AHMADIS/QADYANIS ARE NOT MUSLIMS!

Let me tell you who is muslim and who is not...according to hadith and quran ahmadies and qadiyanis are not muslims...
Anyone who calls him or her self muslims should obey hadity and quran...live his life as prophet and his companions did if you say kalma and do no do what is in quran and hadith you are not muslims no matter you say kalma 1000 timess....if a person follows quran and hadith he is a muslim no matter if he is called ahmadi or sunii...you people need to grow up and take your self out of this sects division which will get you in hell!!!

Jaawan


Till next time**Keep_It_Simple_Stupid**©

Jaawan Salaam:

Kalimah Radde-Kufr
Oh Allah! I seek protection in You from that I should join any partner with You knowingly. I seek Your forgiveness from that which I do not know. I repent from ignorance. I free myself from disbelief and from joining partners with You and I (free myself from) all sins. I submit to Your will. I believe and I declare: There is none worthy of worship besides Allah and Muhammad (Sallallahu alayhi wasallam) is the messenger of Allah.

Abrogation

Islaam abrogates all the previous religions, Christianity and Judaism included. And hence if the Jews and Christians do not accept Islam, they are the losers. Whatever good deeds they have will be scattered like dust on the Day of Judgement. We will only quote the Islamic position is on this issue. In The Reliance Of The Traveller we read:

Previously revealed religions were valid in their own eras, as is attested by many verses of the Noble Qura’an (Koran), but were abrogated by the universal message of Islaam, as is equally attested to by many verses of the Noble Qura’an (Koran). Both points are worthy of attention for English-speaking Muslims, who are occasionally exposed to erroneous theories advanced by some teachers and Koran translators affirming these religions' validity but denying not mentioning their abrogation, or that is unbelief (kufr) to hold that the remnant cults now bearing the names of formerly valid religions, such as "Christianity" or "Judaism", are acceptable to Allah Most High after He sent the final Messenger (Allah bless him give him peace) to the entire world. This is a matter over which there is no disagreement among Islamic scholars....
Hadeeth (Agreed upon)!
Muhammad Ibn al-Alâ' told us that Ibn Numayr reported from Mujâlid from Ibn Aamir from Jâbir that Umar Ibn al-Khattâb brought a copy of the Torah to the Prophet(P) and said: "O Apostle of God, this is a copy of the Torah." But [the Prophet] kept silent. Then Umar started reading and the face of the Prophet kept changing. So, Abu Bakr interrupted him violently: "Don't you see the face of the Prophet(P)?" Umar looked at the Prophet's face and said "May God preserve me from His anger and from the anger of his Apostle(P), we accepted God as Lord and Islâm as religion and Muhammad as prophet." Then the Prophet(P) said:** "By the One Who owns Muhammad's soul, if Moses(P) appeared to you and you followed him and left me, you would go astray from the right path and if he were alive and reached [the time of] my prophethood he would have followed me. "**

Please note that there is no disagreement among the Islamic scholars concerning the abrogation of previous religions like Judaism and Christian and that believing in their validity is a form of kufr.

Salvation in Islaam

Islaamic concept of salvation is not based upon good deeds, but is based primarily upon faith. In the dozens of times Allah (SWT) talks in the Quran about salvation, He always states, "Those who believe and do good deeds." Belief is always mentioned before deeds or works. When one converts to Islam, one does not do it by doing some good work but rather through realizing and believing that there is but one God and Muhammed (SAW) is his last messenger. Non-Muslims may perform good works as well, but what sets them apart from Muslims is their lack of IMAAN, or belief. The reason that the good works of the non-believers are worthless in the hereafter is because of their disbelief. Unless a person's Imaan or aqeedah is not correct, all his good deeds are worthless.
One of the more popular Hadith of the Prophet (SAW) states, "All actions are based upon intentions," implying that the purpose, intent, or Imaan behind your action is what you get rewarded for; the actual action is really a consequence of the belief.
Another Hadith states, "A man came to the Prophet (SAW) and asked, 'When will the Day of Judgment come?' The Prophet (SAW) replied, 'What have you prepared for the judgment day that you are so concerned for it?' He replied,** 'I do not have any good deeds in my account, but I do have one thing: I love Allah and His Messenger (SAW).'* The Prophet (SAW) then said, 'In that case, do not worry; you will be with those whom you love.'" (Agreed Upon).*** This Hadith also confirms the Islamic position of placing aqeedah and belief before actions. For example, Allah (SWT) says in various parts of the Quran, "The believers you will find praying..." He does not say the people who are praying are believers. It is the belief that brings about the action, but the converse is not always true. Another Hadith of the Prophet (SAW) states, "Unless one loves Allah and Allah's Messenger more than one's own self his Imaan is not complete."

Amazing Facts about Islaam
Questions for Non-Muslims

The pursuit of knowledge is a
divinecommandment for every Muslim!

