FREE SPEECH - Pak.Org Policy & MegaBUK

Hangout GupShup Cafe
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Thank you everyone for your patience on this issue. We have investigated the whole matter and explored the options. The following are our findings and recommendations:

  1. We honor the Free Speech issue. We feel that one should be able to raise their concerns and voice about almost anything but in a civilized manner.
  2. The root of the problem was found to be a couple of posts deleted by the Admin of this website and some bans that followed. Some posts got deleted only because these happened to be in the wrong places at the wrong time. (the act was however wrong).
  3. The Admins maintain that they deleted the posts with false claims and acquisitions about GUPSHUP and advertisements for other websites. By policy that is not allowed and everyone agrees to that when they sign up.
  4. The chain reaction of deleting was not appropriate.
  5. Accepting the demands for free speech, Pak.Org is opening another website where anyone can practice their skills.
  6. Pak.Org will remain in operation as it is without any large policy changes. What was initially done was correct but the reactions were not appropriate. And we are making sure the Admin team notes this.
  7. The Moderator team will remain as it is and Moderators, loosely directed by the Admins, will still run GUPSHUP.
  8. Pak.Org has the right to enforce any of the policies you accepted by joining this website. A copy of this policy can be viewed by clicking on the register button.

The bottom line is that the Board has found no evidence that there’s a need of policy change at GUPSHUP. It shall remain moderated by a team selected among you, the visitors. For those who would like to see more freedom of speech, we have another site open and ready for you. NOBODY is the moderator there.

The site (Mega.BUK.buk) can be found at http://www.megapak.com .

We sincerely hope that this should answer all of your concerns. Please do not start arguing that we should make GUPSHUP a place where any one can post anything without any moderation. These forums will remain moderated. As a matter of fact, we may request the moderators to be a little stricter on their individual policies. We want to keep this a nice, clean and descent place. Someone accused that there are still threads that may be classified as inappropriate; for those people, we have the good news. We will be cleaning GUPSHUP. The blunt discussions can go to MegaBUKbuk.

Please understand that the goal here is to provide people a place where they can come and enjoy lighthearted conversations. We have tried the ‘ALL POSTS WELCOME’ policy in the past, it did not work. And it will never work.

Lets go back to our GUPSHUP or MegaBUK. Shall we?

Best Regards,
Fazia Ahmed,
Chair, Board Of Directors

[This message has been edited by Fazia Ahmed (edited February 23, 2000).]

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Hello Faiza Jee,

I posted this post in the Meeting New People Fora, and it seemed to have been deleted, by mistake ofcourse, since it happened to be next to Hinna's Patronizing Lecture thread.

But thank God I saved it, having had my posts deleted here numerous times, I'm smart cookie am I not? :) And I would like some space in this thread to post it, since no one can dare delete or close this post/thread.

Sorry for this imposition.

Yes, it was definitely all worth it and pretty interesting while it lasted. I had just said Hi to you guppies a couple of days ago, thanks for everyone who welcomed me (excluding Azkar who made it clear that he was not welcoming me at all). It was nice to chat with a few of ya'll, favorably or non-favorably.
The new "policy" of this Administration only potrays these things.

  1. Get Lost
  2. We'll be even stricter
  3. But please get lost to our site so that we can still make money off of your clicks.

Isn't that just dandy! You can have your cake and stuff it too? And you actually think your "registered members" are dumb enough to go for that?

Well, I know it won't make a damn difference to anyone here, but I would like to say I will not post here nor at the other megashutup site of yours. So, if you don't mind, please start quoting 29,999 members next time Azkar, instead of 30,000.

Thanks. 

dixSi<

p.s. I would also like to say that it is surprising for such a popular, and "official" site like this, to have such an unproffessional president. He should look into some diplomacy and relaxation classes, stat!

[This message has been edited by dixSi (edited February 23, 2000).]

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I think we have enough material for our users to decide what suits them better. Your services are no longer needed, dixsi bibi.

Azkar

ps: Are you an alias of devuchka? He was as dheet as you are.. just wondering.

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No, Azkar, this dixsi guy is a little less hairy than me.
**
Dev.
ps:** I like this GUPPIE personality on our forum ... would you like a cultural exchange ?

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Need more traffic? Dev?

http://www.pak.org/gupshup/biggrin.gif

I thought you guys did not want to come here. What brings you here?

