Fir'awn (Pharaoh) Smarter than Ash'aris/Maturidees?

[AllahkaBanda]

@Rabbz

You dont seem to understand the situation do you!

As dor Imam Ahmed, his time was the era of naqly dalail therefore it was sufficient for him to prove so, where as at the time of Imam Abul Hassan Ashari was the time of philosophy, groups such as the mutazila appeared whom used philosophy, and to contradict them we had to take philsophy as the naqly dalail ( i.e quran and Sunnah) wasnt sufficient.
This is also happened when Al-Ghazzali and Razi where confronted.

your lack of historical knowledge is amazing. Can you please tell us when did Mu’tazilite started with their heresy? They were the first one to use philsophy and most of the Salaf warned against the iluml kalam, even your shaykh haddad admits it. If the use of philsophy was neccessary why didn’t the Salaf do so?

@Rabbz

As for your verses and ahadith, you like Ibn Taymiyyah has taken everything literal,
Try looking into the tafaseer, such as the tafseer of Ar Razi and youll find your answer

yeh, according to you, even the Salaf were deivated because they took the ayaat of the Sifaat upon their dahir meaning. Maybe you should try reading an earlier tafsir: Tafsir by 'Abdullah ibn 'Abass and Imam ibn Jarir at-Tabari (May Allah be pleased with them)

@Rabbz

And please, keep yoru shaykh ul islam to urself, as for him we did give him an answer
Read the books writtedn by Shaykh ul Islam Tajuddin Subki

yeh sure

@Iconoclast

Althogh from personal POV i am least interested in this debate of where God is/or not, i am interested in what opinion did Imam Malik, Shafe and Abu Hanifa had on this matter

refer to this post

@Rabbz

Imam Abu Hanifa says in his Wasiyya: “Had He been in a place and needing to sit and rest before creating the Throne, then the question ‘Where was Allah?’ would have applied to Him, which is impossible… We assert that Allah is established on the throne without His need (haja) nor settlement (istiqrar) upon it, for He it is Who preserves the Throne and other than it without needing any of them.”

subhaanAllah, you just proved my point and refuted your deviant belief that Allah is not over His throne; allhamdulillah, Imam abou Hanifa clarifies the position of the Ahle Sunnah when he said “Allah is established on the throne without His need (haja) nor settlement (istiqrar) upon it”; whereas you say He is everywhere and the Istawa means He conquered (istalwa) the throne

@Rabbz

He said in his al-Fiqh al-akbar: “Allah has no limits, nor any rivals… He who says: ‘I do not know if my Lord is in the heavens or on the earth’ is a disbeliever, and he who says: ‘He is on the Throne, and I do not know whether the Throne is in the heaven or on the earth,’ he is also a disbeliever.” Imam Abu Mansur al-Maturidi explained this to mean: "The reason is that by such words he suggests a place for Allah and this is idolatry."

look, how mansur maturidi distorted the clear words of Imam abou Hanifa (rahimahullah) when he clearly refuted your deviant belief.

@Rabbz

A man asked Imam Malik: “How did Allah make istiwa’ on the throne?” Imam Malik inclined his head and was silent until the sweat of fever covered his brow, then he looked up and said: “Istiwa’ is not unknown (ghayru majhul), the modality of it is inconceivable in the mind (al-kayfu minhu ghayru ma`qul); but belief in it is obligatory, and inquiring about it is a heretical innovation. You are an innovator.” And he gave orders for him to be taken out.

do you realize that this again refutes you and proves our point? He said that Istawa is not unkown but kayf is and asking about kayf is an innovation; this is exactly what we say!

@Rabbz

**Imam Shafi**i said: "Whoever says: al-Rahmanu ala al-`arsh istawa, it is said to him: This verse is one of the mutashabih (ambiguous matter) concerning which one is perplexed to give an answer, and the same is said regarding similar verses."

doesn’t help you a bit because we agree on what Imam said. mutashabih ayaat doesn’t mean that no one unserstands their meaning.