Dear Guppos?
A lot of people in the subcontinent believes in lot of things which are not part of Islam. Some of them are so strange that it become difficult to distinguis between muslim and non muslims. I know my maternal grand mother used to do some nyaz nazr which I never understood why? My serious question is do you think these things make us Kafir??
Hadith: 'Whenever a muslim calls another muslim as "Kaffir", by God, one of them is'
This proves that if someone has even 1% chance that he may be wrong, then do not call another muslim as "kaffir", bcz if they are not, then the caller will be one. So pls be very careful, brother.
Re: Barelvis. I did some research on this group. They are basically sunni muslims. What makes them distinct is their extra-ordinary love and devotion for the Prophet (SAWW). This group was founded by Ahmed Raza Khan Barelvi who has written many books. In all his teachings he has exhorted the muslims that the path to eternal success is to follow the shariat and the love of Allah and love of Prophet (SAWW). To my knowlege they do not associate anyone with Allah and with the sifaat/characteristics of Allah. They consider Prophet Muhammad (SAWW) as the best human being, "rehmat-ul-lil-Aalameen", the last messanger of God, and the source through which they will achieve the love of Allah. They believe that pious people (aulia) are present in all times to guide muslims.
Their love and devotion for the Prophet (SAWW) is expressed in different ways. These include offering darud/dua for the Prophet (SAWW) after every prayer en masse, have gatherings of melad (some every month, some every year), devotional poetry (na'at) to praise the qualities of the Prophet (SAWW), distributing food to the poor with the sawab going to the Propher (SAWW), and to kiss their eyes (and offer dua) whenever the name of the Prophet (SAWW) is taken, to name a few. To note that a significant majority of muslims in Pakistan (especially Punjab) are the followers of Barelvi school of thought.
These actions have been billed as bida'a by some muslim scholars. To counter Barelvis, another group is rapidly organzing themselves, who call themselves as "ahle Hadith" (some also call them "wahabis", I don't know it for sure). This group claims that all the activities mentioned above, are bid'a and are innovation in the religion, which is prohibited.
Wllah u Alim Bil Sawab - And Allah Knows Best
I hope it helps. Adios!
[This message has been edited by Pristine (edited October 31, 2000).]
[quote]
Originally posted by khan_sahib:
My serious question is do you think these things make us Kafir??
[/quote]
Are you one?
**bralvis are very nice muslim brothers. They are one of the many types of sunni muslims. To call any bralvi or sunni or ahlesunnah or any other muslim a kafir is a sin.
May Allah have mercy on us!
These wahabi mullahs have alot of spare time, thats why they keep calling everybody else a kafir except people who follow abdul wahab or saudi clowns (king fahad and family). Bralevis are the true ahle sunnah wal jamaat. Saudi backed wahabis are trying their best to take control of mosques that were originally built by khoon paseena (hard work) of dedicated bralevi sunni muslims in pakistan. Bralevi muslims were the most active ones in the creation of Pakistan.
**
[This message has been edited by Cool Guy (edited November 02, 2000).]
Cool Guy, they maybe nice “PEOPLE” but worshiping graves and giving out “giyaarveen” sharifs on the name of some dead person. That does nto make a good muslim. That is called shirk and Allah has forbidden has NOT do associate any one with him and not to creat non-sense in religion.
Hey, cool guy do you know anything about wahabis and what they follow? Or just trying to make false assumptions about them? They follow authentic Quran and SUNNAH(you dont believe in hadiths of prophet, that is why its hard for you to handle such ideas).
[This message has been edited by The Watcher (edited November 02, 2000).]
[quote]
Originally posted by khan_sahib:
**Dear Guppos?
A lot of people in the subcontinent believes in lot of things which are not part of Islam. Some of them are so strange that it become difficult to distinguis between muslim and non muslims. I know my maternal grand mother used to do some nyaz nazr which I never understood why? My serious question is do you think these things make us Kafir??**
[/quote]
**Khan_Sahib
Refrain from passing a judgement PLEASE.
Bida'a, Shirk, Kufr are different terminologies. One leads to the other. It is sure that they leads to Hell.
Who are we to judge some ones action.
Intention is the key word here. Ones action will be judged by his intention and only Allah knows the intention.**
**~~~Performace of good DEEDS avoids the evil ending.~~~
He, who advises for the GOOD, is similar (in rewards)to the doer of it.**
(Sahih Al-Jami 3797 & 3399 resp.)
[This message has been edited by Aapca (edited November 03, 2000).]
[quote]
Originally posted by Pristine:
** Are you one?
**
[/quote]
======
I don't know, I guess I have got few things from my mother side but nothing from my father side. I try to refrain from things which are not according to Quran and Sunnah.
Pristine Jinab,
I don't think you have done enough research on the topic. What I have heard is that there are some minor things which are minor if u don't understand them but some people believe that Barelvi movement was started by British government to weaken the Imaan of muslims in the sub continent.
