yes they can.
*Nikamma kya is dil nay
Is dil nay kya hay Nikamma *
Recently there was a program on PBS television about Islam and Muslims entitled "Muslims". In the program there was this "Sheikh" from Al-Azhar University in Cairo Egypt, who claimed to possess the knowledge of Islam and Shariah that very few people in the world might possess. This Sheikh is also said to be an authority for giving out Fatwas, about different problems one might be facing.
During the course of his interview the Sheikh recieved a phone call from a man who told him that he has married a girl, whom he had pre marital sex with, but now he has married the girl in front of two witnesses, and wanted to know if his marriage is halaal according to Islam. Replying him the Sheikh said, NO, "Haza haraam, haraam, haraam" the girl needs to have blessings from her father, plus she needs to have dowery, and only then the marriage would become halaal.
So now was he enforcing the egyptian cultural values in this case or was his ruling in accordance with Islamic or Shariat laws?
I don't want to achieve immortality through my work... I want to achieve it through not dying.
raaj dulara, please put forth some sort of hadith, quranic verse that gives specific reference to a wali and the mandatory usage of one.
secondly, some here have talked about the wali being a source of security for a woman if something in the marriage goes wrong.
1. you have mehrum or whatever that is which is granted to a woman and given to her in case of a divorce to support her
2 women are allowed to work...a woman can support herself...lets stop all this crap about a woman needs some sort of man in her life to support her.
3 the issue here is not about whether u need a wali or not, its about what if a "wali" is present, but the girl herself does not wish to go thru with the marriage - the answer is no, the marriage is null if she is forced into marriage and also if the boy is forced into the marriage. Then the sin is upon the "wali" for forcing the marriage. A woman can of course wed without a wali -- what wali did Khadija bibi have? what of those women who are completely alone in the world? have they no right to marry becuz there is no man in their life? I think not. Thus, the wali issue may have been applicable in past times, but the modern liberated woman does not need a wali for any security purposes, as Islam has done well to provide all provisions thru the Quran for marriage affairs.
I would also like to see some proff that women are required to have a wali.
a wali is no other person that her Father, except if he is deceased then her brother and so on.
Hmmmmm.......then what about women who converted to Islam? Are you saying that Muslim women can have non-muslim men as a wali?
Assalamo Alaikum, I recently came across this fatwa stating that you can get married without a wali. Hope it’ll help…
“I put my trust in Allah, my Lord and your Lord! There is not a moving creature, but He has a grasp of its forelock. Verily, my Lord is on the straight path. (The truth)”
(11:55-56)
“…Indeed my prayer, my sacrifice, my living and my dying are for Allaah, the Lord of the worlds” (6:162)
Islam Questions & Answers www.islam-qa.com
Question Reference Number:: 13929
Title: Her brother was her guardian for marriage because her father did not approve of the marriage, then he agreed one year later
Home > Jurisprudence and Islamic Rulings > Transactions > Marriage > Conditions of Marriage >
Question:
I have a question regarding the validity of my Nikah. I got married one year ago with my brother as my guardian, because my father refused to marry me. After one year, my father had happily accepted my marriage. I am sometimes worried about the validity of my nikah, was it islamically correct?
Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.
(1) This advice is addressed to parents:
The duty of parents is to hasten to arrange the marriages of the women who are under their guardianship, if someone who is compatible proposes marriage and the woman agrees to that. Whoever does not do that is going against the command of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). It was narrated from Abu Hurayrah that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “If there comes a proposal of marriage from one with whose religious commitment and character you are pleased, then marry [your female relative under your guardianship] to him, for if you do not do that, there will be fitnah (temptation, tribulation) on earth and much corruption.” (Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, al-Nikaah, 1004; classed as hasan by al-Albaani in Saheeh Sunan al-Tirmidhi, no. 865).
