credit cards use - haram

[Dushwari]

Re: credit cards use - haram

thanks folks, good discussion.
giving interest is not the right thing, but at times there are no other options, such as car payment or house purchase.

little everyday purchases can be made within one's means to avoid putting a lot unnecessary on credit cards.

[UZ]

@Dushwari

thanks folks, good discussion.
giving interest is not the right thing, but at times there are no other options, such as car payment or house purchase.

little everyday purchases can be made within one’s means to avoid putting a lot unnecessary on credit cards.

So PEOPLE here are saying that one sood kaa ghar halaal hai and one sood ki gari halaal and jaiz hai ,:aq:

WOW at the people.

[UZ]

Kaya lariba jaisay yaa umm jaisay bank loan nahi detay yaa logo ko us mein nuqsaan hota hai

[wishkamar]

@Evilmastermind

^ oh boy ..

what about takin student loans for grad skool?

Or mortgage? How many people are capable of buying their homes by paying full in cash?

[X2]

@ume-zafeerah

Kaya lariba jaisay yaa umm jaisay bank loan nahi detay yaa logo ko us mein nuqsaan hota hai

describe what the difference is between these lariba loans and traditional fixed interest loans.
ask one of these shariah compliant loans how they arrive at valuations

[X2]

@ume-zafeerah

Kaya lariba jaisay yaa umm jaisay bank loan nahi detay yaa logo ko us mein nuqsaan hota hai

read below

@psyah

The Banks have cunningly adopted pre-Islamic Arab forms of money lending using those names and have coined the methods ‘Islamic’, just to avoid the issue of rib’a. However, many Muslims quickly realise that the sums speak for themselves. The Islamic Banks are really only there for rich people who can afford those high payments and deposits.

[simplyme]

thanks folks, good discussion. giving interest is not the right thing, but at times there are no other options, such as car payment or house purchase.

little everyday purchases can be made within one's means to avoid putting a lot unnecessary on credit cards.

Ya I agree. Giving interest is not the right thing, but taking interest is OK I suppose.

[UZ]

@X2

describe what the difference is between these lariba loans and traditional fixed interest loans.
ask one of these shariah compliant loans how they arrive at valuations

@X2

read below

The Banks have cunningly adopted pre-Islamic Arab forms of money lending using those names and have coined the methods ‘Islamic’, just to avoid the issue of rib’a. However, many Muslims quickly realise that the sums speak for themselves. The Islamic Banks are really only there for rich people who can afford those high payments and deposits.

yehi to mein keh rahi hoon janaab ke aajkal ghar lena to farz-e-aiin hai and chonkey Islamic banking mein hamara nuqsaan ahi to ham facts ko tor ker paish kertay hain and kehtay hian ke SOOD jaiz hai . Sahooliyaat ke aaddi hain naa.Jahaan tak Lariba and Deewan bank kaa taaluq hai their way is simple.Mein ne unhian bohat chana hai I know more about Lariba so mein us ki misaal doon gi
For one thing ke documentation mein 6% soud kaa naam ata hai I called them and asked them woh kehnay lagey ke U.S ke law ke mutabiq aap soud ke baghair entry nahi ker saktay is liye ham ne yeh likha ahi lekin yeh sirf documentation ki had tak hai and lot of muslims like you and PSyah(very dissappointed ) think ke yeh ghalat hai but ham ghalat naih kertay
Number 2 un ki rent to own policy hai us mein aap kaa share ahista ahista barhta hai to hamesha doosri side ko faida hota hai joon joon aap rent detay hain ahista ahista aap kaa share barhta hai we were gonna buy a house to unhon ne yehi kaha ke aap apnay area ka rent batayein and three quotes le ker dein