Azkar Choudhry

ps: tsk tsk …

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awwww Dick-si _itch left

http://www.pak.org/gupshup/frown.gif

ciao,
BoSS

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Dear Fazia:
Thank you for all the PR bhangi work you are doing for Chowdhry Sayb after his colossal poopoo on here. Kudos to you for your unflinching loyalty. I hope you reach new heights on TOPP for facing the DheeT folks that have suddenly emerged on your paak saaf family oriented forum.
This time I will do you a service and offer your readers a tashreeh of your new policy..lest it be misunderstood and another innocent shpooki bites the dust. haiN? I am doing this service fi sabil Allah.

“We honor the Free Speech issue. We feel that one should be able to raise their concerns and voice about almost anything but in a civilized manner.”

We like free speech as long as we like it but as soon as we stop liking it we will ban because anything we don’t like is uncivilized. Anything that is blasphemous to Shahanshaah shah jehaN saani belongs to the gutter and will be therefore deleted.

By the way fazia I will even give you a muft ka angrezi lesson. it’s accusation. Khair…

  • Admins can maintain whatever they want to maintain because they are admins goddamitt! they can delete posts, alter posts and ban people and then they can come and tell a white lie. And so what if they lie? Chowdhary saab and the moderators have a web site to run!! Take it or leave it!*
  • It was inappropriate (and look how big we are to admit this) but so what? We are the Admins..the Phannay Khans of WWW.PAK.ORG. Kal lo jo kalna ai *

Hahaha this is the best I admit. reminds me of Faiz…
hum say kehtay haiN chaman waalay ghareebaan e chaman,
tum koi achha sa rakh lo apnay veeraanay ka naam

  • After Chowdhary Sayb ShahjehaaN saani made the poopoo we are in a PR quagmire…so we have decided to build you a little hyde park where you can go play. You can be happy (and lemme repeat what dixsi said) and click on our side..which means more rokRa in chowdhary sayb’s pockets. Long live Walmart! But here, any voice of dissent against chowdhary sayb will not be tolerated. Be thankful for what he has given yu already. *
  • Get lost! We are mighty angry at you to bring us into this situation by actually voting FOR free speech. (We were kinda hoping you’d say no, esp. after we scared you about the Chowk kinda situation.)*

get lost. we aint changing nothing. Isn’t it enough that we gave you a new playground? Did we mention that Chowdhary Sayb has a site to run? haiN?*

KKHH

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Thank you for the correction. English has never been my primary language.

We respect your opinions and leave the decision with our visitors. They will decide. We have made our position clear.
This site cannot please everybody. There will always be extreme cases. We just hope that people with your level of high intelligence can see and respect the fact.

Fazia Ahmed

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Oh! a big hangama happened, i missed it all. i usually dont check this 'general' or 'meeting people' sections since they usually discuss harmless stuff.

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Kuchh Kuchh Hota Hai 3
aap boltay bohut acha ho .. khein nazar na lagay .. :)

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After Chowdhary Sayb ShahjehaaN saani made the poopoo we are in a PR quagmire...so we have decided to build you a little hyde park where you can go play. You can be happy (and lemme repeat what dixsi said) and click on our side..which means more rokRa in chowdhary sayb's pockets. Long live Walmart! But here, any voice of dissent against chowdhary sayb will not be tolerated. Be thankful for what he has given yu already. <<<<

well let me be the first one to remind u that you have been putting down chowdry for a while and havent gotten banned yet. so why r u complaining? if u dont like this site then go piss off somewhere else. its very simple. unless u like drinking from where u piss which u do like ur fellow indians.

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This is all wastage....You admit mistakes have been made but no apologies....You admit posts has been deleted without reason but no corrections...I would say you guys wasted all those hours for nothing in that meeting. Being around here for a while, I knew the outcome. No surprise for me.

If I remember we have gone through this even before....remember Ironman episode... We debated and argued and finally the ..The hukkam was..."Its my site..my property ...so I will do what I want."...I expected the same jawaab this time too and here I got it again.

The fact will remain that you deleted the posts that did not contain any foul words, any porn words at all. Yes they were aggressive and attacking Azkar personally..but so what?.. should have kept them and let people see themselves and decide. You are saying it now.."let people see it and decide" See what? seeing one side only is not good for making up one minds..

As for as accepting the new rules(which are really old rules with no change) or get lost. What choice do I have? I don't accpet the rules and I won't get lost. BUT one thing I can feel....that this website is run like a vernacular akhbaar from Rawalpindi......jo chaho chhaapo jo na chaho raddi ki tokari mein... It won't work forever...unless all our our desi breed remains khooh-ke-daddoo forever. This is Internet...the global media..rules of Rawalpindi won't work forever.

