Capital Talk and Maulana Gul Naseeb

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
1

hmm, I donot know how to put it. There are several threads out there discussing the latest uproar in NWFP regarding the implementation of Sharia Laws. Well, its not totally about that yet it is nonetheless related to that. I was a bit perplexed, baffeled after that…
I have the opportunity to watch this program on Geo TV channel " Capital Talk." THe discussants were none other than respected MNA s representing their respective parties. MR. Gul Naseeb (MMA) and two ladies from opposition side: Nighat Yasmeen Aurakzai and Rifat Sawati.
In my view, I found the ladies really hitting the nail, pointing towards some really important issues. THey had no problem with the implementation of Sharia yet they were against the Talibanaization of the province. While the Maulana, solely there to defend and talk abt the latest debate just didnot seem to comprehend the issue at hand.

Now, I think I should talk straight abt the points that I found really amusing/disturbing/ call it whatever you want to..
While talking abt the definition of pardah, the ladies translated a verse from the Holy Quran( I believe Surah Nissa) and were of the view that that they are modestly dressed and that they donot think that they need to cover their faces. The Maulana laughed and told them to quote the Ayah in Arabic ( often alleging them of having no knowledge of Quran and Sunnah) on the National channel. His contention was that Quran is the source of Law ( as we donot have anything regarding how to say prayers in Quran so we have resort to sunnah and ahadis when it comes to the issue of pardah in the same way). He was asked countless time the definition of pardah, to elucidate on the issue right there and thenmuch in the way that ladies explained their point of view; the Maulana failed/ was adamant …

What irritated me most was when he said " She doesnot even know how to say " bismillah" correctly what else u expect from them. Now, now, is this the right attitude. He expected the lady to say it over again to which she said ’ it was a matter between her God and her.’

I believe in the end I have to go to my grave , what one does personally is none of my business. While they demolished all the sign boards from the province, they should provide alternate sources of income for such people. While they talk abt segragation of society , they should provide adequate facilities and opportunities to the female section of that society.

How does one saybismillah, kalima or offer prayers. I mean Don’t we all know what we have to do and can’t we learn on our own. Why is it that these people like to meddle in the privacy of the individuals, their religion…

I feel that they kept on fighting on such issues, tera kalima, mera kalima, pura pardah adha pardah, main musalman tu kam musalman, and totally forgot abt the development of the society, the purpose for which they have been elected…

sighs.. kia banay ga is qoom ka

2

Hmm very interestin post Losty, and always a pleasure to read.
The worst thing that has happened to Islam over the last 3 hundred years is, the establishment of a form of preisthood that believe there interpretation of Islam is the only interpretation. Unfortunately, we have very few Alims. People like Maulana Naseeb, the ifnormation secretary of the JUI, have never had to defend their beliefs because they have never been in such a powerful position to test them. Hence the almost puritanical arrogance.

Just my two cents.

3

The jackass Gul naseeb and others like him should stop referring to one another as Maulana first of all.

Funny they want to play holier than thou when teh basic title they have bestowed upon themselves is not appropriate.

I mean i could frnakly care less if they call themselves lord of thunder, knight of doom THOR or the amazing spiderman for all i care, but since they are so "holy" maybe they should know what titles are appropriate to begin with

The true meaning of MAULANA

No country uses “Maulana” title: The mullahs have adopted for themselves the honorific title of “Maulana” (which means OUR protector, OUR lord, OUR master) – which has the most serious un-Islamic connotation of placing another WITH the Almighty (SHIRK).

The word “maulana” is a compound word – MAULA and NA (our) which, under strict Islamic philosophy is applicable to God ALONE!

The word is used only twice in the Holy Quran, and refers to Allah Subhaanahoo Wa Ta’aala, indicating that it can be referred only to Him and NO ONE ELSE!
(1) “Rabana…anta MAULANA fansoorna alal qaumil Kaafireen – Our Lord…You are our Protector/ Lord/ Master, so grant us victory over the unbelievers” (2:286).
(2) “Huwa MAULANA; wa alal Laahi fal yatawakkalil Mu’minoon – He (Allah) is our Protector/ Lord/ Master, And on Allah let the Believers rely” (9:51).

