Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

Society Religion & Philosophy
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**Where is the doctrine of Imaamat in Quran ?
**
Imammats: Shias consider 5 articles of belief as fundamentals of their religion. These are: Tawheed (Oneness of God) - Nabuwwat (Prophet hood) - Ma’ad (Day of Judgement) - Adl (Justice of God) and IMAAMAT (The above doctrine).
In another way to put it they some times refer to 5 pillars of Islam to be: Prayer, Zakat, Fasting, Hajj and Imaamat. They further hold that the latter (Imaamat) is the most important one.
The above shows the importance of Imaamat in Shia doctrine. And when I say Imaamat I don’t mean Leadership. Certainly leadership is an important issue not only for Muslims but also for any group of people. Imaamat here means the above specific doctrine.
ONLY give the verses with NO additions to the translation and NO Hadeeth to support a certain interpretation of the verse and NO personal commentaries.

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

I think your a tad confused or mistaken about shia beliefs. There are five principles of religion (beliefs); Tawhid, Adl Nabuwwat Imamat Qiyamat.

There are 10 fru e deen...(practises); salah, sawm, hajj zakaat, khums, jihad, amr bil maroof, nahi anil munkar, tawalla, tabarra.

as for imamat in the Quran, amonst many; the main one is ayah tathir (33:33).

ps. now can u show me where we are told to follow khilafa rashideen in the Quran?

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

I have mentioned all 5 beliefs read it carefull, its should be ok.

K337
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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

In order to know the verses which deals with Imamate you first need to understand the concept of Immate. Imamate means the authority to guide. The appointed guide by Allah [swt], thus it is not neccessary that the verse should have word "imam" in it rather the main thing is the concept of Allah [swt] appointing the leaders/guide (non prophets), and not appointed by people.

So here we go for those verse which shows that its only Allah [swt] who appoints Imam/Guide/khalifatullah.

Allah said to Prophet Ibrahim (as):

(Allah) said: " Surely I am going to make you an IMAM for men.. " (Ibrahim) said: "And of my offspring?" He said: "My covenant will not include the unjust " (Quran 2 : 124)

This verse leads us to the correct answers of many important questions concerning Imamate.

Allah said: "Surely I am going to make you an IMAM for men. " This shows that Imamate is a divinely-appointed status; it is beyond the jurisdiction of the ummah.
In every case Allah attributes the appointment of the caliph or the Imam exclusively to Himself.

Then as a general rule, it is stated:

" And We made them a’imata’n (IMAMs) , guiding (men) by Our Command, and We sent them inspiration to do good deeds, to establish regular prayers, and to practise regular charity; and they constantly served Us (and Us only)". Quran 21:73

And also:

"And We appointed, from among them a’imata’n (IMAMs), giving guidance under Our command, so long as they persevered with patience and continued to have faith in Our Signs". Quran 032.024

When Prophet Musa (as) wanted a vizier to help him with his responsibilities, he did not appoint someone by his own authority. He prayed to Allah: "And make for me a vizier from my family, Harun (Aaron) my brother" (Quran 30). And Allah said:

"You are indeed granted your petition, O Musa!" (Quran 20:36).

"And We wished to do a favour to those who were weak (and oppressed) in the land, and to make them a'imata'n (IMAMs) and to make them the inheritors," Quran 28:05.

The most important verse in terms of Imamate

"One day We shall call together all human beings with their (respective) IMAMS: those who are given their record in their right hand will read it (with pleasure), and they will not be dealt with unjustly in the least. Quran 17:071

The most important verse in terms of guide being appointed from Allah [swt] and the presence of guide in every nation:

And the disbelievers say: "Why is not a sign sent down to him from his Lord?" You are only a warner, and to every people there is a guide. Quran 13:7

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

^ same old misinterpretations… :rolleyes:

