Corrupt Politicians of Pakistan

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
41

*RajputFury

I tried very hard but ur stuck with majorioty issue.. *

Oh my dear G-D! What is the point of even talking about democracy, if there is no majority or minority?

*
the simple fact is Pakistan's army (99 % from East Pakistan), almost entire bureaucracy and the whole population of East Pakistan (present Pakistan) were against giving power to Mujeeb since it was automatic breakup of Pakistan with Mujeeb's 6 points implemented! Mujeeb wasnt interested in session but pre-conditioned that 6 points be implemented.... *

So if I believe what you say (and I don't) why would the military which was in control or the bureaucracy or heck even the people be willing to hold elections? It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!

Common sense and political logic dictates that if you see a break up of your country imminent, which you claim would have happened if the 6 points were implemented by the majority, there would be no elections under the pretences (justified) of national integrity.

Do you know that the NAP/JI who had won in Baluchistan/NWFP were very sympathetic to the 6 point federation concept? So that left only Sindh and Punjab opposed. If Bhutto only cared for Pakistan, why did he proposed to make himself the premier of the West wing and Mujib of the East wing? His hunger for power is pretty apparent.

ZAB was a intelligent but deceptive man who took the apprehensions of Sindh + Punjab (and I say that because his mandate was only in 2 provinces) and converted that as his power base from which he could claim he had the "majority" in West Pak when it was clear that the PPP came in far far second to the Awami League. In fact the Awamis almost doubled the margin of victory. What mandate did Bhutto have? Playing the Feudalist-Nationalist Sindhi cause in Sindh and whipping up faux-Pakistaniyat and an Anti-Indian agenda in Punjab. Winning 2 of 5 provinces gave him no mandate and the actual seats that his party won has been repeatedly mentioned.

*
Vast majority of present day Pakistan and me agree with what Bhutto did in that circumstances.. how could Bhutto was so popular if we assume ur allegations in west Pakistan till 1977..If u still insist that Bhutto break up the country and the 2 wings were eager to live together then thats ur fantacy.. can u give me examples after breakup of Pakistan how many people of present day Pakistani rose against Bhutto whom u assume break up east wing! Whatever u say peopel of Pakistan were behind Bhutto and believed in his leadership.. *

Duping the great people of Pakistan doesn't mean anything but a credit to his deviousness. If he is so great and everything he did was great why are you COMPLETELY ignoring the '65 role, Baluchistan, FSF?? You are ABSOLUTELY silent on it. Where are you sources? Where are the claims or even denials? Just for the record, he was the LOSER of the elections of 1970, by the virtue of breakup of Pakistan he suddenly became the winner by default. Never said that East and West did not have problems nor am I denying the role of the military but it was Bhutto who broke the camels back by not allowing the majority to convene the aaembly! You can adopt a "hear no evil, see no evil" approach but just so you know, your arguements have fallen flat on every instance. Why selectively read my messages? His brutalities, mischief has been covered from so many angles that there is no refutation of his hunger for power.

*
Bhutto infact took shattered Pakistan in 1971 and gave the first comprehensive Constition in 1973, forged great foreign policy, made Pakistan first nuclear State among muslim countries under difficult conditions.. *

How many times are you going to harp the same tune? I did not argue those points in fact I openly admitted them. Even if you go back to the first message, I am fully aware of his accomplishments. Now regarding your end, the only thing that you have been able to contest has been the 1970 elections. Why so silent on the rest of the issues that I have brought up over and over again, which have been supported by well known and credible sources?

I said from the beginning that I hold no personal hatred for the man, but if you think even for a second that I will let this drop, you are sadly mistaken because I didn't "suddenly" decide to bring him up. As an avid reader of South Asian and Pakistani history his name and role came up repeatedly, it wasn't long till a sense of ZAB emerged. Just for the record I have not mentioned any Bengali or Baluchi sources because they literally toasted ZAB and were quite derogatory towards him. Everything breaks down to what you said versus my statements, however credibility lies with the one who presents evidence.

42

Just to point out something, although he won 2/3rd of the seats in West Pakistan. ZAB polled something like 38% of the vote, which is not exactlya huge majority. To add to Rajput Fury on another point, PPP did quite well as far as votes polled in Sarhad (in 1970). that they did not translate into seats was another matter.

