Ex Army COAS says Baloch operation was a mistake

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
21

Admit it or not but we were respected a lot more in Musharaff's era than now.
Never in my life, i was taken to a room for questioning just because i returned from PAKISTAN. We had a lot more respect before Zardari came into power.
Was our economic situation really as bad as this during his rule???
How did power problems start months into Zardari's rule??? He was there for 10 years, we never had problems on such a massive scale. Most of the ministers in his time were educated and did their job well. We never had a retard coming on tv claiming he has right to be corrupt.
He obviously didn't make all the right decisions and probably lost it in the end but he was WAY WAY better than this moron.
I know we Pakistanis love to hate or ex leaders but at least choose the best one from the available bunch and SURELY Zardari, Sharif, Altaf Hussain aren't really the best ones.

22

I think you are right...

As bad as Mushy ended, we were doing alot better in those times, as a matter of fact, we were way ahead in economic terms than we are now.. at that time we were emerging economy now we are classified as economy dependent on DONORS...

23

We never really do learn from history, do we?

Now that we made mistake of electing PPP again into power, we see the empty headed mushy's time better than the current one.

Why can't I criticize Mushy's policies that enabled jihadi outfits to easily recruit people? Why was TTP settlement in Swat and Punjab not resisted during Mushy's time? Why is it that when west supports dictators in Pakistan, we think he's doing well? Why is it that Mushy enabled the looters to come back and govern us again? Why was NRO promulgated? The current regime is NRO's child, remember? Why is it that democracy is suppressed for a decade, and the environment kept feasible for corrupt politicians to rule us again and then people remembering the 'good old dictatorship' again?

Just because the economy was synthetically kept alive, I would support extra-judicial killings of people? Even USA gives chance to 'terrorists' in Guantanamo bay for a trial.

Should I not criticize the fact that your 'known' kings and queens of corruption were allowed to be free? Isn't that equally condemnable to let criminals roam around free? Dictators conquer our country time and again on the premise that the politicians are corrupt. Why isn't a single politician convicted of corruption then? If Zardari is corrupt, Mushy & Co are equally to be blamed for letting him roam around free.

Should we forget the biggest military blunder of Pakistani history?

24

I won't be surprised if you blame Musharaff for Benazir's murder as well.
Benazir came back to Pakistan because generous people of Pakistan wanted her to come back just like Nawaz Sharif. Musharaff knew that he couldn't stop Bhutto and Sharif to come back and made a deal ( i don't agree with his decision though).
It was still upto people of Pakistan to decide who they want in power, did we reject BB or Nawaz???
Did the elected memebers of PPP reject Zardari????
Did Nawaz Sharif do anything about it?? (jiska apna daman ganda ho woh Zardari ko kya pakrega).

As i said, Musharraff made an absolute blunder to try to hold on to the power and he should be taken to court for that but when people blindly accuse him of carrying out mass murder in lal masjid then surely there is a problem. This is because people are living in denail, they think innocent small kids were just reading quran there but Kafir Musharaff murdered all of them to please evil Americans. The reason why i brought lal masjid is because most people in Pakistan think that "lal masjid is the biggest blunder Musharaff made which brought his downfall NOT NRO.
Now there is no Musharaff in country, he is not in power and he can't influence anything in next elections but i can guarantee that our samajhdar awaam wll bring back their beloved Nawaz $harif in the next elections. You are just trying to hide behind Musharaff's mistake otherwise Pakistani awam are the only one responsible for bringing Zardari in power.
Just like our current government, you can blame Musharaff for ALL the problems.

25

Re: Ex Army COAS says Baloch operation was a mistake

^ See. again you are comparing governments.

I am just saying that if dictators seize power on premise that politicians are corrupt, am I being too demanding if I expect them to actually DO SOMETHING about their corruption instead of forgiving all the criminals with a stroke of pen?

There is no moral ground for generals to conquer the country and repeatedly rape it if they just want to share the pleasures with politicians.

You didn't even try to answer my questions. During which government did Taliban take over Swat? During which government were Baluch people demanded separation? Now that we have those situations slightly under control.

You see, if you have no brains, as required by the army, the only thing you know is 'yes sir', 'hell, no', 'whitewash it' and 'shoot it' and that destroyed Pakistan during Mushy's time.

P.S. Logic says that If I am criticizing Musharraf, I am not necessarily trying to praise someone else.

26

You have got to be kidding me! A record number of Pakistanis were detained, held, questioned, deported etc in his time from abroad. Forgetting the London incident etc?

Also, even if you are right, did it imply to you that it took 10 years of incompetency and bad policies to cause this resentment and suspicion, rather than Zardari's short tenure so far.

27

Lal Masjid, NRO, war crimes, kargil... the man was a dunce full of blunders. No wonder the ulla ka patha hides abroad now.

28

Well said :k:

29

Kakabali & Spock

Not that i am any fan of Mushy ( apart of his first three years, when he really made difference)

there are some resemblance in Mushy and Zardari rule

1) One of Mushy's Ministers said on tv that Quran had 40 Paras...
1.a) One of Zardari's spokersperson said, Syedna Omer (RZA) was called by the Judiciary because no constitution existed at that time
(Making mockery of Islam)

2) Sher Afgan and Others spend energies to prove that CJ is wrong and their govt is functioning as per constitution
2.a) Babar Awan and Others are doing their best to prove that Supreme Court is wrong and Govt is functioning as per constitution
( both has forgotten the basic lesson, it is SC who have interpretative power... 2ndly both are speaking out of SC just to show muscles)

3) 17th Amendment claimed that Both BB and NS are out of Pak-Politics for good, Musharaf can be leader of the country and has all the powers he wanted
3.a) 18th Amendment is claiming generals are history, Party leaders such as Zardari and NS are officially and constitutionally has been declared leader of the nation, any member of parliament has to follow the orders of his party leader (elected or not)

(amendments in both Mushy and Zardari era has been endorsed by the parliament and both said to be the best thing for the nation ever, however both amendments are there to make army chief and party leader strong...)

4)With mushy, MMA was in opposition at federal level, MMA made their govt in alliance with Mushy Party in Khyber and Balochistan, MQM was part of the govt both in federal and provincial level
4.a)with Zardari, PML(N) is in opposition at federal level, PML(N) has aligned with PPP in Punjab Govt. , MQM is part of govt both at federal and provincial level

(MMA and PML(N) are known as the friendly opposition in the political history of Pakistan, both compete with each other to claim the first place)

5) During Mushy's Era we saw May 12, April 29 and December 27, where lots of innocents were shot dead, burned alive for no reason, no one was held responsible, Mushy announced that no inquiry is required for May 12 killings
5.a) Target Killing seems to be the norm in Zardari's Era, Ashora and Chelum incidents refreshed the memories of May 12 and Dec 27, just for our information no one was found guilty of these incidents as well
( Point to be noted, in both Mushy and Zardari Era, Rangers and Police seems to be doing nothing while people were getting killed)

6) Mushy created the crisis of wheat
6.a) Zardari created crisis of Sugar

7) Corruption was at its best during Mushy's era
7.a) New standards and records has been set by Zardari and Co.

There is lot more common in Mushy and Zardari... i believe had it been NS in power, there might have lots of common ground in Mushy and NS then....

The whole point is, how come the current democratic govt. is on right path if it's performance is same the previous ones, having this point in mind, one can say that the level of corruption was relatively low and governance was somewhat better ( in comparison). Overall both govt sucked big time..

30

Re: Ex Army COAS says Baloch operation was a mistake

Hanibal.... Please refer to the first line in post #25.

Given two rotten apples, i cannot call one 'rotten' because the other one is even more rotten?

31

Exactly,

rotten apples cannot be eaten, the purpose of my post is to show the similarities between the two... and obviously, we have seen the fall of one and we can predict the fall of other... with more disaster to be followed and suffering for us only... as we have seen Mushy living a lavish life and Zardari will do the same...

I am not advocate of Mushy ( i rather die) the only point is we are getting worse rulers with very passing govt... yesterday it was Mushy, today it is Zardari and Allah forbid, tomorrow it would be NS.. and then people might be saying that Zardari's ruling period was better...

Where and how to put full stop to it... we can change our attitude but it will not be over night and with the 60% population living under Jageerdari/Khan/Tribal system, it may take another century...

32

Re: Ex Army COAS says Baloch operation was a mistake

General Kakar, a Pashtun from Balochistan

Ok that says everything regarding his statement. This country needs to get rid of feudal lords and feudal systems.