The argument is supported by the facts that:
* in no other country in the world this honorific title is used;
* in West Asia the title used is SHAIKH (head) and USTAAD (teacher);
* in Iran the word used is IMAM (Leader), or MULLAH;
*the Bohra Muslim sect head is called SAYYADINA (our leader);
* in Central Asia countries the word used is MULLAH;
* the word “maulana” is in usage only among the Urdu-speaking Muslims of the sub-continent;
*until the birth of maulanaism, the words used among the Urdu-speakers also were MULLAH (fully equipped) or MAULAWI (belonging to God);
* the dictionaries of the 19th century do not have this word “maulana”, and it is found only in modern dictionaries indicating that it is of recent origin;

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Re: Capital Talk and Maulana Gul Naseeb

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by lost soul: *
I feel that they kept on fighting on such issues, tera kalima, mera kalima, pura pardah adha pardah, main musalman tu kam musalman, and totally forgot abt the development of the society, the purpose for which they have been elected...

sighs.. kia banay ga is qoom ka
[/QUOTE]

Losty, MMA is not going to accomplish jack. One may wonder how they united for power but hads been bickering over issues for decades JI, JUI, cartoon network..not sure who else is a part of MMA now.

All they want is power, just like BHutto used a slogan of roti, kapra, makan, these ppl use religion.

They want to enforce their belief to the minutest details on everyone. While their kids are in US..err same country that they are so set against.

If they are going to enforce their ideology on the nation, why is it that they cant enforce it on their own kids who are sitting here, one in Chicago, living it large on money that their fathers are getting from the awaam in the name of islam.

To put it mildly, these ppl would not know a fiscal, social, educational plan if it came and slapped them on the paggar. most of them are barely educated and those that are have little exposure to any other discipline.

They will conitnue to argue over stuff like whether someone can become a minister if he does not have a beard, even though he was their member for such a long time.

There is a saying mullah ki dorrr masjid tak, see these clowns in action and you will not how true that is. not just that but also murghay ki aik taang.

5

Re: Capital Talk and Maulana Gul Naseeb

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by lost soul: *
While talking abt the definition of pardah, the ladies translated a verse from the Holy Quran( I believe Surah Nissa) and were of the view that that they are modestly dressed and that they donot think that they need to cover their faces. The Maulana **laughed* and told them to quote the Ayah in Arabic ( often alleging them of having no knowledge of Quran and Sunnah) on the National channel. His contention was that Quran is the source of Law ( as we donot have anything regarding how to say prayers in Quran so we have resort to sunnah and ahadis when it comes to the issue of pardah in the same way). He was asked countless time the definition of pardah, to elucidate on the issue right there and thenmuch in the way that ladies explained their point of view; the Maulana failed/ was adamant ...

What irritated me most was when he said " She doesnot even know how to say " bismillah" correctly what else u expect from them. Now, now, is this the right attitude. He expected the lady to say it over again to which she said ' it was a matter between her God and her.'

[/QUOTE]

LS baji, I have the feeling that he was not receptive to the idea of a female sitting with him in a TV program and having a religious debate with him. I think that was the primary reason why he was being so condescending towards her and belittling what she was saying. I am not saying all our men are chauvinists, however some of them really are. Some of them truly do think that females have no brains and that their opinions are not worth being heard. I only wish they would look at the Prophet (saw) and see the way he treated and respected women, and see how the Quran preaches gender equality, before following the convenient false assumption that Islam grants superiority to males.

6

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Fraudz: *
The true meaning of MAULANA

No country uses “Maulana” title: The mullahs have adopted for themselves the honorific title of “Maulana” (which means OUR protector, OUR lord, OUR master) – which has the most serious un-Islamic connotation of placing another WITH the Almighty (SHIRK).

The word “maulana” is a compound word – MAULA and NA (our) which, under strict Islamic philosophy is applicable to God ALONE!

The word is used only twice in the Holy Quran, and refers to Allah Subhaanahoo Wa Ta’aala, indicating that it can be referred only to Him and NO ONE ELSE!
(1) “Rabana…anta MAULANA fansoorna alal qaumil Kaafireen – Our Lord…You are our Protector/ Lord/ Master, so grant us victory over the unbelievers” (2:286).
(2) “Huwa MAULANA; wa alal Laahi fal yatawakkalil Mu’minoon – He (Allah) is our Protector/ Lord/ Master, And on Allah let the Believers rely” (9:51).

The argument is supported by the facts that:
* in no other country in the world this honorific title is used;
* in West Asia the title used is SHAIKH (head) and USTAAD (teacher);
* in Iran the word used is IMAM (Leader), or MULLAH;
*the Bohra Muslim sect head is called SAYYADINA (our leader);
* in Central Asia countries the word used is MULLAH;
* the word “maulana” is in usage only among the Urdu-speaking Muslims of the sub-continent;
*until the birth of maulanaism, the words used among the Urdu-speakers also were MULLAH (fully equipped) or MAULAWI (belonging to God);
* the dictionaries of the 19th century do not have this word “maulana”, and it is found only in modern dictionaries indicating that it is of recent origin;
[/QUOTE]

wow, I didn't know that. very good point.