Number 3 someone asked me this before and I disscussed it with them ke suppose eik ghar 400,000 kaa hia and 30 years ke baad US banking ke hisaab se hamein 800,000 ka parta hai to Lariba bhi to yehi kerta hai to faraq kaya sab ko yehi takleef hai bhaii koii haq halaal se kamaye gaa to us mein apna munaffa to rakhay gaa naa yaa nahi ,yaa sab Fi SACILLILLAH de day aap ko jahaan tak is baat kaa taaluq hai ke woh apna munaffa kam kyoon nahi kertay to us kaa jawaab yeh hai ke bohat sarey hamray jaisay muslims un se loan nahi lein gay to yehi ho gaa na ke customer kam ho gaa and cheez mehngi ho gi.kher back to the topic mein ne LARIBA se yeh bhi poocha ke agar ajkal ki market mein ghar ki keemat kam ho rahi hai and mein ghar khareed ker year baad bechna chahoon to nuqsaan kaun bardaasht karey gaa to unhon ne yeh answer diya thaa ke agar 400,000 ka ghar 3,5000 mein bikay gaa to nuqsaan hamara ho gaa aap ka nahi you don’t need to walk away bank will take responsibility and baqi bank kaya kertay hian yaa to aap ko ghar chor ker bhaagna parta hai yaa aap mehngi kist detay rahein but agar aap nuqsaan mein ghar bechtay hain to bank aap ke peechay parh jata hai.

[UZ]

akhri baat yeh hai ke aap kaa comfort zone kaya hai apnay deen ke baarey mein for example bohat saarey behas kernay waley to yeh bhi kahein gay ke Quran mein sharaab mamnooh nahi ahi Sharaab jaiz hai magar hadees mein to clear hai naa isi tarah halaal haraam ka masla hai isi tarah sood kaa.X2 bhaii yeh aap ki apni choice hai
Mera comfort zone yeh hai
1) agar aap ke paas paisa ho to cash per lein ghar kyoon ke Qarz lena koii achi baat nahi
2) agar itna paisa nahi hai to aap islamic banking se lein us ke reason yeh hai ke mein agar bilfarz yeh maan bhi loon ke woh ghalat hain but agar woh ALLAH ke naam per dhoka ker rahey hain to woh ALLAH ke agey jawab deh hain mein nahi kyoon ke unhaon ne mujh se kaha hai ke ham ko riba free mortgage dein gay . yeh wohi baat hai ke agar aap kisi halaal gosht ki dukaan per jaayein and banda kahey ke mein ne ALLAH ko jaan deni hai and yeh gosht halaal hai then definately I will buy that meat.mein itni picky nahi banoon gi ke us ke farm per jaa ker dekhoon.isi tarah bohat saarey log baqi cheezon mein to detail mein nahi jaatey but jab yeh masla aata to khud hi alim bantay hain and kehtay hain ke yeh sahi nahi and mehnga bara hai but actually saari baat paisay ki hai aap ko nazar aata hai ke is mein nuqsaan bohat hai is liye bhaag jaatey hain wahaan sey.

3) agar mujhe loan naa miley to yehi behter hai ke mein rent ke apartment mein reh loon.

Mein eik real life misaal deti hoon aap ko meri eik friend alma hafizza hai but us ke hubs ney us se yeh kaha ke agar ham ghar rent per lein gay to nuqsaan bohat hai and tax ke paisay aatey hain to hamein bachat hai and its our asset.woh bechari chup ker gaii and after 3 years ghar ki value 100,000 gir gaii phir us ne apnay hub se kaha ke aap ne soud ke chakkar mein jo paisa bachana chaha thaa woh to sab niikal gaya and nikal raha hai houses ki prices musalsal down jaa rahi hain.Anyway yeh koii fit example nahi hai kyoon ke property ke bussiness mein hamesha faida hota hai yeh choti choti cheezein ham se hamra imaan test karwaati hain jis mein ham pooray nahi utartay and dunwavi cheezon ke peechay lag jaatey hain:( And jahaan tak gariyon kaa taaluq hai woh aap second hand bhi le saktey hain and 0% APR per bhi but sab yeh kahein gay woh apna munaffa to nikaal letay its one and the same thing so ham 2 paisay bacha ker kyoon naa sood per ley lein but baat yeh hai ke ham jo deal banatay hain baad mein sood dey ker hbi to utnay hi ke parh jaati hai mein maanti hoon is baat ko.but her cheez ke 2 ways hotay hain agar ham thora saa apna daman kaanton se bacha lein to hamein hi faida hai naa.