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

This question only shows the misunderstanding of some brothers about the belief of the mainstream Muslims. Believing in Khulafaaye Raashedin is not a fundamental element of Islam.
Any groups of people tend to elect some one as their leader. And the rational and most reasonable way to do so is by election. This is a routine social/political practice. Certainly no system of public election was established at that time and the election of Aboobakr was done through negotiation of present people. You might think that it was not a good choice or that not all qualified people were presented at the time, that's your opinion but it has nothing to do with looking for evidences in Quran about it. It's just a routine social practice that was and is and will be done in any society and no logical mind would expect a divine evidence for that.
Having said that, once the SAHÂBAH of the holy prophet agree on a great SAHÂBAH like Aboobakr (RA) to become the Khalifah, then it is the duty of all Muslims to obey him for the sake of Islam and unity.
If a Shia asks me what is my proof about this, I will give him/her a source that Shia holds as a very strong proof:
Nahjolbalaqah, letter No. 6 of Imaam Ali to Mo'aviah "People who did Bayat to Aboobakr and Omar, did bayat with me in the same way. So the one who is present cannot select any one else for Khalifah and the one who is absent cannot disobey people in their selection. Shurah belongs to Mohajer and Ansar, so if they gather around a person and appoint him as their Imaam this is to the satisfaction of Allah. If any one disapprove them on this or innovate something about it he should be taken back to the people who he has left (by accepting the appointed Khalifah), and if he refused to do so people has to fight with him as he is going to a path other than of Muslims."
**Now it's up to the Shia brothers and sisters whether they want to attribute Taqyah or lie or politics or what ever to their Imam and whether they like to justify his comment in the same way that they justify verses of Quran.
**So let us not compare apple with orange. Imaamat doctrine is a fundamental belief of Shia, election or selection of Khulafaaye Raashedin is just a routine and common socio-political practice.
On the other hand, let's look at the present situation is Iran. Is there any divine command about how to establish a leadership in the occultation of Mahdi? Let's remember that there were no religious system of governing after the occultation of Mahdi for about 1000 years after the recent revolution of Iran and emerging of the theory of Welayate Faqih. Those who know about Shia and Iran appreciate that Welayate Faqih of Khomeini was only a theory that he derived from some ahaadeeth. Not all Shia scholars agree with that (like Khoiee and his followers). Among the classic Shia scholars only few had referred to this theory and most like Sheikh Ansari had the opinion that it is difficult to derive such a theory from ahaadeeth (refer to Makaseb of Sheikh Ansari). Also among those recent scholars who accept the theory there are un-agreements about the extend of the theory and that how it could be put in practice (Like Montazeri, late Shirazi, etc.). So again as I referred to in the article, Shia too ended up with the same situation as the mainstream Muslims that is to elect a leader by themselves in the absence of any direct divine command.

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

yeah, and choosing the caliph/guide yourself while neglecting these verses of Quran is correct interpretation :hoonh:

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

The word Imam in Quran is used for many things , for book, for leader, for leaders of Kufr like Firoun, it does not by any account come to be a divinely appointed thing with some particular rights/duties. Quran also uses many similar qords like Wali, Murshid, Siddique etc.

And can you tell me why you call Khomaini "Imam" when certainly has was not.

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

Now that is the question of interpretation, if you people do not interpret the verses for the doctrine of imamate and most importantly as a proof that Allah [swt] has the only power to designate imam/guide then obviously you cannot blame or 'challenge' to bring proof if imamate from Quran.
As for Khomeini, that has obviously nothing to do with the doctrine of imamate (where Allah [swt] appoints guide/imam), he was referred to as an imam in a metaphoric sense (by the people) since he did efforts to bring them out of irreligious things and once again showed them the path which they were supposed to adhere. Its like mujaddid in Ahle Sunnah.

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

A few major flaws in your post which you have copied pasted (probably) from the famous pathetic article attributed to 'student'.

[quote]
This question only shows the misunderstanding of some brothers about the belief of the mainstream Muslims. Believing in Khulafaaye Raashedin is not a fundamental element of Islam.
[/quote]

This statement shows the ignorance of the writer, due to the fact that according to prominent books of Ahle Sunnah, the rejecters of the Imamate/caliphate of Abu Bakar and umer are clearcut Kaafir

  1. Barjundi Sharah Naqayah, Volume 4 page 21 published in Lucknow which quoted Fatwa e Zaheeriya
  2. Bahar al Raiq, Volume 5 page 131 published in Egypt
  3. Kiafaya Sharh Hidayah, Vol 1 (Bombay)
  4. Mustakhlis al Haqaiq Shrah Kanz al Dhaqaiq, page 32 (Ahmedi publishers

[quote]