Gul Naseeb sounds like a jackass.

7

Well, I know that its not that u guys have no idea as to what goes on. But after coming back I found this plethora of channles a real treat where atleast everything is aired without being censored. :slight_smile:

Zakk, :slight_smile: (likewise)

Well, I don’t know whether it makes sense but why is it that the moment these people talk abt implementing the Islamic laws, all they want is to confine women in their homes. Is the presence of women such a big ‘fitna.’ I hope I am not going overboard here.I would quote from Ahmed jee’s thread here,

As Kauser S. Khan, with Aga Khan University in Karachi, has written, “It is female sexuality that men in Pakistan are most worried about. Their own sexuality is not an issue – it is there to be satisfied, and they do it at will.”

Certainly there are many myths that exists regarding the political/religious/ social environment of Peshawar in other parts of our country. I would really like to know as to how true these actually are. Some people from that part of our country whom I met, ladies in particular ( that professor of urs among them) and some families, i found them conservative yet enlightened. There is a difference between being narrowminded and being conservative. (I call myself a conservative at heart).

I think there have been various studies that compare Peshawar of today and that prior to the pouring in of Afghan refugees that totally changed the entire character of the province. If you know of any, let us know please.

Fraudz, thanks for the explaination. :flower1:
Well, this thread isn’t to disparge anyone but you see the ladies were accused of being the ‘typical lotas’ of Pakistani politics, yesterday they were supporting NSharif and today Musharraf. To this the ladies response was that MMA wouldnot havebeen in the government with such a large vote bank had Musharraf not played his game. If the MMA is here, its ’ cuz of Musharraf, if the ladies seats have been increased that too is because of his policies.

Irem, yeah true. He wasn’t feeling comfortable with ladies sitting by his side. Good observation.

8

Losty, I've said the joke before and I'll say it again. In Muslim countries, God is for man, religion is for women. A sad unfortunate fact. It has nothing to do with Islam, it's about control and power.

I would say, the influx of Afghan refugees did destroy the old Peshawar, which was a clean, well roganised city, and it also changed the ethni complexion from predominantly non pashtun, to Pashtun. But, that did not change the mentality of the city, after all many of the people who fled the Russian invasion were well educated intellectuals. The problem was that those moderates and technocrats were sidelined by the "groups" involved against the Russians. You had people who never dominated life suddenly made crorepatis and armed to the teeth. Those changed the complexion of society. That was followed by something to do with Domestic politics, with the ascent of the PPP to power, the Jamiat Islami was no longer a favourite funnel for funds. People like Gul Naseeb and his party were the favourites.

Lastly, Pashtuns, association with Islam is very strong, the Nationalist movement was primarly defeated because it was disassociated from Islam. Islam in danger, has a very strong appeal to Pashtuns. One only has to look at the 1947 referendum where that appeal won the populace. ( PKC has written very accurately about the tactics the MMA used in the election in his post on Peshawar in the General forum)

Anyway that's my additional two cents!

p.s: I will have to get abck to you about any writings or research about how Pesh has changed since 1979. I don't think there is much available. The closest I can think off, is Syed Amjad Hussains writing about the old Peshawar. he writes for Pakistan Link which is accessible online. A western writer wrote a book called The Performance of Emotion in Pakhtun Women or something like that, which also might be of interest.

9

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by lost soul: *
Irem, yeah true. He wasn't feeling comfortable with ladies sitting by his side. Good observation.
[/QUOTE]

Hmmm being uncomfortable with ladies sitting by his side because of haya is another thing and completely fine, in fact nice. I didn't mean that though. I have a hunch that perhaps he just didn't think that women, specially Muslim Pakistani women, could be religiously or intellectually capable of having such a discussion with him. The tone and content of his statements could just be an unconscious manifestation of his true feelings of condescension towards women in matters of religion and intellect.

Just a theory based on my gut impression...

Wallah o Alim

10

that guy acted like a jerk and sounded like typical paki molvis who will argue uselessly…

at the same time, the two women presented themselves as ignorant love-to-be-west-like…

i felt sorry for hamid meer…
he was surrounded by idiots :hehe:

11

Hamid Meer himself is an idiot, a pro-jihad ISI agent.