A lot had to do with the anti feudal plank that they campaigned on. The bulk of the '70 MNA's from PPP were generall middle to low income people. The fact that ZAB promoted the Feudal element over the others was another matter. The peasant and Labour revolts of the 70's were quite famous and triggered the collapse of teh feudal ssytem in many parts of Sarhad and Punjab. Unfortunately ZAB turned on those groups as quickly as he promoted them. So it's wrobng to simplify the PPP's 70 election campaign in Sindh and Punjab.

The mainr eason why ZAB evokes such strong emotions has a lot to do with his death and a lot to do with the fact that he was the first person who brought awareness to the poor of what they deserve and what they should expect. That emotion has kept the PPP going despite the hard work of ZAB and other PPP leaders to undo it.

43

**
Just to point out something, although he won 2/3rd of the seats in West Pakistan. ZAB polled something like 38% of the vote, which is not exactlya huge majority. To add to Rajput Fury on another point, PPP did quite well as far as votes polled in Sarhad (in 1970). that they did not translate into seats was another matter. **

Well stated Zakk. Hope you are warm and comfy in your part of the world. We here in New England are in middle of a blizzard. Anyway you look at ZAB's "victory" it doesn't add up. In essence PPP was relegated to the eastern provinces of W. Pakistan.

**
A lot had to do with the anti feudal plank that they campaigned on. The bulk of the '70 MNA's from PPP were generall middle to low income people. The fact that ZAB promoted the Feudal element over the others was another matter. The peasant and Labour revolts of the 70's were quite famous and triggered the collapse of teh feudal ssytem in many parts of Sarhad and Punjab. Unfortunately ZAB turned on those groups as quickly as he promoted them. So it's wrobng to simplify the PPP's 70 election campaign in Sindh and Punjab. **

Regtardless of his "land reforms" which simply did not go far enough. to clarify, Sarhad and N. Punjab have tended to be less fuedalistic to begin with. ZAb left his mark in South Punjab -- the Seraiki belt. ZAB did not "allow" land reforms in Sindh as he ran a Sindhi Nationalist-Feudalist platform. Besides we all know about the "Prince of Larkana" and his holdings.

**
The mainr eason why ZAB evokes such strong emotions has a lot to do with his death and a lot to do with the fact that he was the first person who brought awareness to the poor of what they deserve and what they should expect. That emotion has kept the PPP going despite the hard work of ZAB and other PPP leaders to undo it. **

Your comments are right on the money. His murder and neo-socialist policies still evoke many emotions.

44

RF Salam..it's pretty cold here in the UK as well, thankfully no blizzards though. I'd like to correct you on one thing though. In Sindh the PPP did not campaign on a wholly feudalistic platform. It was again a leftist platform he was the bulk of the feudal groups tended to unite behind people like Daultana and Khuro (Bhutto "fixed" them once he cam to power). His feudal shift occurred around 75. And in areas like Karachi they swept it in 1979 contrary to popular belief, they also swept areas like the most conservative areas of NWFP.

45

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zakk: *
Nuts this is the third time I am typing this message!!

Anyway I'll try to be short this time:

1) Yahya Khan was the first and only leader who did not leave office with crores distributed for his family. He was never given a chance of defence and his son was hounded out of his job. He also kept his word and held what is considered the closest thing to a fair election in Pakistans history. He was unfortunately the absolute wrong person to be allowed into power. He probably would never have become a General if the Army hadnt gotten into politics.
2) The way the Army command structure works is simple the buck stops at the top. In the end nobody told Yahya or Ayub to listen to ZAB, he wasnt even considered a threat till the eletions showed his popularity.
Political mistakes like the 65 war and others are different from corruption. In pure corruption forms, Zia ul Haq probably did more to damage the fabreic of Pakistani society, lets not forget his personal role against the Palestinains in 1970 and against the SIndhis in the early 80's. that culture of munafiqat is the most terrible gift that Zia gave us..whatever Bhutto was ..we all knew what he was. Zia till his last day never compromised on anything good for Pakistan.
3) Nawaz Sharif took the cake though, at least in Bhutto's case we could say the man was a evil genius but a genius nevertheless. In NS's case we didnt even have that!!!!

