Yahudi, I'm curious, which country are you from and what religion do you practice? I just want to know for my sake.
(Dear Imdad, I am not a patriot and do not practice any religion. I am always curious when people kill each other, for any reasons. But when a religion inspires for killings, it is the worst. We can fight a political thought however dangerous it is, but we are handicapped when a religion makes ground for inspirations.)
Islam divides the people into Muslims and disbelievers. There is no such term like, true Muslim or false Muslim in Quran. (for Mr Houston_kah_Don)
You can make hrs of speeches of peace, submission, Islam. But have no courage to reply a simple question?
So, my friends, let us decide, who is Bin Laden? Muslim or disbeliever?
As far as he believes what is required of a Muslim, he is a Muslim. If he has erred that doesn’t make him a non-Muslim as you seem to be. Every Muslim will have to account for his/her actions.
Now you tell me if Sharon is a good Yahudi or not.
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Originally posted by yahudi: *
**So, my friends, let us decide, who is Bin Laden? Muslim or disbeliever?
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*
Why don't we leave that up to God and worry about the 567,383,957,384,739 other problems we have to worry about in this damn world. What is your problem, Yahudi? Why don't you just come out and say you hate Muslims? Just say it very openly and clearly. At least you will not be hiding behind glorified semantics.
Thanks, I got the answer.
If I had asked the status of Sharon, Bush or Modi, the answer could be straightforward that they are ‘kufrs’ and will go to hell.
But in case of Bin Laden, you people are trailing. Islam makes you coward. May what come you have to defend him. This is the thesis of Islam.
So, next time when you shout that Islam is a religion of peace, think of Bin Laden, and mind it, that Islam wants you to protect him, defend him.
Nadia, pls change your language, I challenge Islam, to hate someone is your problem, not mine. I am not confused between believers and disbelievers.
With best rgds.
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Islam divides the people into Muslims and disbelievers. There is no such term like, true Muslim or false Muslim in Quran. (for Mr Houston_kah_Don)
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Yahudi.... The thing is I am not a scholar to give speeches...or solve religous matters or give such declarations...but raised in a muslims family and from what I have been taught about Islam...Islam never supports terrorism.... To me if he does terrorist activities in the name of Islam...then I won't call him a true muslim but probably a person who is spreading his terrorism or propoganda in the name of Islam.... you are smart to judge what does that make him.... If he was a muslim...he won't support terrorist activities...and if he did he should have guts to come forward and accept his deeds rather then be a coward hiding in mountains when rest of innocent civilians in Afghanistan or muslims over the world suffer.
But the question is do they have any solid prove..that he was behind september 11 attach or is it still a suspicion?
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*Originally posted by yahudi: *
So, next time when you shout that Islam is a religion of peace, think of Bin Laden, and mind it, that Islam wants you to protect him, defend him.
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If its true that he is behind September 11 attacks and don't even have guts to accept his own deeds...then why would Islam want us to protect such a person... Its not only christians or jews who got killed on 9/11 but muslims were also the victims of such terrorist attacks... and why would we protect a person who would kills so many innocent lives???
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Originally posted by Seminole: *
This pastor *is an idiot and is doing a diservice to God and his followers with such messages. But a couple of corrections to this thread:
1. Church attendence in the US is between 30%-40%, not 1%.
2. Until this guy advocates the killing of Muslims he cannot be compared to bin Laden.
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If Muslims were invading the US or Europe then the preachers would be advocating the killing of Muslims too .
So your comment is also in a wrong context.
Case in point Israel being supported by US to kill Muslims for 50 years.
So yes he can be compared to Bin Laden. Most muslims do not agree with what happened on 9/11 anyway. And neither is there any proof as of yet.
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*Originally posted by fayax: *
If Muslims were invading the US or Europe then the preachers would be advocating the killing of Muslims too .
So your comment is also in a wrong context.
Case in point Israel being supported by US to kill Muslims for 50 years.
So yes he can be compared to Bin Laden. Most muslims do not agree with what happened on 9/11 anyway. And neither is there any proof as of yet.
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OBL and his fatwas were issued long before the invasions of Afghanistan or Iraq. And Israel isn't being supported by US to kill Muslims, but to keep Israelis alive. As far as the proof of 9/11, anyone who denies OBL's culpability is in denial.