Did God declare/make your religion (Christianity/Judaism) perfect. Does the names of "Christianity" and "Judaism" have divine inspiration. Can you show me a single verse to that effect from your bible (OT & NT)? NO, there is none.

BUT GOD DECLARED ISLAAM THE PERFECT RELIGION:
Noble Qur’aan 5:3! … This day, I have perfected your religion for you, completed My Favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islâam as your religion…

Did God promise to guard your bible from corruption, can you show me a single verse to this effect? NO, there is none.
BUT GOD PROMISED AND HAS BEEN PROTECTING NOBLE QURAN:
Noble Quran 15:9! Verily We: It is We Who have sent down the Dhikr (i.e. the Qur'ân) and surely, We will guard it (from corruption)].

Did God say the religion of God is Christianity/Judaism, can you show me a single verse to this effect? NO, there is none.
BUT GOD DECLARED THE RELIGION OF GOD (ALLAH) IS ISLAAM:
Noble Quran 3:19! Truly, the religion with Allâh is Islâam. Those who were given the Scripture (Jews and Christians) did not differ except, out of mutual jealousy, after knowledge had come to them. And whoever disbelieves in the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, signs, revelations, etc.) of Allâh, then surely, Allâh is Swift in calling to account.
Noble Quran 5:3! … This day, I have perfected your religion for you, completed My Favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islâam as your religion…

Does the name(s) "Christian/Jew" have divine inspiration? NO, there is none.
BUT NAME "MUSLIM" HAS DIVINE INSPIRATION:
Noble Quran 3:64! Say (O Muhammad SAW): "O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians): Come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but Allâh, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides Allâh]. Then, if they turn away, say: "Bear witness that we are "Muslims."

That is why Islaam is a perfect religion and Christianity/Judaism are not NOT.

That is why Noble Quraan is a perfect book guarded and protected by God Almighty Himself since its revelation. Contrary to that bible (OT&NT) are corrupted and adulterated.

And whoever seeks a religion other than Islâm, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers]. Noble Qura’an 3:85

One learned man is harder on the devil
than a thousand ignorant worshippers!


Irrefragable
Islaam Is The *ONLY Solution! *****And whoever seeks a religion other than Islâm, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers]. Noble Quran 3:85*

Dear outlaw,

I find your expression 'loosers and sellers like yourself' highly debatable, but in the end I'm sure I will 'lose' the debate so why bother?

And yes that was a joke, and yes I got a distasteful sense of humor (Althoug I'm working on improving that by reading hardcore mullah literature these days) - However, my views on Kashmir 'jihad' will remain unchanged and it will take a lot more than your manipulated faith to change that.

Oh God ,
Where have you grown up?You really react like child!your sense of humour is stupid!

Roman,
I don't see any obligation to convince you on jehad in Kashmir, I found your comments insulting to the cause in Kashmir , therefore I reatialated and stand-by my earlier comments.
I suggest that stop waisting time in reading hardcore 'mullah literature', that might not do you any good; seek guidance in Quran and Sunnah.
About my faith, well no denial , I am a sinner..however, I still yearn to be on the path of righteousness.
May Allah show us all the right path.

[This message has been edited by outlaw (edited March 31, 2000).]

[quote]
Originally posted by Roman:
**Dear outlaw,

I find your expression 'loosers and sellers like yourself' highly debatable, but in the end I'm sure I will 'lose' the debate so why bother?

And yes that was a joke, and yes I got a distasteful sense of humor (Althoug I'm working on improving that by reading hardcore mullah literature these days) - However, my views on Kashmir 'jihad' will remain unchanged and it will take a lot more than your manipulated faith to change that.**
[/quote]

You seems to be allergic of Jihad. What you suggest is the solution of Kashmir should be? By the way what is your faith and how would you define it?


Ghazi
Facts Are The Authority!

I'ld like to take you anytime for a hearty debate on jihad in kashmir...

Thanks for the temptation but I think that would be waste of time. Trust me, we can't convince eachother.

Ghazi,

Whatever the solution to Kashmir should be, the means to achieve it should be peaceful on both sides.

[quote]
Originally posted by Roman:
**>> I'ld like to take you anytime for a hearty debate on jihad in kashmir...

Thanks for the temptation but I think that would be waste of time. Trust me, we can't convince eachother.

Ghazi,

Whatever the solution to Kashmir should be, the means to achieve it should be peaceful on both sides.**
[/quote]

It is easier to say, but impossible to execute. By the way who will define peace/peaceful? Who will determine what is peaceful? Kashmir is all Muslim and has always been all Muslim, so where the other side or second side is coming from? Since when occupants who have occupied Kashmir for 50+ years and oppressors became a party in peace? Don't you think that it is people of Kashmir who will determine their fate, and they should? Who gives the right to others to make decisions for the people of Kashmir? What about all UN Resolutions? I don't see US is bombing India and Israel like Iraq to enforce the UN Resolutions. So why it is fair for one and foul for other?


Ghazi
Facts Are The Authority!

