tsk tsk CH, saw you as a voice of reason 
Well whoop do doo, my Finance degree or MBA doesn’t preclude me from becoming a physician either! I certainly have enough science courses from undergrad to be eligible for med school. Nothing precludes anyone..some time money and effort is all that is needed for another degree. But thats all off topic, the original member asked an opinion for a minor in business, tell me why its a bad idea if he wants to eventually work in the management operations of his engineering firm? ya’all defy common logic!
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *
RF: Curious..what excites you in Business (a broad term as it is).
I know a lot of monkeys who studied accounting, went to Ok schools, got an MBA, they are like 30/32 but just can't seem to make more than $200K a year. What do you think is their shortcomings.
I think these sorry souls should change their career in my opinion.
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My abilities to make decisions that benefit others as well myself. The excitement of tackling new problems, having the control that I have..and many intangible that I am at a loss for words.
Well, those "monkeys" are in it for the wrong reasons, if your not ELECTRIFIED by your work, drop the pretentions and find something else. Perhaps they have families and other obligations so they, like crack addicts must go to the dealer every day.
RF: First of all it's "whoop dee doo"...Secondly...a business minor is a waste of time. In all honesty, if an applicant in let's say a software consulting firm came to me and said he would like to shift from being a code monkey to a quality assurance langoor, and the reason it is that he has a business minor...I would first kick him in the ass and then spit on him. Taking two classes in marketing and finance doesn't prepare you for operations or the business side of things. Having real experience does. Any one who thinks differently can go and give it a try. They will be disappointed fast.
NYA: you are wrong about B-professors though....in your day and age maybe :p
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*Originally posted by NYAhmadi: *
Rajput, That explains why I toss so many resumes in my trash bin on weekly basis. Bhaijan, business education is a recent phenomenon, which is a hodgepodge of stupid courses put together. I wouldn’t say it without actually knowing top players in the NYC business world with degrees in Music, Fine Arts, and History. When you study price theory in your business degree, it is actually macroeconomics, and when you study organizational development it is actually industrial sociology. Have you ever wondered how many business professors have degrees in Business? May be one out of a thousand.
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Adam Smith is rolling in grave :D
Business is grounded in Economics, that the essense of the major.
I know business is a hodge-podge-- a perfect combo. Why did those top dogs waste their studying music and the like? Hell, I could go out take some BS lib arts courses right now come up to a musical expert arguing my views and he will not be able to reject them because they are MY opinions, nothing quantitative..just like this discussion.
While I do agree that business is a recent phenomenon, give it time and it will dominate.
Chlatahai, I have been wrong all along. Roman tells me I am at least 15 years behind times (and that's a conservative estimate). I am your blast from the past my brother. My grandpa had a degree in anthropology and he managed huge tracts of lands back in the day when women looked cute in shaggy cut. Modernism sucks. Business people will burn in hell. There is no bigger sin than an objective in profit maximization. A drink later in the week? Like on Thursday?
1) Undergrads from Ivy league majoring in Art History have a better chance in joining bulge bracket I-banks (training programs make it a level playing field) than graduates from second tier schools.
2) MBA applicants come from all different backgrounds. There will be as manylib arts MBA applicants than Finance mavens.
RF: First of all it's "whoop dee doo"...
Fair enough! I never claimed that my business education would make me an expert linguist. :D
** Secondly...a business minor is a waste of time. In all honesty, if an applicant in let's say a software consulting firm came to me and said he would like to shift from being a code monkey to a quality assurance langoor, and the reason it is that he has a business minor...I would first kick him in the ass and then spit on him. Taking two classes in marketing and finance doesn't prepare you for operations or the business side of things. Having real experience does. Any one who thinks differently can go and give it a try. They will be disappointed fast. **
OFCOURSE 2 or 3 classes doesnt do anything in terms of the ituation you described. However it does facilitate you entry into busines side of things by allow you to atleast have clue as to how marginal and diminishing will affect your firms expansion...the person with the business minor atleast not come out looking like duffer when certain basic principles are being discussed.
Rajput, if you think that music is not quantitative, you have one huge problem to deal with before even thinking about other smaller stuff. Secondly, business (as in commerce) and economics are two distinctly separate disciplines (in terms of areas of concentration). Try your hands on econometrics some day. Take a course in welfare economics, or study market democracy. 2/3rd of the world still functions on industrial democracy and market socialism, a far cry from business.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *
1) Undergrads from Ivy league majoring in Art History have a better chance in joining bulge bracket I-banks (training programs make it a level playing field) than graduates from second tier schools.
2) MBA applicants come from all different backgrounds. There will be as manylib arts MBA applicants than Finance mavens.