thats about all I can type now..sooo I am sending this before I lose it again!!!
[/QUOTE]

Yahya was a disgusting mann....he was often so drunk that he came out of his residence naked.....he once travalled frm Pindi to Islamabad comletely nude!!.....he screwd like more than a hundred women while he was president....u need to be committed to ur job...bein the president of a country requires much more......!!!

talkin bout corrupt politicians...we've still got plenty in the govt....ch. pervez elahi n shujaat r probably the most corrupt ppl in the history of pakistan.....theyve looted the ppl like hell....n they still continue to rule!
yahya was also responsible fr the 1971 humiliaton tht pakistan faced!

46

Wa’Salaams Zakk!
Glad to know that your not facing the wrath of snow and related calamities, we may recieve some more snowfall by this weekend :frowning:
Sometimes I wish that I was on the saahil of makran :hehe:

I stand corrected..My problem is that when I read many different books the information become overlapped. One thing is sure though, Bhutto played the Sindhi nationalist card..one example, making Sindhi an official language when the rest of the nation follows urdu. Not to mention the sheer callousness of making Sindhi anj official language in the province that most of the urdu speakers reside in.

The man had charisma no doubt about it!

47

RF: I think the Sindhi language bill was harsh but expected, as a reaction to years of discrimination against Sindhi. A provincial language should be a reflection of the majority while taking into account the minority.

48

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by RajputFury: *
One thing is sure though, Bhutto played the Sindhi nationalist card

[/QUOTE]

I dont agree with this statement.. In fact Bhutto was far more popular in Punjab than Sindh.. a sindhi being popular in Punjab is rare and speaks to the chrisma of a leader.. I know when we dont like someone the person's achievements look small and faults look huge .. here are some of the milestones in Bhuttos distinct career that I have copied from some place.. its always fascinates me how a big Sindhi wadera , educated in west at top institutions - emerged as leader of Third World and masses..

*Zulfikar Ali Bhutto *
Date of Birth January 5, 1928

EDUCATION

Cathedral School, Bombay - 1937 - 1947
Joined University of Southern California - 1947
Transferred to Berkely Campus of USC - 1949
First Asian to be elected to Berkely Student Council
Graduated with Honours in Political Science - 1950
Admitted to Christ Church College, Oxford - 1950
Graduated with Honours from Oxford University - 1952
Called to the Bar at Lincoln's Inn - 1953
Lecturer of Sindh Muslim Law College - 1954 (He was offered a chair at Oxford College but joined Sindh Law College)
Member of Pakistan Delegation to the United Nations - 1957
Addressed the United Nations Sixth Committee on Aggression - October 25, 1957
Leader of Pakistan Delegation to United Nations Conference on the Law of the Seas, addressed the Conference on the Freedom of the Seas.- March - 1958

MINISTERIAL CAREER
Minister of Commerce - 1958
Minister for Information and National Reconstruction - 1959
Minister for Fuel, Power and Natural Resources - 1960
Leader of Pakistan Delegation to the UN - 1959, 1960, 1963 & 1965
Statement in support of Algeria against French Imperialism at UN - 1959
Leader of Pakistan Delegation to Moscow to negotiate agreement on Oil and Gas Exploration with Soviet Union with 120 Million Roubles credit - 1960
Led Pakistan's Delegation to UN and differed with US by not voting against China's Membership - 1960
Foreign Minister of Pakistan - 1963 - 1965
Sino-Pakistan Boundary Agreement, gaining 750 Square Miles for Pakistan 2nd March - 1963
Famous Speech at the U.N. Security Council "We will wage a war for a thousand years" - 22-23 September 1965
Resigned from the Federal Cabinet - June, 1966

*PAKISTAN PEOPLES PARTY (PPP) *

Historic welcome in Lahore after resignation as Foreign Minister - 21st June, 1966
Manifesto of Pakistan Peoples Party prepared
"Islam is our Faith, Democracy is our Policy, Socialism is our Economy, All Power to the People". October, 1966
Foundation of Pakistan Peoples Party, Lahore - 30th November, 1967
Led Mass Movement for Restoration of Democracy - 1968
Arrested for creating disaffection against Government-November 12, 1968
Landslide victory for PPP in 1970 elections in present day Pakistan - December 7, 1970