I personally beleive, that Azkar should remain out of any discussions...whenever he comes in problem khaRi ho jaati hai. If you are going to participate in discussions, people are going to make personal attacks on you....in case of normal members we make counter attacks in reaction but you being the aurhtority start deleting posts...which was a wrong reaction. That was the whole problem in my view.

In this whole saga, I didn't take certain view point because I liked one or hated others. Any one who has been around both these sites can tell you that I been in e-fights and e-gaali-gloach with some of the banned indiviuals many times. In fact I am not even on e-speaking terms with one of them. But that is not the isssue. These forums are for discussing things not reacting to people's posts on the basis of your personal grudge against them. but if you do that, listen to their reaction also. Which in my view you did not or could not.

For all other members who have not said a word about it....and might have gotten the inconvenience because everyone got busy with this episode and no one could entertain in the religion and politics threads.....and no posts in poetry section either...I apologise on my part. But it was necessary.

CM

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What the hell these dick-si, devil_uchakka, and Kuchh Kuchh Hota Hai 3 are?
you bloody ppl do you think what you are saying ? have ever noticed your behaviuor? bast*** Is this way you learnt from your parents?

I know, you might be hindu rascles! listen , if you don’t like this frorum just leave without hesitation, we want a PAK froum, so please leave right away we dont want see your ugly posts, disguiting, our admis had made a site for you “megabuk”, where you people can write whatever you have learnt from your parents, one more thing do even think to mess up moi

http://www.pak.org/gupshup/devil.gif

may sub kay bhaid khol doonga, yahoo…

[This message has been edited by Admin (edited February 24, 2000).]

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CM. I do stay away. It was only when the policies of this website were broken that I had to intervene. I dont recall telling any one how to form policies of moderation. You can confirm that even with our ex Moderator Kash girl. She can be honest and tell us all that Azkar never instructed her on how to run the forums.

I am sorry if I tried to do anything to save my business. I hope will will understand that it was part of my job. Other than that, what can I say? I cannot let people come here and steal away our visitors. Would you CM?

Azkar Choudhry

[This message has been edited by Azkar Choudhry (edited February 24, 2000).]

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People on various web sites on the Internet mention and talk about other sites all the time. I am sure most members of GupShup were steered to Pak.Org from information they saw on other websites on the net. I for one, never heard about it and was mentioned by Kashmirigirl or Muzna first time while interacting on Chowk chatrooms. Since then many people on other sites and ICQ have come to know about GupShupp from me. I understand that no one should put banners advertising their business in their posts but just mention of other sites and that too some times in light hearted mood is no big deal.

If this site is good...it is good. Believe in competition. If your product is better why worry about others. Why are you worried about losing visitors? There is too much confrontation going on on some of the sites mentioned than many of our bacha log can take. For Example on of our respected guppoo is caught with his head deep in sand on Chowk for few days now. I don't think anyone would have said anything about asking people, transparently, to stop advertising other sites. But deleting posts that you don't like IS A SIN in this business. For Example, don't you find anything offensive or foul in some of the posts in this thread? Do you think I should show them to my Ammi? No way...ohne mera sir chhitar maar maar ke ganja kar deina ain....

I am sure you don't tell mods how to moderate forums but at the same time these posts were not deleted by moderators either but by you.

CM

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CM. I agree with you. If the posts were friendlier, I may have let them go by. But yaar, they were attacking. I may have been carried away, but what can I do? I have posted a public apology for my actions and the need for the actions.

I guess, you are right afterall. I shopuld have let the posts stay and let the people see their real face.

Azkar

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Boy oh boy,
i visited MegaBuk buk once or twice.
Azkar bhai, what a waist of energy.
And you are also polluting this site cos of the relation.

My advise : Close it asap.

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the purpose behind megabubuk was to prove that non-moderated forums will ultimately fail!

Its a place where people speak from their innerselves. Watch them exposed there.

But Nobody is saying that we cannot weed out the posts after a while. Afterall, people do throw away their trash. :)

Azkar Choudhry

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Its a place where people speak from their innerselves. Watch them exposed there.

There is nothing wrong with honest, "from the innerself" postings. Our society has all kinds of ppl, some with reprehensible views. One school of thought is that it is better to let them speak and be confronted than to have them swept under the carpet. Sanitised news is what PTV delivers, and we all know how much respect that carries.

The experiment on moderated vs non-moderated forums at least in the soc.culture.pakistan newsgrp world showed that it was the moderated forums, albeit under dadagiri, that failed.

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I believe if BuK BuK forums fail it will not be because it is non-moderated but because it was hyped as the 'other' site where you can talk dirty. The slow posting on GuppShupp indicates where the other guppoos are....yes guessed it right!

CM