Yahudi the way it works is if a person commit a good deed he is rewarded and if he commits a sin he is going to be punished by Allah and if Osma was behind sepetember 11 he committed a real big sin and needs to be punished... and If he did it... I wouldnt even want to call such a coward muslim..... but Its Allah who gives the rewards of deeds and sins e personally if even I call him a kaffir won't make a difference... he can still use the veil of Islam and carry his terrorist act giving the religon a bad name...... which are not the true teachings of Islam.
but the question is there a definite prove yet... Like Iraq..its been months now but have we found any weapon of mass distruction yet????
Personally I am against any terrorist activity.... because to me it doesnt represent true islam.....
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*Originally posted by Nadia_H: *
Sorry, but why does that matter what we call them? We can call this pastor whatever our heart desires, point is that is not going to change his perceptions of Islam and/or make him feel that the contents of the sign are spreading hatred.
Maybe to some, he is a terrorist. IMHO, i could very well be absolutely wrong but i think the more important issue is more along the lines of why he thinks that way and what should be done in that city to initiate some interfaith dialogue.
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Absolutely a wonderful thought to create interfaith dialogue.
This christian pastor is the = to any muslim cleric that spreads messages of hatred and intolerance and deserves zero respect.
Definately time to abolish the idea that ones religion is responsible for immoral or criminal behavior, be it Christain, Jewish or Muslim.
Goodness gracious, the German people weren't condemned for religious reasons, yet their elected Nazi government massacered Jews for being Jews.
Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. -Blaise Pascal
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Originally posted by underthedome: *
**Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. -Blaise Pascal
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So true.
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*Originally posted by yahudi: *
In what category you may put up Bin Laden? Muslim or Kufr?
It’s a direct question to the scholars/ defenders of Islam.
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what do u think Yahudi?...u r making ur point clear? or u r creating some sort of serious atmosphere about comparing religions.....only asking questions is not the way to debate.....sorry buddy but i think u r ruining ur time here (and of many others too )
And had We willed, We would surely have elevated him therewith but he clung to the earth and followed his own vain desire. So his description is the description of a dog: if you drive him away, he lolls his tongue out, or if you leave him alone, he (still) lolls his tongue out. Such is the description of the people who reject Our Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.). So relate the stories, perhaps they may reflect. (7:176)
Pls help me to understand the given verse, thru whatever possible context. As for me it is difficult to understand why Allah has used such an abusive language.
(Ps, Specialist, I challenge the customary theses of Muslims.)
Mr. Yahudi,
This verse depicts the people who are deeply into material things and have a great love of money. The word 'Yalhath' was used which is derived from Lahatha which means, his breath rose on account of fatigue or weariness. This signifies whether or not such a one is asked to make sacrifices in the cause of religion, he seems to be always panting like a thirstly dog, as if the ever-increasing burden of sacrifices is leaving him completely exhausted.
Now what I can't understand is your objection to this word. Do you want Allah not to use the word 'dog' in order not to displease the people who are not wiling to do any kind of sacrifice or do you want Allah to be 'Politicaly correct'.
Thanks, fatehahmad, for a nice reply. May be you will help me a little further.
If one rejects the Ayats, rejects the thesis of any angel appearance and dictating a holy book to a prophet, but lives a natural, unbiased life, does not fall into ‘material’ oblivion…in what category he falls…. in the category of a disbeliever equivalent to a dog or a believer.
By the way such description (verses) you may find in most of the religious books, Gita, or Bible, (without maligning dog), I assure you that Quran is not the first.
May be, you know that dog is considered friend of man in civilized countries.
Mr. Yahudi:
Holy Quran is considered as the Holy book from Allah and Muhammad (peace be upon him) is considered a prophet of Allah. Now if somebody rejects Holy Quran as a book of Allah and Muhammad as the prophet of Allah, then what does that make him? A non-believer or in other words a disbeliever because he doesn't believe in a book of Allah and also doesn't believe in a prophet of Allah.
Can we consider a person who is repeatedly invited toward the true book from Allah and to accept the true prophet of Allah and he still rejects the book and the prophet, an unbiased one?
Quoting Yahudi:
"May be, you know that dog is considered friend of man in civilized countries."
Calling some one DOG in the 'civilised countries' is to insult him/her. You would be upset if called you a dog, wouldn't you? You will never take it to be a compliment.