How come he found communism and sufism compatible?
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
How do you define Communism? Is it merely an anti-religious ideology?
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
^^^ But most of the communist are/were atheist. Communism forbade existence of God.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
^^^ But most of the communist are/were atheist. Communism forbade existence of God.
Interestingly, after fall of USSR, statues of Communist leaders were melted down to make Cross for churches :D
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
@muqawwee kaur is right. but I am curious to know what is with sufism, is it a compromised version of islam then? or something else?
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
Another interesting thing, Wasif Ali Wasif is/was liked by faiz and orya maqbool jan.
And orya is considered a taliban appologist?
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
Interestingly, after fall of USSR, statues of Communist leaders were melted down to make Cross for churches :D
Same happened with Leaders of Nazi Germany and Saddam, that represents tyranny of dictatorship rather than opposition to ideology
@muqawwee kaur is right. but I am curious to know what is with sufism, is it a compromised version of islam then? or something else?
People have belief first and then they start suiting certain ideologies to their faith.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
Same happened with Leaders of Nazi Germany and Saddam, that represents tyranny of dictatorship rather than opposition to ideology
People have belief first and then they start suiting certain ideologies to their faith.
seems true.
But sufism is something special. It has been attracted by people from almost every walk of life. A lot has been written for sufism by non-muslims as well.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
seems true. But sufism is something special. It has been attracted by people from almost every walk of life. A lot has been written for sufism by non-muslims as well.
It is mostly mysticism, similar to nirgun and nirakar bhakti of Hinduism in which god is without any quality and is shapelessness attained only by complete devotion to god.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
@muqawwee kaur is right. but I am curious to know what is with sufism, is it a compromised version of islam then? or something else?
There is no tareeqa without shar'eea.
Otherwise, there are compromised version of everything / every ideology.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
Another interesting thing, Wasif Ali Wasif is/was liked by faiz and orya maqbool jan. And orya is considered a taliban appologist?
Iqbal called Rumi peer o Murshid and Rumi's thoughts reflected in Bhulle Shah's poetry. You can have same inspirations, but different ideologies. Didn't non-Muslims praised Prophet without accepting Islam?
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
There is no tareeqa without shar'eea.
Otherwise, there are compromised version of everything / every ideology.
right
Iqbal called Rumi peer o Murshid and Rumi's thoughts reflected in Bhulle Shah's poetry. You can have same inspirations, but different ideologies. Didn't non-Muslims praised Prophet without accepting Islam?
But there are three stages Iqbal gone through in his life. He was pro-sufism first, then became"moderate" (confused with sufism), and then almost left sufism.
re last sentence, so what did faiz do? did he praise communism without being an atheist or praised sufism without declaring himself a firm believer of faith?
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
right
But there are three stages Iqbal gone through in his life. He was pro-sufism first, then became"moderate" (confused with sufism), and then almost left sufism. re last sentence, so what did faiz do? did he praised communism without being an atheist or praised sufism without declaring himself a firm believer of faith?
Don't know much about how Faiz taken communism versus faith. His poetry got references to God, Life hereafter, etc besides favoring the labor force.
In a group discussion, where Ashfaq Ahmed was part of the penal, he asked a question from Faiz : As a reader I want to ask your poetry is full of love, kindness, colors, sounds and different seasons. How come you could deliver such things inspite of being a friend to Russia? We as a readers are surprised due to this contrast.
Faiz replied: Whatever we have read, learned and seen is not just related to friendship with Russia. As there are stages in life, there is a stage that belongs friendship with Russia. They befriended us and we befriended them. At times, we befriend people in CID.
I'm translating this from a Sindhi book related to interviews of Faiz. There are certain question related to the topic of thread Sufi Vs Revolutionary.. will come up with translated passages shortly :)
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
Okay, so in that interview, there is this question from Ajmal Niazi:
Please let us know about Islam's practical role and revolutionary aspects of religion?
Faiz replied:
I believe religions are for betterment of humanity and revolution for positive changes. The level of revolution Islam brought to the world is a rare phenemonon in human history. Faith and religion are one thing and thekedar (owners) of faith are other thing. A system which got different classes, got different interests of different classes. The main point to ponder is whether religion is being used for intended purpose i.e. for betterment of humanity and guidance of people. Imposition of faith by force and violence is not justified in teachings of any religion.
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This all summaries that Faiz was not against religion as is the perception for communists is.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
sufism [especially the fake one] is a way to 'gumraahi'...the atheists are 'gumraah people so they are compatible in their own way.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
What do you mean by fake one? so you believe there is a real version which doesn’t lead to gumrahi?
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
Communism isn't anti religion. Jesus is often referred to as the first communist. What you are thinking of is Soviet style oligarchy disguised as communism.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
BTW, Faiz's mother (Bee jee) was a religious lady, who not only made Faiz's British wife learn Punjabi, but also made her learn Quran. Faiz father was mureed of Pir Laal Badshah, a Pir from a village Dervesh near Hari Pur. Faiz mentions in his interview that from the age of 7-8 till he went to college, he accompanied his father to masjid for prayers. he used to attend dars (religious lessons / sermons) of Molvi Ibrahim Sialkoti and that definitely had an impact on Faiz's thoughts. Faiz also told in that interview that when he was doing his Masters he attended a one year Islamic course and attended dars of Mufti Muhammad Hussain at Neela Gunbad. FaizS was inspired from Syed Sumleman Nadvi, Ataullah Shah Bukhari and met many religious scholars in company of Sufi Tabassum (Tot batot fame)
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
Communism isn't anti religion. Jesus is often referred to as the first communist. What you are thinking of is Soviet style oligarchy disguised as communism.
Exactly, Faiz mentions that in initial year of revolution, people were against religion as it was being used by rulers (Czar) to exploit masses. With the passage of time, things settled in USSR and people got freedom to exercise religion. Famous poet Qateel Shifai, who was a panelist in that interview with Faiz, told that he saw Muslims offering prayers in Russia. He was, hoever, told that state didn't fund religious activities.
Re: Faiz was communist and pro Sufism
BTW, Faiz's mother (Bee jee) was a religious lady, who not only made Faiz's British wife learn Punjabi, but also made her learn Quran. Faiz father was mureed of Pir Laal Badshah, a Pir from a village Dervesh near Hari Pur. Faiz mentions in his interview that from the age of 7-8 till he went to college, he accompanied his father to masjid for prayers. he used to attend dars (religious lessons / sermons) of Molvi Ibrahim Sialkoti and that definitely had an impact on Faiz's thoughts. Faiz also told in that interview that when he was doing his Masters he attended a one year Islamic course and attended dars of Mufti Muhammad Hussain at Neela Gunbad. FaizS was inspired from Syed Sumleman Nadvi, Ataullah Shah Bukhari and met many religious scholars in company of Sufi Tabassum (Tot batot fame)
faiz is a very interesting person. a true gem.