If a Shia asks me what is my proof about this, I will give him/her a source that Shia holds as a very strong proof:
Nahjolbalaqah, letter No. 6 of Imaam Ali to Mo'aviah "People who did Bayat to Aboobakr and Omar, did bayat with me in the same way. So the one who is present cannot select any one else for Khalifah and the one who is absent cannot disobey people in their selection. Shurah belongs to Mohajer and Ansar, so if they gather around a person and appoint him as their Imaam this is to the satisfaction of Allah. If any one disapprove them on this or innovate something about it he should be taken back to the people who he has left (by accepting the appointed Khalifah), and if he refused to do so people has to fight with him as he is going to a path other than of Muslims."
Now it's up to the Shia brothers and sisters whether they want to attribute Taqyah or lie or politics or what ever to their Imam and whether they like to justify his comment in the same way that they justify verses of Quran

[/quote]

If a Shia ask you proof and you cite this, then you will be allowing others to make fun of you since the words of the sermon doesnt say what you are trying to suggest.

Ali [as] wrote this letter to Muawiyah who was trying to suggest that the caliphate of Ali [as] is wrong. He says if an election on the basis of general franchise is the criterion to decide such a caliphate, then general election took place to elect him the Caliph and nobody can deny this fact, and if limited franchise (Shura) was the criterion then those who represented this group (Muhajirs and Ansars) were amongst those who elected him and therefore even according to the rules formulated by opponents of Imam Ali (a) his election was lawful, regular and bonafide.

The words of Imam Ali [as] is clear that those who believe in the concept of electing caliph by shura (Sunni concept), the very people (also) chose him caliph in the same manner, so how can be his caliphate wrong but the caliphate of previous ones was rite. Imam Ali [as] has in fact unveiled the loopwhole of shura conecept.

So i dont know what the author is really trying to suggest here?

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

Boy Nice: Who is the current Imam?

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

I thought the Shia stance on that is quite popular, anyhow.
Imam Mahdi [as], the 12th and last successor of Holy Prophet [s] who is in occultation and will reappear on Allah’s will.

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ONLY give the verses with NO additions to the translation and NO Hadeeth to support a certain interpretation of the verse and NO personal commentaries

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Did you see any single hadeeeth??? As for notes from myself, just read the post excluding them , as simple is that :)

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

Leadership of the Israelites
** In Surah al-Ambiya’ it is stated:**
We said: O fire, be cool and (a means of ) safety unto Ibrahim. And they planned against him; but We made them the greater losers. And We delivered him and Lut to the land which We blessed for the nations. And We gave him Ishaq, and Ya‘qub as an additional gift; and all of them We made righteous men. And We made them leaders who guide by Our command; and We revealed to them the doing of good, the establishment of prayer and the giving of alms. And they were men who served Us. (al-Ambiya’ : 69-73)
In this extract, which had to be extended somewhat in order that the reader may see the full context in which the word a’immah is used, one clearly sees its association with the function of the Ambiya’ as the leaders of men, who guide them towards Allah. This unequivocal identification of a’immah as Ambiya’ leads us to conclude that the reference in Surah as-Sajdah too, is to the Ambiya’, and not to any other category of men:
Indeed, We gave Musa the Book, so be not in doubt about meeting him; and We made it a (source of) guidance for the Children of Isra’il. And We made from amongst them leaders who guided by Our command, when they persevered. And they had full certainty in Our signs. (as-Sajdah : 23-24)
Even if the scope of a’immah in this verse were to be extended to include people other than the Ambiya’, there is nothing to justify its identification with the elaborate doctrine of Imamah as conceived of by the shia.
In a third verse Allah speaks of His plans for the oppressed Israelites in Egypt:
And We wished to be gracious to those who were oppressed in the land, and to make them leaders, and to make them heirs. (al-Qasas : 5)
In order to see who the word a’immah refers to in this verse one only has to look at the persons in whom this divine wish came to fulfilment. It was primarily in Nabi Musa and the other prophet-kings of Bani Isra’il like Nabi Dawud and Nabi Sulayman ‘alayhimus salam that the leadership referred to in this verse, came to be vested. If at times they were ruled by men other than the Ambiya’, the status of those leaders was never seen to be superior to the rank of the Ambiya’. Verses like the above three, apart from dealing specifically with the Ambiya’ of Bani Isra’il, are not in the least indicative of the existence of a rank like that of Imamah as conceived of by the shia.

