Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
this … :k:
http://dunya.com.pk/news/authors/detail_image/x8539_46600732.jpg.pagespeed.ic.Vej265FcKk.jpg
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
Its not the cause, its the means that people object too. The means that PTI/PAT choose to employ is not going to resolve the issue. Has mob justice ever actually produced actual justice?
And burning an entire village for the attainment of justice is itself an injustice. If collective punishment is acceptable then even Israel is in the right.
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
that is fine..either you are not reading my posts or you just choose to ignore...
where did i say PMLN would voluntary make changes? where did i say PMLN would give up on everything automatically
Imran had PMLN by throat, that was the biggest benefit of this dharna and what not...army was involved, COAS was talking to IK and nawaz....supreme court was involved...media was involved. That was the time to focus on developing a mechanism to get electoral reforms implemented....rigigng being investigated. and if in 90 days PMLN did not make any meaningful progress on electoral reforms Irmran had a golden chance to attack govt...much more credible narrative
what now..keep doing jalsas and asking for PM resignation? and electoral reforms?
anyway, we have made our point clear on this issue...happy monday
It took 14 months to get their attention, before that was the gov't sleeping? You can't entirely blame the marchers when the gov't failed to take any inaction on rigging allegations earlier.
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
LOL at my signature…
but Hanging policemen, judges, politicians and who not is perfectly democratic…
by your logic, if i am mugged, then i have right to loot everyone… and by same logic Sharif family can say that because Bhutto Nationalized their industries back in 70s, hence they all the corruption they have done is just and fine… by same logic, Talibans were right when they say that because Americans have droned them they have right to do bomb blasts in Pakistani cities killing Pakistanis!!!
Good to know!!!
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
It was in reference to the article hanibal posted.
If you forget about PTI, IK and TuQ for a moment and then read it again, does it make sense? Does it not reflect what Pakistan is going through?
I would agree that PTI and TuQ are hypocrites and opportunists. But please put all the blame on them for a common man being frustrated at what the "entitled" are doing with the country.
True, you can blame the 'fascists' for inciting people to do unlawful things but not a word for those who actually brought people to the stage where they are even willing to listen to the people like TuQ?
isn't that is what not being said in all evening celebrations, that every is corrupt and only i am your Savior?
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
^ they won't get that. PMLN is a big beneficiary of the current system. For improving the system PMLN has first to acknowledge the flaws, when they believe that the system preformed well last time why would they change it now?
Come on get real!
Isn't it the same system which gave opportunity to PTI to make govt in KPK??? or KPK govt is also product of rigging!!! Tayab Ardagan used the same system and turned its country into one of the great economies of the world and he started with the performance and performance and performance... as a mayor of Istanbul... when he was given opportunity, he instead of crying like a girl worked hard like a man and got the premiere ship of Turkey and got rid of most of the rotten eggs!!!
KPK govt could have done the same... but IK is not performer, he is agitator... even if you give him govt in ISB, he would be conducting Dharna or Jalsa against his own govt... best political ground for him where only words matter is Karachi... he can compete with Altaf Hussain and make stunts there...
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
....by your logic, if i am mugged, then i have right to loot everyone... and by same logic Sharif family can say that because Bhutto Nationalized their industries back in 70s, hence they all the corruption they have done is just and fine.... by same logic, Talibans were right when they say that because Americans have droned them they have right to do bomb blasts in Pakistani cities killing Pakistanis!!!
Good to know!!!
No, sorry, that's your logic: "Sharif has appointed his family at important posts, because he can".
I am not presenting any logic. I am just saying that if you consistently deny justice to people, they would eventually get fed up and seek out other ways to get it. If people are exhibiting extremist tendencies, what has motivated them to do so?
I am just questioning the fact that no one is willing to talk about WHAT has forced people to even listen to a hypocrites like IK and TuQ? The emphasis of entire discussion is on why and how and where these two idiots are wrong. But no one is willing to identify the elephant in the house.
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
Its not the cause, its the means that people object too. The means that PTI/PAT choose to employ is not going to resolve the issue. Has mob justice ever actually produced actual justice?
And burning an entire village for the attainment of justice is itself an injustice. If collective punishment is acceptable then even Israel is in the right.