It is not permissible to treat them with harshness [cf. al-Nisaa’ 4:19 – interpretation of the meaning] for any reason that has not been prescribed by Allaah and His Messenger. “Harsh treatment”, as defined by Ibn Qudaamah, means, “preventing a woman from getting married to someone who is compatible, if she asks for that and if each of them wants to marry the other.” (See al-Mughni, part 7, p. 24). Parents and guardians should hasten to marry the women under their care because that will protect them from falling into that which Allaah has forbidden, and so that the guardian himself will not fall into that which Allaah has forbidden of the sin of treating them harshly. The basic principle is that harsh treatment on the part of the guardian by not letting her marry someone compatible is haraam, because it is oppression and harming the woman by depriving her of her right to marry someone she wants. That is because Allaah forbade that when He said, addressing guardians:
“… do not prevent them from marrying their (former) husbands…” [al-Baqarah 2:232 – interpretation of the meaning].
(2) The ruling on this matter may be one of two:
The first is that if the closest relative or guardian of the woman was treating her harshly by preventing her from getting married, then it is OK for a more distant relative to act as her guardian in marriage, even if the closer relative is present, because in this case he has no right to be her guardian.
Al-Mirdaawi said: “The phrase ‘if the closer relative is preventing her from getting married then the more distant relative should act as her guardian in marriage’ is the correct view in the madhhab; most of our companions share this view… Shaykh Taqiy al-Deen (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: one of the forms of ‘harsh treatment’ is when no one is proposing marriage to her, because of the harshness of her guardian.”
(al-Insaaf, part 5, p. 74)
Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said: If she likes a man and he is compatible with her, then it is obligatory for her brother or her (paternal) uncle to act as her guardian in her marriage to him. If they treat her harshly and prevents her from marrying, then a more-distantly related guardian may marry her to him.”
(al-Fataawa al-Kubra, part 3, p. 83)
Ibn Qudaamah said: “If her more-closely related guardian treats her harshly (by not letting her get married), then the guardianship passes to one who is more distantly related. This was stated by Ahmad…”
(al-Mughni by Ibn Qudaamah, part 7, p. 24)
Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen said: If a father prevents his daughter from marrying someone who is compatible, then guardianship passes to a more distant relative, the closest then the closest.”
(Fataawa Islamiyyah, part 3, p. 149)
The second is when a more distant relative has arranged the marriage when the closer relative is present and was not treating her harshly (by preventing her from getting married).
Al-Mardaawi said: “If a more distant relative arranged the marriage for no reason, or a non-relative arranged the marriage, then this is not valid.” (al-Insaaf, part 8, p. 82).
Al-Bahooti said: “If a more distant relative arranged the marriage with no reason why a closer relative could not have arranged it, then the marriage is not valid… because the more distant relative has no right of guardianship if a closer relative is present.”
(Kashshaaf al-Qinaa’, part 5, p. 56)
This issue may be examined further. If the closer relative approves of this marriage, what is the ruling? And if the closer relative approves of this marriage, does his approval make the marriage valid or not?
The scholars said: If someone arranges the marriage when there is someone else who is more entitled to guardianship and he is present, and is not treating her harshly (by preventing her from getting married), then the marriage is invalid. This issue includes three rulings, the first of which is that if the more distantly related guardian arranges the marriage, when the more closely related guardian is present, and she accepts the proposal of marriage without the permission of the closer relative, then it is not valid.
This was the view of al-Shaafa’i.
Maalik said: It is valid, because this is a guardian, so it is permissible for him to arrange the marriage with her permission, as is the case with a closer relative.
The second ruling is that this marriage is null and void; it was not done with permission or with proper permission, and it cannot be made valid with the approval of the closer relative. Marriage in all such cases is invalid, according to the more sound of the two reports. This was stated by Ahmad in several places, and this is the view of al-Shaafa’i, Abu ‘Ubayd and Abu Thawr.
Another report was narrated from Ahmad, in which he said that it depended on approval, if approval was given it was permissible, and if approval were not given, it was invalid.