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

no personal notes and no interpretations :)

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On the Day of Judgement
There remains one place in the QURAN where the word Imam is used. It is in Surah al-Isra’ where Allah Ta‘ala says:
The day when we will call all people by their leaders. (al-Isra’ : 71)
The Imam spoken of in this ayah is recognised by the mufassirun of the Ahl as-Sunnah as either the book of deeds or the prophet to whose Ummah the person belonged. The first meaning is preferred by Ibn Kathir, who mentions in support of his preference the ayah where the word Imam was used in the sense of a book (see above). This meaning is further supported by the rest of the ayah:
So those who are given their book in their right hand will read their books.
The second meaning also finds ample support in the QURAN. In another ayah Allah says:
How will it be when We bring forth from every Ummah a witness, and bring you (O Muhammad) as a witness over these? (an-Nisa’:41)
From the way in which the position of the Nabi sallallahu ‘alayhi wasallam is compared to the position of the "witnesses" of the other Ummahs we can only conclude that the reference is to the Ambiya. It therefore follows that those Ummahs will be called by the names of their Ambiya. Calling the Ummahs of the past by the names of the Ambiya who were sent to them is further a common thing in both the QURAN and the Sunnah. The ‘Ad, for example, are commonly referred to as "the people of Hud", just like Banu Isra’il are called "the people of Musa". Identifying the Imam mentioned in the ayah under discussion with the Ambiya is therefore warranted by both the QURAN and the Sunnah.
As for the claim of the shia that it refers to the Twelve Imams, this claim not only lacks QURANIC support, it also curtails the general scope of the ayah. The lack of QURANIC support is evident from the above discussion on the usage of the word Imam in the QURAN. The restriction of the general scope of the ayah arises from the chronological disparity between the times when the Twelve Imams lived, and the periods during which previous Ummahs flourished. If we say that all Ummahs will be called by the names of the Twelve Imams, then what about the Ummahs that existed before them? By whose name will they be called? After all, the ayah says that all people will be called by their leaders.
In addition, when for argument's sake we do assume that the reference is to the the Twelve Imams, we are left with a somewhat incongruous situation. Sayyiduna ‘Ali, the first of the Twelve Imams, died in the year 40. His son Sayyiduna Hasan died nine years later, in 49. If Sayyiduna ‘Ali is the Imam for the people of his time, Sayyiduna Hasan is left with only those people who were born during his nine years. All the other people of his time who were alive during his father's time will form part of his father's group, and not his. The tenure of the 3rd Imam lasted for 22 years; the 4th for 34 years; the 5th for 19 years; the 6th for 34 years; the 7th for 35 years; the 8th for 20 years; the 9th for 17 years; the 10th for 34 years; and the 11th for only 6 years. Suddenly, with the 12th Imam, the Awaited Mahdi, we have a tenure of Imamah that has been running for over 1200 years. The group that will supposedly be called by the name of the 11th Imam, for example, will only include people that were born during his Imamah that ran from 254 up to 260, while the numbers of those who will be called by the name of the 12th Imam will be practically incalculable.
Compare this incongruous scenario with the much more orderly and QURANIC system of having the various Ummahs called by the names of their Ambiya on the Day of Qiyamah, and the absurdity of using the 71st ayah of Surah al-Isra’ to substantiate the doctrine of Imamah as conceived of by the shia will be fully exposed. There can be no question that the word Imam in this ayah does not refer to the Twelve Imams.

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

You forgot your own rules so let me remind ya:

ONLY give the verses with NO additions to the translation and NO Hadeeth to support a certain interpretation of the verse and NO personal commentaries

*:) *

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

I am asking you people to explain from the Quran the Doctrine of Imaam and explanation and question was to the Shias.
You have explained me so in return, I have given the reply now where are the replies.
Give me the reply buddy, you probably know where i am getting this stuff from.
By the those questions needs some thought management.

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Re: Doctrine of Imamat: Shias.

Are you confused or something? You didnt ask us to "explain" things from Quran rather you asked to cite onyl verses without any explaination!! Anyhow!

And "not probably" rather I am fully aware from which Nasibi filthy site you are getting this stuff. So you need replies rite?. Ok, here we go, and since you admitted that your are getting stuff from a particular place, therefore I wont be directing you in my reply rather i will be direclty answering the source from where u are getting the stuff i.e Ansar . org.