X2 and Psyah yeh sirf apna comfort zone hai agar aap log yeh samjhtay ho ke RIBA kaa eik ghar hona chahiye to theek hai jaisay aap logo ki marzi but mera point of view mukhtalif hai and rahey gaa jo cheez ghalat hai woh ghalat hai and mein jaanti hoon aap ne meri is post ke baad yehi likhna hai ke aisay nahi waisay LARIBA is not right but again mein kaheen to bachaoon naa apnay daman ko warna her taraf hi mushkil hai.

[UZ]

And one more thing I am not here to fight or convince 25-40 years old people what is wrong and what is right.Its just my point of view and we are here just for the sake of disscussion :)

[Dr.LuLworth]

@Dushwari

we know that owing something to someone is not the best thing to do, when we need monetary funds.
credit cards use is a quick sand and we are all in it almost always.
from an islamic economic and personal spending ethics point of view, this is what i found.

any thoughts?

Question:
I heard that using credit cards is haraam, but if I am sure that I am going
to pay the bank within the time limit, so the bank will not charge any
interest, is this also regarded as haraam?.
Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.
What you have heard about credit cards being haraam is correct. That has
already been discussed in question no.
(13735http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ds=qa&lv=browse&QR=13735&dgn=3&
)
Using them is haraam even if the user is certain that he will pay the bank
within the time limit.
It has already been explained in the answer to the question mentioned that
they are haraam because the bank lends money to the user in return for
interest, and this interest is the price of the annual subscription to the
credit card, as well as other interest charges which are to be paid to the
bank if the user is late in paying.
The cost of the card is a kind of riba which the user pays to the bank, and
this riba is paid by the user whether he pays on time or not.
Also, the user enters into a contract with the bank which means that he is
obliged to pay interest if he delays payment. This is also haraam, because
it is not permissible for a Muslim to commit himself to doing something that
Allaah has forbidden.
The user may think that he can pay up on time, but then something happens to
him that prevents him from doing so, so he pays riba to the bank.
Shaykh Ibn 'Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him) said concerning this
kind of contract:
A contract of this type is not permissible, because it involves riba which
is the price of the card, and it also means committing to pay interest if
payment is delayed.
In another fatwa he said:
This transaction is haraam, because the one who enters into it commits
himself to paying riba if he does not pay on time. This is an invalid
commitment, even if he believes or thinks it most likely that he will pay it
before the time is up, because circumstances may change and he may not be
able to pay it off. This is a matter that is in the future, and no one knows
what will happen to him in the future. So dealings of this type are haraam.
And Allaah knows best.
Islam Q&A

I don’t think some bearded man in saudia arabia knows my personal financial situation and the reasonings behind why I use a card and carry intentional debt. I think this answer is irrelevant and not even islamic. How can he assume what is good for 1.5 billion individuals.

meh

[X2]

Re: credit cards use - haram

UZ

thanks for the bhashan I did not really read itr because you simply did not get my point.

so let me state is ver simply and clearly

explain to me what the difference is between 'islamic financing' to buy a house and a conventional fixed rate mortgage.

give me one example of A and B buying a $500K house today, one using conventional 30 yr mortgage and other one going to an "islamic financing"

how much do they end up paying in total, how is that calculated.

if the value of the home goes up and they sell and move, what happens to the profit

if the value of the house goes down and they sell, what happens to the loss

shabash, lecture asaan hota hai.. kaam mushkil, ab aap ja kar kaam karein.

the difference between you and me is, I dont think interest as it exists in modern economy is haram. you think its haram, but will gladly take it under a diff name even if all the mechanics under it are the same.

its like my eating lobster cuz i think its halal, you may say lobster is haram but if somene gives it to you and says lobster no no..its giant prawn, then you will eat it :)

[X2]

Re: credit cards use - haram

UZ, should one knowingly support or contribute in something that is not 'halal' if you 'enable' it?

would renting a place which is being purchsed using interest allowed?

[PyariCgudia]

Re: credit cards use - haram

Right. All the richest of muslims cough cough oil mongers, are using them left and right. This is the first time I'm hearing of any theory of credit card use as haraam. Like anything else, it depends on how you use it. If you're going to abuse it - charging extravagant amounts and then not paying back on time and accumulating debt...that falls under "irresponsibility" which muslims should not be engaging in. But tell that to the millions of muslims who give birth to kids they can't take care of, or who engage in abuse, fraud, lying, cheating, stealing.

How has Victoria's Secret not ended up on the Haraam list yet?