If u understand the concept of bid'a and amendments then u should know that anyone who makes any changes is not to be liked by Allah.
Also, remember, you cannot argue that you were ignorant since u all have access to ready access to all information you require.
Ok, I never said I know EVERYTHING. I said, I did some research. So there is a conspiracy theory in all of the ills that befall muslim ummah. How would I know, huh? Next, there may be a theory that Islam was started by the jews to weaken the christian rulers in 610 AD. There was a theory going around that our masjid ka moulvi is a RAW agent, because the moulvi was attacking the qadianis in his friday khutba and many people thought he is creating division in muslims and creating fitna. Do you believe this too?
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/wink.gif
Hmmm… how can I disagree, huh, when you have provided such fantastic references to support your point?
Bid’a - good or bad - in Religious matters is not allowed in Islam. What is bid’a? If you can provide me one definition of bid’a on which all muslim scholars agree, then I will like you even more (I like you already).
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
Why not? We get information on stuff where we want to get information on. We read stuff we want to (except for our final exams in school). So, if I don’t know something, why shud I say “No, I am not ignorant, I know everything”. I’d just say, “This is what I know. Enlighten me, if you have more info”. If I don’t like a topic, I wouldn’t find out more, regardless of how much info you may make available to me.
To Watcher bhai jaan:
“Worshiping graves” - tauba tauba…bulkul kufr hai… right.
“Giving out giyarveen” - yeh ‘shirk’ hai? I see.
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/wink.gif
“Not to create non-sense in religion” - Ofcourse, don’t create ‘nonsense’, infact try not to create anything. The religion was complete 1500 years ago. We don’t need to create anything now, do we?
“Wahabis” - I am always amused when I hear this term. To what I know, no one likes to be called ‘Wahabi’. Not the ones I know, anwyay. They just call themselves ‘Good Muslims’ (bcz the rest are Bad Muslims, huh?). In Pakistan they sometimes, cal themselves “Ahle-Hadith”. But you may not know abt it…
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
Adios!
bralvis are true ahle sunnah wal jamaat (sunni), lead by people from sunni tehreek, who are truely working and dedicated for the survival of ahle sunnah wal jamaat. May Allah help them in their scared cause, Ameen. May Allah protect us all from the wahabi fitna!
[quote]
Originally posted by Cool Guy:
bralvis are true ahle sunnah wal jamaat (sunni), lead by people from sunni tehreek, who are truely working and dedicated for the survival of ahle sunnah wal jamaat. May Allah help them in their scared cause, Ameen. May Allah protect us all from the wahabi fitna!
[/quote]
Aameen!
You (Muslims) are the best nation ever raised among the mankind: (because) you
advocate righteousness and FORBID EVIL, and you believe in (one) GOD (ALLAH).
**Sitaaron Pay Jo Daltay Hain Kamand!**
Shaheen=An Eagle or A Flacon!
How come people come up with the idea that Shaheen is a "gal"????
Sure summa ameen!
Man, wahabis make fun of these dedicated ahle sunnah from bralvi sect when these devotees cry and tears fall out of their eyes while hearing name of Prophet (s.a.w.w). I feel terrible about it. These bralvis are the true ahle sunnah wal jamaat (sunni) and shias have a very good understanding of their faith and dedication. These bralvis were the most active in creation of Pakistan.
bralvis are the “guys from medina”
wahabis are the “girls from quresh”
shias are the “guys from karbala”
Coolguy, are you a kufi?
*V~V~V*He came, He saw, He conquered*V~V~V*
----*Priest-OF- Painful Truth*----
these wahabis dont have anything else other than issuing fatwas against anybody who disagrees with them and warn them about wrongdoings. These wahabis should first look in the mirror and ask themsleves the question are they kafir? before giving fatwas against ahle sunnah wal jamaat (bralvis) or shias!
watcher kiddo,
are you najadi?
just wondering
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/wink.gif
Hum husseini hain dunya mein phailay huay!
<A HREF="http://www.shia.org/mehdi.htmlhttp://www.al-shia.com/html/eng/index.htm
Coolguy, I am a Muslim. What are you, shia? Ok. good for you dear.
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/biggrin.gif
V~V~VHe came, He saw, He conqueredV~V~V**
----*Priest-OF- Painful Truth*----
sheeraz dear,
yeh wahabi har jaga shikast khatey ja rahey hein. let them be more jealous. i like it
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
ahle sunnah brothers are also aware of this wahabi fitna and ahle sunnah also know the facts of karbala, thats why these wahabis are soscared to death
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
Hum husseini hain dunya mein phailay huay!
URL=http://al-islam.org/peshawar/toc.html URL=http://www.al-islam.org/short/Karbala.htm URL=http://www.al-shia.com/html/eng/index.htm URL=http://www.al-shia.com/html/eng/index.htmI am a Muslim
take it easy sir
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
Your actions are NOT in concurrence with your words watcher kiddo, i really feel sorry for you!
I wish you could start acting like an “adult Muslim” from now on