Inkaah al-Fudooli.
According to the terminology of the fuqaha’, the fudooli means one who interferes in the rights of another without any permission from sharee’ah, because his interfering is not based on any rights of ownership, trusteeship or guardianship.
(al-Mawsoo’ah al-Fiqhiyyah, part 32, p. 171)
The fuqaha’ differed concerning the ruling on a marriage arranged by a fudooli without any rights of guardianship or proxy:
The Hanbalis and al-Shaafa’i in al-Jadeed said that the marriage arranged by a fudooli is invalid and the approval of the guardian has no effect (i.e., the marriage contract must be repeated).
The second view is that of Ahmad, according to one report narrated from him, and of Abu Yoosuf, which is that the marriage arranged by a fudooli is valid, but it depends on the approval of the guardian. If he gives approval then it is OK, but if he disapproves, it is not valid.
(al-Mawsoo’ah al-Fiqhiyyah, part 32, p. 175)
In conclusion: some of the scholars have said that the marriage contract is valid if the guardian approves – as you have seen – and if you want to have more peace of mind and avoid an area concerning which there are differences of opinion among the scholars, then do the marriage contract again. All that is needed is the proposal from your guardian – your father – and acceptance from the husband, and the witness of two Muslim men, and repentance for what has happened.
We ask Allaah to give you strength.
Islam Q&A (www.islam-qa.com)
Islam Questions & Answers www.islam-qa.com
Question Reference Number:: 7193
Title: The girl’s father disagrees with a marriage –what is the solution?
Home > Jurisprudence and Islamic Rulings > Transactions > Marriage > Conditions of Marriage >
Question:
I have a question regarding marrige. If a father disagrees with a marriage along racial lines or because that person is upon the manhaj of the salaf and there is no islamic judge in your locality e.g. Carribbean, What should that person do according to the Qur’an and Sunnah?
Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.
Firstly: it is not permissible for a man to marry a woman without the permission of her walee (guardian), regardless of whether she is a virgin or previously-married. This is the view of the majority of scholars, including al-Shaafa’i, Maalik and Ahmad. They take as evidence (daleel) the words of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him):
“There should be no nikaah (marriage contract) except with a wali (guardian).”
(Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1101; Abu Dawood, 2085; Ibn Maajah, 1881. It is saheeh, as stated in Irwaa’ al-Ghaleel,6/235, by al-Albaani, may Allaah have mercy on him).
And the hadeeth:
“Any woman who gets married without the permission of her wali, her marriage is invalid, her marriage is invalid, her marriage is invalid. If her husband has consummated the marriage, then the mahr belongs to her in return for that. If she does not have a wali then the (Muslim) ruler is the wali of anyone who does not have a wali.”
(Narrated and classed as hasan by al-Tirmidhi, 1102; Abu Dawood, 2083; Ibn Maajah, 1879).
Secondly: if her wali prevents her from marrying the person she wants with no shar’i reason for doing so, the guardianship passes to someone who is fit to be a wali, so it may pass from her father to her grandfather, for example.
Thirdly: if all her guardians prevent her for no shar’i reason, then the (Muslim) ruler will be her wali, because of the hadeeth, “…If she does not have a wali, then the (Muslim) ruler is the wali of anyone who does not have a wali.” The “ruler” here means the judge who rules according to sharee’ah.
The wali does not have the right to prevent a woman from marrying on the basis of his own whims and with no shar’i reason.
It was reported that al-Hasan said: Ma’qil ibn Yassaar told me that [this aayah] was revealed concerning him. He said: “I married a sister of mine to a man, and he divorced her. When her ‘iddah was over, he came and asked to marry her. I said to him, ‘I married her to you and I treated you well and honoured you, then you divorced her. And now you come asking to marry her! No, by Allaah, she will never go back to you!’ He was a man who had nothing wrong with him, and the woman wanted to go back to him. Then Allaah revealed this aayah (interpretation of the meaning): ‘…do not prevent them …’ [al-Baqarah 2:232]. So I said, ‘Now I will do it, O Messenger of Allaah.’” So he married her to him. (Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 4837).