If people are denied 'actual justice' consistently and systematically over a long period of time, eventually they'd get fed up. The other day I was stuck in a long queue of cars for 15 minutes. On investigation, I found a couple of maim-saab's enjoying ice cream in their LC parked in the middle of the busy street. I tried to intervene but was shown guns by their 'body guards' and was verbally abused by the maim-saabs.
I consider myself to be in a better condition than 90% of Pakistanis. I wonder what the not-so-fortunate ones go through EVERY SINGLE day of their lives. Then you guys wonder why it is so easy for people like TuQ or IK to emotionally charge crowds or for extremists organizations to motivate people to take up arms and give up lives.
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
isn't that is what not being said in all evening celebrations, that every is corrupt and only i am your Savior?
Yes.
If you forget about the savior part for the moment, do you disagree that what that 'propaganda pamphlet' said about Germany of that time applies to Pakistan of today?
People are going mad after a couple of hypocrites. I accept that IK and TuQ are corrupt opportunists. Now, assume for a moment that IK and TuQ never existed. Do you think people in Pakistan would be any less frustrated?
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
No, sorry, that's your logic: "Sharif has appointed his family at important posts, because he can".
I am not presenting any logic. I am just saying that if you consistently deny justice to people, they would eventually get fed up and seek out other ways to get it. If people are exhibiting extremist tendencies, what has motivated them to do so?
I am just questioning the fact that no one is willing to talk about WHAT has forced people to even listen to a hypocrites like IK and TuQ? The emphasis of entire discussion is on why and how and where these two idiots are wrong. But no one is willing to identify the elephant in the house.
before pointing fingers, please do read the complete statement of mine which you have quoted here, i wonder why you quoted half statement as the complete statement opposite of the what you have derived.. .
by far this is the same logic used by Taliban.... anyway, would you please let me know if the revolutionaries are able to implement speedy justice system in KPK???? because that is where they are in govt and its been an year...
i agree with you on this, for me this is good indicator, that people are still willing to listen or to follow a leadership which have tendency to solve there issue... and i believe IK is not the one who can deliver in this front... and i don't need to be a genius to figure it out, there performance in KPK is evident of that... moreover, this also tells that people have not learned from their past, they do want someone to get them out of the mess but at same time they lack the judgement skill...
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
Yes.
If you forget about the savior part for the moment, do you disagree that what that 'propaganda pamphlet' said about Germany of that time applies to Pakistan of today?
People are going mad after a couple of hypocrites. I accept that IK and TuQ are corrupt opportunists. Now, assume for a moment that IK and TuQ never existed. Do you think people in Pakistan would be any less frustrated?
yes they would be, and if you look at Germany in those days, things were not that different, nepotism, corruption, economic crisis all were there... Germans lost WWI and they were frustrated and were looking forward to a Messiah....
If you look IK's way they are not that different, IK seems to be firm believer of the theory that repeat the lie so many times that it look like a truth, same thing which is invented by Hitlers team... however i don't think IK have balls like Hitler to be aggressive on neighbor countries but i do believe that IK can completely destroy whatever we have because of the his foolishness
we do need a better leadership, but it is not IK or TuQ for sure
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
It took 14 months to get their attention, before that was the gov't sleeping? You can't entirely blame the marchers when the gov't failed to take any inaction on rigging allegations earlier.
Isn't IK said in March 2014 that NS govt is doing fine job and we'll support them in every way possible..something like that, was said when NS visited IK...but things changed after 19th April... wonder what happened..
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
Guess what, the ECP report just came out confirming rigging. That must be flawed as well. :halo:
Re: Dangerous contradictions..Khan sahib!
...and if you look at Germany in those days, things were not that different, nepotism, corruption, economic crisis all were there... Germans lost WWI and they were frustrated and were looking forward to a Messiah.....
So would you not advise the government 'hath haula rakho'?
Things in Pakistan are improving for business community for sure. I hear they are even getting filipina maids for their children and vacationing abroad is a norm now.
The divide between powerful and the powerless, however, is getting larger and larger as well and frustrations are growing as people get exposed to the world beyond our borders. I am just suggesting that there would be a limit before people would really get fed up and do what @Sa1eem suggests they should.
The people who are in power now cried 'corruption' during 5 years of Zardari rule. Has any significant politician been indicted of corruption from that time? Why Raja Rental, for example, roams free while millions of people suffer because he wanted to get a bit more rich?
The government should wake up before that. If things keep going the way they are going, I am afraid people with much more extremist ideas than IK or TuQ would be able to claim to be messiahs.