PRESIDENT/PRIME MINISTER

Economic Reforms Order Nationalisation of Key Industries - January 3, 1972
Announcement of Labour Policies - February 10, 1972
Workers would participate in Profits
Old Age Pensions and Group Insurance
Land Reforms - 1st March, 1973
Ceiling reduced from 500 Acres to 150 Acres of irrigated land and 1000 Acres to 300 Acres for semi-irrigated land. All lands in excess of 100 Acres allocated to Govt. Servants confiscated and redistributed.
The Law Reform Ordinance - giving effect to the recommendations of the Law Reforms Commission. - 14th April, 1972
Martial Law Lifted 21st April, 1972
Simla Agreement Signed 2nd July, 1972
National Book Foundation established - 24th September, 1972
Inaugurated Pakistan's first Nuclear Power Plant at Karachi. - 28th November, 1972
Establishment of NDFC - 5th February, 1973
Establishment of Quaid-E-Azam University - 9th February, 1973
Constitution of Pakistan passed unanimously - 12th April, 1973
Establishment of Port Qasim Authority - 27th June, 1973
Elected Prime Minister of Pakistan - 14th August, 1973
Identity Cards for Citizens - 28th July, 1973
Agreement for repatriation of 93,000 POWs - 28th August, 1973
Administrative Reforms Order - September, 1973
Laid Foundation Stone of Pakistan Steel Mill - 30th December, 1973
Nationalisation of Banks - 1st January, 1974
Establishment of Allama Iqbal Open University - 21st May, 1974
Islamic Summit at Lahore - 22nd February, 1975
Inaugurated Pakistan's First Seerat Conference - 3rd March, 1976
Kissinger warned Zulfikar Ali Bhutto that if Pakistan continued with its nuclear programme "the Prime Minister would have to pay a heavy price." - August, 1976
Bhutto proposed a Third World Summit - September, 1976

Zulfikar Ali Bhutto as 'Author'

List of Publication

Peace-Keeping by the United Nations. Pakistan Publishing House, Karachi. - 1967
Political Situation in Pakistan, Veshasher Prakashan, New Dehli. - 1968
The Myth of Independence, Oxford University Press, Karachi and Lahore. - 1969
The Great Tragedy, Pakistan People's Party, Karachi. - 1971
Politics of the People (speeches, statements and articles), edited by Hamid Jalal and Khalid Hasan: Pakistan Publications, Rawalpindi. - 1948-1971
Speeches and Statements, Government of Pakistan, Karachi. - 1971-75
Bilateralism: New Directions. Government of Pakistan, Islamabad - 1976
The Third World: New Directions. Quartet Books, London. - 1977
My Pakistan. Biswin Sadi Publications, New Dehli. - 1979
If I am Assassinated, Vikas, New Dehli. - 1979
My Execution. Musawaat Weekly International, London - 1980
New Directions. Narmara Publishers, London. - 1980

THE LEGACY OF ZULFIKAR ALI BHUTTO

As a member of Pakistan's delegation to the United Nation in 1957, at the age of 29 years, Zulfikar Ali Bhutto addressed the Sixth Conference of the United Nations on "The Definition of Aggression", a speech which is still regarded as one of the best on the subject. As a participant at the International Conference in Geneva, Switzerland in March, 1958 Zulfikar Ali Bhutto spoke for mankind with the bold declaration: "The High Seas are free to all." He was the youngest Federal Cabinet member in the history of Pakistan, at the age of 30. Zulfikar Ali Bhutto held the key portfolios of Minister of Commerce, Minister of Information, Minister of National Reconstruction, Minister of Fuel, Power and Natural Resources before becoming the Foreign Minister. As Minister of Fuel, Power and Natural Resources, he signed a path breaking agreement for exploration of oil and gas with Russia in 1960. He set up a Gas and Mineral Development Corporation in 1961 and Pakistan's first refinery in 1962 at Karachi.