According to another report, he said:
“It was concerning me that this aayah was revealed (interpretation of the meaning): ‘And when you have divorced women and they have fulfilled the term of their prescribed period, do not prevent them from marrying their (former) husbands’ [al-Baqarah 2:232].
Fourthly: If there is no wali and no shar’i judge, then her case should be referred to the ruler or whoever is acting in his stead. If there is no such person, then her case should be referred to the sharee’ah courts. If there is no sharee’ah court, then her case should be referred to a man who holds a position of leadership among his people and is committed to Islam. If there is no such man, then her case should be referred to any trustworthy and religiously-committed man who is fit to be a wali.
Ibn Qudaamah said: if a woman does not have a wali and there is no ruler, then according to Ahmad, any religiously-committed man may arrange her marriage with her permission. (al-Mughni, 7/352).
Shaykh ‘Umar Al-Ashqar says:
If there is no Muslim ruler and the woman is in a place where the Muslims do not have a ruler and she has no wali at all, such as the Muslims in America etc., then if there are Islamic organizations in that country which take care of the Muslims’ affairs, they should step in and take care of arranging her marriage. The same applies if the Muslims have a leader whom they obey or someone who takes care of their affairs. (Al-Waadih fi Sharh Qaanoon al-Ahwaal al-Shakhsiyyah al-Urduni, p. 70).
All of this [transferring guardianship to someone other than the girl’s father] must be with the consent of the girl and should not result in greater corruption than preventing you from marrying her. It should also be on the condition that the reason for [the father’s] refusal is invalid according to the sharee’ah, as you have explained.
Fifthly: it is not permissible for the walee to refuse marriage because the prospective husband does not follow his manhaj of da’wah, or because he is not of his tribe or from his country. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) commanded us to marry religious people and not to refuse them, otherwise corruption and tribulation would be the result.
Abu Hurayrah said: the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “If someone whose religious commitment and attitude pleases you proposes marriage, then marry [your female relative under your charge] to him. If you do not do that, there will be tribulation in the land and much corruption.” (Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1084; Ibn Maajah, 1967. Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani, may Allaah have mercy on him, in al-Silsilah al-Saheehah. 1022).
Sixthly: by the same token, it is not permissible for a woman to justify a marriage to whomever she wishes on the grounds that this person is following the same manhaj of da’wah. It is sufficient for her that the person who is proposing marriage is religiously committed and has a good attitude.
And all parties concerned should remember that their Lord, may He be blessed and exalted, is always watching them.
Islam Q&A (www.islam-qa.com)
Islam Questions & Answers www.islam-qa.com
Question Reference Number:: 4602
Title: Parents forcing their daughter into a marriage
Home > Jurisprudence and Islamic Rulings > Transactions > Marriage > Conditions of Marriage >
Question:
I am muslim. I have to ask a question about my friend who is being forced to marry someone by her parents. She wanted to marry someone else. The guy who she is being forced to marry is more educated and wealthy than the one who she wanted to marry. Her parents has disapproved of her choice and they are forcing her to marry that guy. The guy who she likes is also muslim and very much devoted into islam. But just because the society would not talk about them they don’t like the guy who she loves. Any suggestions??
Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.
It is not permissible for a woman to be made to marry someone she does not want. The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “A previously-married woman should not be married without being consulted, and a virgin should not be married without asking her permission.” They said, “O Messenger of Allaah, how is her permission given?” He said, “By her silence.” (Reported by al-Bukhaari, 6455).
‘Aa’ishah reported that a girl came to her and said, “My father married me to his brother’s son in order to raise his social standing, and I did not want this marriage *.” ‘Aa’ishah said, “Sit here until the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) comes. The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) came and she told him about the girl. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) sent for her father, then he gave the girl the choice of what to do. She said, “O Messenger of Allaah, I have accepted what my father did, but I wanted to prove something to other women.” (Reported by al-Nisaa’i, 3217).