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True and True..
How is that a good? Beyond the fact that firms and people are suckers for Ivy League Schools and Business Schools are fools for teaching the foundations all over again.
Know what I was doing in foundations courses? Partying. It was sad seeing people cram for exams and harras the profs.
You have illustrated what is wrong with the system now tell me something I don't know :)
Instead of wasting their time looking at marginal and dimishing returns, they should take some classes in wine tasting and Art History. When you get to a certain level...you have people who do the number crunching for you. Recent MBA's with accounting pasts. Executives are generally known for their ability to be adaptive and responsive to the world around them. 99% of the world could give two sihts about diminishing returns, they want the airplane seat next to them empty in coach and they want to able to tell the difference between the forms of Massachio and Giotto and Merlot and a Zinfendel.
If you look at successful executives (SVP. MD or above), they will have as many Lib arts majors as hard science/bus.
Yep Chaltahai...now we are talking. which reminds me to run off and take my boyz for their music class....i am helping prepare the future leaders.
RF: The point is that if one wants to be on the business side. Then just do the friggin bus major. Why go for engineering? Bus. Minor would not prepare you for the bus. track. But taking a few lib arts classes might actually prepare you to know more about the world adn could actually help you get laid.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by NYAhmadi: *
Rajput, if you think that music is not quantitative, you have one huge problem to deal with before even thinking about other smaller stuff. Take a course in welfare economics, or study market democracy. 2/3rd of the world still functions on industrial democracy and market socialism, a far cry from business.
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*Rajput, if you think that music is not quantitative, you have one huge problem to deal with before even thinking about other smaller stuff. *
You and I both know how quantitive music is! I am referring to the consumer's (i e the folks who pay your salary) POV.
*Secondly, business (as in commerce) and economics are two distinctly separate disciplines (in terms of areas of concentration). *
Same field, category..much more of econ overlaps in business, atleast in the way I was taught.
Try your hands on econometrics some day. Take a course in welfare economics, or study market democracy. 2/3rd of the world still functions on industrial democracy and market socialism, a far cry from business
I took econometrics for 1 semester didn't interest me. Took market socialism which was grouped with oublic sector finance to cover capitalist markets. They diverge at various points BUT they are first cousins just like Politics is to International Relation. Econ is the base (or common ancestor).
CH, why not combine Eng with Bus? Business minor just like a good foundation in liberal arts through diverse will help you in many fields. Why downplay the role of the bus. minor while upgrading the lib arts courses, beyond the getting laid angle (side note: finally one useful thing to come out with this lib art talk).
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by NYAhmadi: *
Yep Chaltahai...now we are talking. which reminds me to run off and take my boyz for their music class....i am helping prepare the future leaders.
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Haha Ahmadiji your progeny will have genetics to thank for that :)
It's simple, people major in something that you see yourself doing for the rest of your life. If you like many different things like I do, prioritize and go for a major that HELPS you in your future endevours...time for lib arts or social science research can come later in your working life with continuing ed. classes.
The system is broke, CEO's make way too much money and I sense a a middle management revolution brewing :D
Well..taking a semester in econometrics and talking like a jackass. Bhaijan, I have had 8 years of it, and still learning. You have absolutely no clue as to how quantitative music is. Music and data manipulation is lick pea and pod.
If econ was business, why call it business then? Econ is not just about business. We will talk tomorrow.
Damn, my day off and I'm sitting here talking business..
CH and NYA: Hope ya'll dont get bitter once the American public wisens up ;)
If you look at the original post. The kid is studying engineering. Already a technical and analytical discipline. The incremental value added (business term :) ) will be minimal, plus the opportunity costs of not studying something that hones your other skills, like a sense of history, or language, or culture in a lib arts minor would not make it wise.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by NYAhmadi: *
Well..taking a semester in econometrics and talking like a jackass. Bhaijan, I have had 8 years of it, and still learning. You have absolutely no clue as to how quantitative music is. Music and data manipulation is lick pea and pod.
If econ was business, why call it business then? Econ is not just about business. We will talk tomorrow.
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Hey I never claimed to know enough about econometrics and if your still learning, what point does that prove? Do you call econometrics a purely different field altogether, with no affinities to economic models?
I may not be a Music expert nor do I wish to hold a degree but I do play the piano, and the notes that you are referring to are worthless unless the end product (music) does not match up the subjective preferences of Music. Compare that finance, there is no subjectivity in that regard. The differentiation between quantitive and qualitative careers depends on objectivity and subjectivity, respectively. Thus any fields outside of the basic ones I believe I have described earlier are qualitative due to the subjectivity of consumer preferences.