Bhutto emerged on the world stage as Leader of the Pakistan Delegation to the UN in 1959. To muster the support for Kashmir issue he successfully toured China, Britain, Egypt and Ireland. He also held a series of talks with the Indian Foreign Minister Swaran Singh. He was appointed Foreign Minister in 1963 and remained at that post until his resignation in June 1966. Bhutto made indelible imprints on world community by his inimitable oratorical skills in United Nation's General Assembly and the Security Council. He had the vision to build a strategic relationship with China at a time when it was isolated. Zulfikar Ali Bhutto believed in an independent Foreign Policy which had hitherto been the hand maiden of the Western Powers. During his tenure as Foreign Minister, Pakistan and Iran cemented a special relationship. His opposition to the Tashkent accord between India and Pakistan led to his resignation from the government. Zulfikar Ali Bhutto believed in a Foreign Policy of bilateralism in which no state would be entitled to interfere in Pakistan's relations with other states.

During his student days, Zulfikar Ali Bhutto had acquired an anti-Imperialist view of the world. He was a firm believer in economic self reliance and political independence themes he expounded in his famous book "Myth of Independence". Bhutto's finest hour came in the reconstruction of Pakistan after the traumatic dismemberment of Pakistan upon the fall of Dhaka on 16th December, 1971. He successfully put the derailed nation back on the track by rebuilding national institutions. His lasting achievement was the unanimous adoption of the Constitution in 1973. He established the Pakistan Steel Mills, Heavy Mechanical Complex Taxila, Port Qasim Authority, Quaid-e-Azam University, Allama Iqbal Open University, Karachi Nuclear Power Plant; thus, fortifying the prosperity, integrity and security of Pakistan. Using his experience as Foreign Minister, Bhutto cemented Pakistan's relation with Afro-Asian and Islamic countries and by 1976 had emerged as the Leader of the Third World. As an author, he brilliantly advocated the cause of hewers of wood and drawers of water of the Third World.

Bhutto was the founder of Pakistan's Nuclear Program. Under his guidance and leadership as Minister for Fuel, Power and Natural Resources, President and Prime Minister, Pakistan developed into the unique Muslim State with a nuclear capability for which he paid with his life. In his book "If I am Assassinated" written from the Death Cell, Zulfikar Ali Bhutto revealed how Kissinger had said "We will make an example of you".

The great leader of downtrodden masses and a visionary of unparalleled charisma will forever be remembered by his countrymen as Quaid-e-Awam (Leader of the Masses).

49

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zakk: *
RF: I think the Sindhi language bill was harsh but expected, as a reaction to years of discrimination against Sindhi. A provincial language should be a reflection of the majority while taking into account the minority.
[/QUOTE]

Expected? Are Sindhis better than other Pakistanis? Not only was it insulting to many of the Urdu Speakers in Karachi but also was the manifestation of an aggressive policy. I agree with your final sentence regarding provincial langagues, but let's face facts, Karachi, Hyderabad and other Urban Sindh areas that are Urdu speaking have a HUGE role to play in the Province. Everything from Commerce to education is very much Urban Sindh. To overlook a strong and beneficial (to the province) was not a good idea.

50

**
I dont agree with this statement.. In fact Bhutto was far more popular in Punjab than Sindh..**

You have every right to disagree with my statements. I know he was more popular in Punjab and that’s precisely why he resorted to Sindhi nationalism and other unholy alliances.

**
a sindhi being popular in Punjab is rare and speaks to the chrisma of a leader..**

Two things: 1. ZAB was barely a Sindhi (you want to push me on this??) 2. I WILL TYPE IN CAPS BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT READING MY MESSAGES. I ** SAID ** ZAB HAD CHARISMA, SO WHY ARE YOU REPEATING WHAT I HAVE SAID? It makes no sense for you to bring up the same thing, whats next? Are you going to highlight his role in the Nukes, the OIC again?

**
I know when we dont like someone the person’s achievements look small and faults look huge ..**

How about you answer me on ZAB’s role in 1965 war, FSF and the Bsaluchistan repression?? Your discussion of the 1971 situation also ended * without* any sources proving your point. So why so silent on those issues?? What do you do? Selectively read and decide to challenge me on one point? Well it’s not going to work that way because we are talking about a man. If your going to defend him then why are you skirting his issues. Again, bring up sources just like I did.