So, both the guardian and the woman must agree to the marriage. With regard to your request for our advice regarding the problem mentioned in the question, so long as this marriage has taken place, it is better for the woman to try to keep it going as much as she can, and to try to accept this husband. She should seek reward through pleasing her parents and also try to reform her husband through a gentle approach and praying for guidance for him. And Allaah is the Source of Strength.
Islam Q&A (www.islam-qa.com)*
[quote]
Originally posted by raaj-dulara:
*for girls, *wali is mandatory,
a wali is no other person that her Father, except if he is deceased then her brother and so on.
without the permission of wali a mulsim girl cant marry. thats her only security.
this rule is not applicable for boys**
[/quote]
no a wali is not mandatory. 2 adult ppl can get married without the wali.
*Nikamma kya is dil nay
Is dil nay kya hay Nikamma *
Islam Questions & Answers www.islam-qa.com
Question Reference Number:: 2127
Title: Conditions of walee (guardian)
Home > Jurisprudence and Islamic Rulings > Transactions > Marriage > Conditions of Marriage >
Question:
What exactly constitutes a guardian, as is needed in the nikkah ceremony. I am a female Muslim, and I want to know if my older brother is acceptable for this role.
Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.
There are three pillars or conditions for the marriage contract in Islam:
Both parties should be free of any obstacles that might prevent the marriage from being valid, such as their being mahrams of one another (i.e., close relatives who are permanently forbidden to marry), whether this relationship is through blood ties or through breastfeeding (radaa’) etc., or where the man is a kaafir (non-Muslim) and the woman is a Muslim, and so on.
There should be an offer or proposal (eejaab) from the walee or the person who is acting in his place, who should say to the groom “I marry so-and-so to you” or similar words.
There should be an expression of acceptance (qabool) on the part of the groom or whoever is acting in his place, who should say, “I accept,” or similar words.
The conditions of a proper nikaah (marriage contract) are as follows:
Both the bride and groom should be clearly identified, whether by stating their names or describing them, etc.
Both the bride and groom should be pleased with one another, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No previously-married woman (widow or divorcee) may be married until she has been asked about her wishes (i.e., she should state clearly her wishes), and no virgin should be married until her permission has been asked (i.e., until she has agreed either in words or by remaining silent).” They asked, “O Messenger of Allaah, how is her permission given (because she will feel very shy)?” He said: “By her silence.” (Reported by al-Bukhaari, 4741)
The one who does the contract on the woman’s behalf should be her walee, as Allaah addressed the walees with regard to marriage (interpretation of the meaning): “And marry those among you who are single…” [al-Noor 24:32] and because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Any woman who marries without the permission of her walee, her marriage is invalid, her marriage is invalid, her marriage is invalid.” (Reported by al-Tirmidhi, 1021 and others; it is a saheeh hadeeth)
The marriage contract must be witnessed, as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “There is no marriage contract except with a walee and two witnesses.” (Reported by al-Tabaraani; see also Saheeh al-Jaami’, 7558)
It is also important that the marriage be announced, as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Announce marriages.” (Reported by Imaam Ahmad; classed as hasan in Saheeh al-Jaami’, 1027)
The conditions of the walee are as follows:
He should be of sound mind
He should be an adult
He should be free (not a slave)
He should be of the same religion as the bride. A kaafir cannot be the walee of a Muslim, male or female, and a Muslim cannot be the walee of a kaafir, male or female, but a kaafir can be the walee of a kaafir woman for marriage purposes, even if they are of different religions. An apostate (one who has left Islam) cannot be a walee for anybody.
He should be of good character (‘adaalah – includes piety, attitude, conduct, etc.), as opposed to being corrupt. This is a condition laid down by some scholars, although some of them regard the outward appearance of good character as being sufficient, and some say that it is enough if he is judged as being able to pay proper attention to the interests of the woman for whom he is acting as walee in the matter of her marriage.
