking in Pakistan be it dealing with the militants or how to run wars with india in the past.
Re: Future of FATA
"Our" operation started AFTER TTP began terrorizing local populations.
this is not correct actually. Operation has destroyed lives of millions in tribal areas and yet the TTP which is basicaly very small portion of total population. Major qabailee clans including hafiz gul bahadur and others do not attack pakistanis yet their lands are still not safe from pakistan army. Wait till they stand against pakistani army then this 1948/1971/somalia fame army will know its limits.
Actualy this suggestion of operations against FATA people is against pakistan.
Re: Future of FATA
this is not correct actually. Operation has destroyed lives of millions in tribal areas and yet the TTP which is basicaly very small portion of total population. Major qabailee clans including hafiz gul bahadur and others do not attack pakistanis yet their lands are still not safe from pakistan army. Wait till they stand against pakistani army then this 1948/1971/somalia fame army will know its limits.
Actualy this suggestion of operations against FATA people is against pakistan.
So may be you can tell when and why operation started... our army just woke up one day and rushed into FATA? I am not sure if "millions" actually live in FATA but I can believe that TTP, operations and drones have destroyed lives of many.
BTW, I do not support any "operation". If any, it should be strictly against the terrorists, precise and accurate capture and killing (if resisted) of the leadership.
Re: Future of FATA
Bao Bihari is technically correct, actually.
After the Afghanistan Taliban were overthrown in Afghanistan, Pakistan recognised the American-backed government in Afghanistan as the legitimate government authority over all of Afghanistan.
After losing the battle of Tora Bora, many elements of the Afghan Taliban, particularly Pakistani, Arab, and Central Asian militants fighting for the restoration of the Afghan Taliban rebased themselves in the FATA where they often had family connections, having married into local families in the 80s and 90s.
From the FATA, they began attacking across the border into Afghanistan.
Pakistan's military moves into the FATA began as an attempt to stop the FATA from being used as a springboard for attacking American and Afghan troops. Pakistan's public position was, and remains, that the Karzai government and its American backers represent the legitimate authority in Afghanistan. As such, Pakistan was not going to allow its territory to be used for activities attempting to overthrow Karzai and eject the foreign soldiers.
The objective was to arrest or chase out the non-Pakistani militants living there who were involved in cross-border attacks. The individuals were, however, very tied into local social structures and the FATA quickkly devolved into a civil war, with pro and anti government tribes fighting it out, with army involvement.
The TTP emerged several years later, as an anti-government movement which draws significant support from specific tribes in the FATA.
Pakistani army started operation when tribals refused to handover incoming foreigners from Afghanistan. This is one of the reasons why FATA should be either full part of Pakistan where completely Pakistani laws are enforced or they become independent so they don't have to follow Pakistani laws.