**
here are some of the milestones in Bhuttos distinct career that I have copied from some place.. its always fascinates me how a big Sindhi wadera , educated in west at top institutions - emerged as leader of Third World and masses..
**

First off what is this “place” that you copied from? Looks like you took my advice on copying and pasting from http://www.ppp.org.pk

But why did you stop there? You should have presented the other articles which truly elevate him to a demi-God status! As for ZAB being a “big” Sindhi wadero, are you referring to him or his background? Because the 1919 Provincial Gazette published by British did not even mention the Bhuttos of Larkana. Just for the record, I have seen a copy of the Gazette and it mentions many notables. USC and Berkeley are not exactly “top” institutions, although Oxford certainly is. Do me a favor, atleast have valid supports for your statements.

51

I didnt copied from PPP site.. its so many places .. and I can give u links if u insist..

hmm.. looks like ur just concentrating on pamphlets of jamait-e-Islami! I guess u might have heard the name of Sir Shah Nawaz’s Bhutto, Z A Bhuttos father whom Quaid-e-Azam really admired for his services at Independence of paisitan.. Sir Shahnawaz actually quite brillianltly acceded State of Junagarh in Pakistan and Pakistan even fought a war with India at that issue.. Bhutto’s sacrificed a lot and were given holdings in Sindh.. If ur Bristish dont mention them what can we do..

Berkley Law school is a great institution.. Bhutto mastered International Law and politics from there and even Bhuttos’ arch rivals admire his academic excellence and brilliance..

For ur record just hit the search button and check how many times we have discussed Bhutto, Balauchistan, 65 war and other topics.. ur just mixing too much stuff! If u had plainly tried to discussed Bhutto’s policies like others I could had discuss with u but u just tried a biased approach by forcing others to look at issues by ur special “patriotic vision”

52

**
I didnt copied from PPP site.. its so many places .. and I can give u links if u insist..
**

Links are not needed. The PPP site does a better job of atleast defending him.

**
hmm.. looks like ur just concentrating on pamphlets of jamait-e-Islami!
**

By G-D, I have not even heard of JI pamphlets.

**
I guess u might have heard the name of Sir Shah Nawaz's Bhutto, Z A Bhuttos father whom Quaid-e-Azam really admired for his services at Independence of paisitan.. Sir Shahnawaz actually quite brillianltly acceded State of Junagarh in Pakistan and Pakistan even fought a war with India at that issue.. Bhutto's sacrificed a lot and were given holdings in Sindh.. If ur Bristish dont mention them what can we do..
**

Ok I can accept that. That is why I asked if you though the Bhuttos were large landowners in compartively recent times or were they big waderos for centuries.

**
Berkley Law school is a great institution.. Bhutto mastered International Law and politics from there and even Bhuttos' arch rivals admire his academic excellence and brilliance..**

I am sorry but Berkeley is a good not a great institution. I know atleast 30 better law schools. I am stating the facts. I know he was an evil genius.

**
For ur record just hit the search button and check how many times we have discussed Bhutto, Balauchistan, 65 war and other topics.. ur just mixing too much stuff! **

No I am not miing things here. ZAB was the ONLY man around who dealt with all of these issues. After all we are discussing corrupt politicians NOT the history of Pakistan. Regardless of the issue, you have yet to defend him on the Baluchistan, '65, and FSF!

**
If u had plainly tried to discussed Bhutto's policies like others I could had discuss with u but u just tried a biased approach by forcing others to look at issues by ur special "patriotic vision" **

Lets face facts: there is obviously nothing you can say to defend ZAB on the issues I mentioned. I think your just plain frustrated that you cannt defend the man, like you did in other discussions. The issues that I have brought up are well supported by facts and links, you or anyone else is free to read them. My approach is not biased at all! Most Historians agree that 1965, 1971 were turning points in Pak. History. Baluchistan and the FSF show ZAB's true sides. My "patriotic vision" is simple-- any one who damages Pakistan or the Pakistani people is a target in my mind. There is no doubt that ZAB's policies have ruined Pakistan in many aspects.

53

This link is a useful addition to the corrupt leaders discussion.
Its taken from an old book, the writer was a Nawaz Sharif sympathiser but the documentation is quite a good read: