let us forget
how we pray (pray to idols, church or mosque) . how we know our prayers are answered? can we say that guy prayed to idol
his prayers are rejected. this man prayed
to real god now his prayers are answered.
can we say this section of people suffering
because they are praying at wrong things?
Ltet’s stick to the topic and proove why Kaaba is not an idol, though it meets every criteria to be qualified as one!!
No body is a perfect muslim. u cant tell any body else to do something that u dont do.. or u cant stop any body from doing something that u also do..
Kabah is a Holly pure place.. we all go there “togather” to remember Allah.. and prais Allah.. we all are united as only muslims not as nationals of other fake borders of world. Indians , Pakistani , Middle eastern.. and from all around the world.. every one looks equal there..
(any more Qs)
Indians , Pakistani , Middle eastern.. and from all around the world.. every one looks equal there..<<
Awesome!! SO who controls Kaaba!!
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Anyway don’t divert from the topic, which is,
‘Is Pilgrimage To Kaaba idolatory?’
[quote]
Originally posted by Andhra:
**
Anyway don't divert from the topic, which is,
'Is Pilgrimage To Kaaba idolatory?'**
[/quote]
I thought the topic was --> Does a Bad Muslim have a right to talk about or defend Islam?
I think gupshup doesn't charge money for starting new threads for different topics.
Ahmedjee, Assalam Alaikum
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I stand corrected. THe topic is
‘Does A Bad Muslim have a right to talk about or DEfend Islam’.
Let’s GupShup!!
AL-HAJJ (22)
"The Pilgrimage"
And among men is he who disputes about God without any knowledge and follows every obstinate devil,(3)
concerning whom it is written down that whoso takes him for a friend, he shall lead him astray and guide him to the punishment of the Blaze.(4)
And (remember) when We showed Ibrâhim (Abraham) the site of the (Sacred) House (the Ka'bah at Makkah) (saying): "Associate not anything (in worship) with Me, [Lâ ilâha ill-Allâh (none has the right to be worshipped but Allâh) - Islâmic Monotheism], and sanctify My House for those who circumambulate it, and those who stand up (for prayer), and those who bow (submit themselves with humility and obedience to Allâh), and make prostration (in prayer);"
And proclaim to mankind the Hajj (pilgrimage). They will come to you on foot and on every lean camel, they will come from every deep and distant (wide) mountain highway (to perform Hajj).
(Al-Qur'an 22:26-27 )
This House was not meant merely for the purpose of worshipping; on the contrary from the very first day it was made the Headquarters of the universal Islamic mission. Its purpose was that believers in Allah, drawn from all parts of the world, should assemble here each year, perform Ibadat collectively and go back to their countries carrying with them the message of Islam.
Realization of Ibraheem's Prayer (peace be upon him)
In the course of history, descendants of Ibraheem and Isma'eel went astray from the path of Tawheed, and gradually adopted all those bad practices which were rampant among the other ignorant communities. Hundreds of idols were installed in that very Ka'ba which was built as a center of preaching and exhortation for the worship of one God. Ironically enough, idols were made of Ibraheem and Isma'eel themselves whose lives were spent in exterminating the practice of idol-worship.
Then the time came for granting the prayer of Ibraheem and Isma'eel (peace be on them) which they had invoked while raising the walls of the Ka'ba:
"And raise up in their midst a messenger. . ."
"And of our seed a nation submissive unto Thee."
A perfect man rose from the progeny of Ibraheem whose name was Muhammad . He revived the genuine and pure religion which was established by Ibraheem. He purified the Ka'ba of idols and established Tawheed in its purity. He (Prophet Muhammad ) exterminated all the shameful and brutal practices of Jahiliyya (ignorance) which Arabs were accustomed to -- idol worship, spattering the blood and flesh of sacrificed animals on the walls of the Ka'ba, lewd behavior, ribaldry, wrangling, circumambulation of the Ka'ba in the state of nudity and other evil customs. Thus the Ka'ba regained its real position as the focus of Tawheed and Hajj was re-established in its real meaning and content.
AL-HAJJ (22)
"The Pilgrimage"
And among men is he who disputes about God without any knowledge and follows every obstinate devil,(3)
concerning whom it is written down that whoso takes him for a friend, he shall lead him astray and guide him to the punishment of the Blaze.(4)
And (remember) when We showed Ibrâhim (Abraham) the site of the (Sacred) House (the Ka'bah at Makkah) (saying): "Associate not anything (in worship) with Me, [Lâ ilâha ill-Allâh (none has the right to be worshipped but Allâh) - Islâmic Monotheism], and sanctify My House for those who circumambulate it, and those who stand up (for prayer), and those who bow (submit themselves with humility and obedience to Allâh), and make prostration (in prayer);"
And proclaim to mankind the Hajj (pilgrimage). They will come to you on foot and on every lean camel, they will come from every deep and distant (wide) mountain highway (to perform Hajj).
(Al-Qur'an 22:26-27 )
This House was not meant merely for the purpose of worshipping; on the contrary from the very first day it was made the Headquarters of the universal Islamic mission. Its purpose was that believers in Allah, drawn from all parts of the world, should assemble here each year, perform Ibadat collectively and go back to their countries carrying with them the message of Islam.
Realization of Ibraheem's Prayer (peace be upon him)
In the course of history, descendants of Ibraheem and Isma'eel went astray from the path of Tawheed, and gradually adopted all those bad practices which were rampant among the other ignorant communities. Hundreds of idols were installed in that very Ka'ba which was built as a center of preaching and exhortation for the worship of one God. Ironically enough, idols were made of Ibraheem and Isma'eel themselves whose lives were spent in exterminating the practice of idol-worship.
Then the time came for granting the prayer of Ibraheem and Isma'eel (peace be on them) which they had invoked while raising the walls of the Ka'ba:
"And raise up in their midst a messenger. . ."
"And of our seed a nation submissive unto Thee."
A perfect man rose from the progeny of Ibraheem whose name was Muhammad . He revived the genuine and pure religion which was established by Ibraheem. He purified the Ka'ba of idols and established Tawheed in its purity. He (Prophet Muhammad ) exterminated all the shameful and brutal practices of Jahiliyya (ignorance) which Arabs were accustomed to -- idol worship, spattering the blood and flesh of sacrificed animals on the walls of the Ka'ba, lewd behavior, ribaldry, wrangling, circumambulation of the Ka'ba in the state of nudity and other evil customs. Thus the Ka'ba regained its real position as the focus of Tawheed and Hajj was re-established in its real meaning and content.
I think talking about Kaaba is an unnecessary diversion. THe topic as Ahmedjee pointed out is..
'Does A Bad Muslim have a right to talk about or DEfend Islam'.<<
Let's stick to the topic.
[quote]
Originally posted by ahmadjee:
** I thought the topic was --> Does a Bad Muslim have a right to talk about or defend Islam?
I think gupshup doesn't charge money for starting new threads for different topics.**
[/quote]
Forgive him its not his fault....
Andhra, provided is a complete explanation that Muslims worship only one God, but non muslims worship different objects and structures. I hope that passages form Quran are enough for your claims and multiface debate, with single origan… confused.
why you dont read Quran, ask for free copy, use it and return it, What a big deal. Quran is not a property of Muslims, but it is for humans.
a bad muslim has as much right to talk about or defend islam as anyone else. he might make a fool of himself by doing so but it's not against the law as far as i know.
a bad muslim has as much right to talk about or defend islam as anyone else. he might make a fool of himself by doing so but it’s not against the law as far as i know.<<
So, it is acceptable for a Serial Killer as well as a Social Worker to talk about and defend Islam ?
Just asking out of curiosity.
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In Other Words, the head of all Mullahs in Saudi Arabia and Nawaz Sharif and Idi Amin settled in Saudi have equal representatives of Islam!!
As a Muslim, we should be very carful to say any thing if we don't have proper knowledge,
(Wela alam bil ghab)
AL-TAUBA (9)
"Repentance"
And if thou questionest them, they will say, we were only discussing and making merry'. Say,is it God and His Signs and His Messenger that you mock?'(65)
Make no excuses; you have disbelieved after you believed; if We pardon a group of yours, We shall punish another group, for they were sinners.(66)
The hypocrites, men and women, are as one another; they bid the disgusting and forbid the desirable, and keep their hands shut; they have forgotten God, and He has forgotten them; surely the hypocrites are the transgressors.(67)
Any one can talk of anything, it would eventually come down to credibility of that person. If someone is a hyppocrite automatically people wont trust a person or give weight to the opinion of the guy who cries wolf
Personal character has great deal of emphasis in Islam and so goes for the character of the leadership. While making laws, those ulema who have proven their mettle by virtue of personal character, knowledge, integrity etc are consulted and engaged. This is because they have better credibility than others.
Despite the fashion now adays, one critical look at the present crop of politicians would show that the most sincere and clean folks are the ones from religious parties...
Well said Sultan Toora
Pilgrimage to Kaaba is not idolatory, we go there to pray ALLAH, every circle we make we read viruses from HOLY QURAN, saying we are thankful of god who gave us evrything in our heart is respect of ALLAH and also the place too. Because ALLAH chose it to be a holy place where we can remember him very well, see we remembering ALLAH over there not the building.
Pilgrimage to Kaaba is not idolatory, we go there to pray ALLAH, every circle we make we read viruses from HOLY QURAN, saying we are thankful of god who gave us evrything in our heart is respect of ALLAH and also the place too. Because ALLAH chose it to be a holy place where we can remember him very well, see we remembering ALLAH over there not the building. <<
Problem is, same kind of arguments can be made by HIndus to prove that what they do is not idolatory, substituting 'GOD' for 'ALLAH'.
Ofcourse as a communtiy we don't bother because frnakly we don't give a rat's fart what followers of other religions think.
In your case however it is different. You claim that other religions are wrong and misguided. Even fellow monotheistic religions.