He should be male, as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No woman may conduct the marriage contract of another woman, and no woman can conduct the marriage contract on behalf of her own self, because the zaaniyah (fornicatress, adulteress) is the one who arranges things on her own behalf.” (Reported by Ibn Maajah, 1782; see also Saheeh al-Jaami’, 7298)
He should be wise and mature (rushd), which means being able to understand matters of compatibility and the interests of marriage.
The fuqahaa’ put possible walees in a certain order, and a walee who is more closely-related should not be ignored unless there is no such person or the relatives do not meet the specified conditions. A woman’s walee is her father, then whoever her father may have appointed before his death, then her paternal grandfather or great-grandfather, then her son, then her grandfathers sons or grandsons, then her brother through both parents (full brother), then her brother through her father, then the sons of her brother through both parents, then the sons of her brother through her father, then her uncle (her father’s brother through both parents), then her father’s brother through the father, then the sons of her father’s brother though both parents, then the sons of her father’s brother through the father, then whoever is more closely related, and so on – as is the case with inheritance. The Muslim leader (or his deputy, such as a qaadi or judge) is the walee for any woman who does not have a walee of her own.
And Allaah knows best.
Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid (www.islam-qa.com)
the hanafi school of thought recognizes marriage without walis as valid.
*Nikamma kya is dil nay
Is dil nay kya hay Nikamma *
does this mean that anybody can be the wali. it doesn’t have to be the father or mother?? it can be anybody?
**Nikamma kya is dil nay
Is dil nay kya hay Nikamma **
It seems so odd, that when there is a problem related to marriage, both, the parents and children try to customize Islam in a way that they can prove that they are right.
Islam is balanced, if parents have rights, children too have rights. In the case of marriage, there is a criteria which is set, and it is not upon any man or woman to have a say in a matter which is already decreed By Allah and His Messenger.
If a "wali" is required then, it is required. However it doesn't mean that the "wali" can do whatever he likes. If the "wali", who is in most cases the father of the girl, is being harsh then, he is not fit to be a "wali", but this is not practiced today. For most of us the "wali" is only the father if he is alive, but this is not the case. If the father has an objection which is not a Sharaee objection, then he has no right whatsoever to take unjust advantage of the authority he has.
But who is willing to accept this? We only are willing to accept those parts of Islam which are in our favor, completely ignoring the other parts of Islam which are in conflict with our own whims and desires.
Today most of the parents are un-aware of what is happening in the lives of their children, but still they claim that they know what is best for their children. Their children are being brought up by baby-sitters and other people who are paid to look after the children, but still the parents claim that they know their children because they have given them birth.
If parents implement all the teachings of Islam then it is justified for them to use Islam when it comes to marriage, but if they are not applying Islamic teachings in their whole life, how can they justify to implement Islam when it comes to the marriage of their children against their wishes?
When everything else is not happening according to The Quran and Sunnah, why is it then, that we turn to Quran and Sunnah when our child wants to marry with a person whom he/she is willing to? Why are we reluctant to do everything according to The Quran and Sunnah? Why?
Basically, we are using Islam only when we need to fulfill our desires. We use Islam to justify our unjust actions. We are chosing parts and ignoring parts of Islam.
This is a disease of the hearts, and Allah is certainly aware of the intentions, but responsibility also lies on the scholars who support the parents, not because they are right, but only because they are parents.
We need to maintain JUSTICE no matter who we are dealing with. Justice is what is missing, and that is the root cause of the corruption we face today.
[quote]
Originally posted by dewana tera:
**
does this mean that anybody can be the wali. it doesn't have to be the father or mother?? it can be anybody?
**
[/quote]
Yes!
If a father is being harsh and there is no Sharaee reason for him being harsh except that he wants to fulfill his own desires, then HE is no longer a "wali". Even if he is alive!