[This message has been edited by Ghazi (edited April 01, 2000).]

LEARN THE TRUTH ABOUT AHMADIS/QADYANIS!

On this forum a Qadyani/Ahmadi poster lied that their Kalma, Kaba and other belief system is same and they are not Kafir. Fact is that overwhelming presence of Kuffar on this forum is to mislead Muslims and Pakistani Muslims. To keep them occupy in non-sense and take advantage of their ignorance, if any.

These links will educate Muslims about the truth. Let us see who can refute the truth?
http://alhafeez.org/rashid/british-jewish/contents.htm
http://alhafeez.org/rashid/
http://www.irshad.org/idara/home.htm


Ghazi
Facts Are The Authority!

[This message has been edited by Ghazi (edited April 01, 2000).]

Muslims you must read this and follow these caoomands. Since you have Kuffar here who mock the Noble Quran. Their intentions are to insult and mock rather debate with reason and logic.

Noble Qur’aan 4:140!
And it has already been revealed to you in the Book (this Qur'ân) that when you hear the Verses of Allâh being denied and mocked at, then sit not with them, until they engage in a talk other than that; (but if you stayed with them) certainly in that case you would be like them. Surely, Allâh will collect the hypocrites and disbelievers all together in Hell,

Noble Qur’aan 6:68!
And when you (Muhammad SAW) see those who engage in a false conversation about Our Verses (of the Qur'ân) by mocking at them, stay away from them till they turn to another topic. And if Shaitân (Satan) causes you to forget, then after the remembrance sit not you in the company of those people who are the Zâlimûn (polytheists and wrong­doers, etc.).


Bubble Buster
"The true EVIL lies in IGNORANCE, not in suspicion."

yaar i hate reading long posts i hate it....can you just summerize it pleaseeeeeeeeeee

Jaawan


Till next time**Keep_It_Simple_Stupid**©

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Bubble Buster
"The true EVIL lies in IGNORANCE, not in suspicion."

[This message has been edited by Bubble Buster (edited April 01, 2000).]

Dear Ghazi,

I have a feeling that soon this thread will be moved to forum on Kashmir affairs but I would say a little on the topic anyway.

If you get into fanatic nitpicking of defining anything in this world, you won't even be able to decide what your name means, Peace is not even close.

However, for a reasonable simplicity's sake, I would say that any means that involve non-voilence, avoides killing of people on each sides, and re-examination of the situation in a non-egocentric (each sides again) manner would provide a very good start.

It should be a concurrent realization on the part of all sides involved, and I think it's about time that people should start looking at things differently and form their own unbiased opinions on the matter.

I understand that it is very easy to be provoked emotionally specially when it comes to religion, but who said it was going to be easy anyway? Most of the people aren't even aware of the challenge involved. Religious faith is important for people who follow religion, as long as it does not turn into an irrational zeal.

b}Peace and War in Islaam.**

Noble Quran 42-39-40-41-41! 39. And those who, when an oppressive wrong is done to them, they take revenge.
40. The recompense for an evil is an evil like thereof, but whoever forgives and makes reconciliation, his reward is due from Allâh. Verily, He likes not the Zâlimûn (oppressors, polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.).
41. And indeed whosoever takes revenge after he has suffered wrong, for such there is no way (of blame) against them.
42. The way (of blame) is only against those who oppress men and wrongly rebel in the earth, for such there will be a painful torment.

Noble Quran 47:35* *Do not beg for Peace*!Be not weary and faint-hearted crying for peace. When ye should be Uppermost: for Allah is with you and will never put you in loss for your (good) deeds.

Be brave...Noble Quran 4:104!And slacken not in following up the enemy: if ye are suffering hardships they are suffering similar hardships; but ye have hope from Allah while they have none. And Allah is full of knowledge and wisdom.


Ghazi
Facts Are The Authority!

Mr Buble
Sorry to say that You are also within those whose knoledge is just a couple of hundred of
books and some frantic mullah.For your Allah's sake get out of it.Or tell me the true definition of a muslim,and let me ask you are you a muslim too? And if your answer
is yes,then on what basis do you think that
you are a muslim.As I was reading this whole
topic I came to know that somebody has translated the holy of the holiest book"QURAN
I PAK".For Allah Mian Gee's sake stop this
act of kufar.Hazrat Umar (A.S.)and Hazrat
Abu Bakr(A.S.) ordered in a Fatva that anybody who doesn't have the knowledge of Arabic in Jahalat daur can not read the translated QURAN-I-PAK even if it is translated in Arabic.

Be not weary and faint-hearted crying for peace. When ye should be Uppermost: for Allah is with you and will never put you in loss for your (good) deeds.

FYI - I don't consider an out-of-context reference to a Quranic Aya as a logical argument.

FYI2 - If I am gonna change my view, I am gonna change them by using my own cognitive faculties, not by simply reading something and acting on it without any objective inquiry.

Enough said on the matter.

in my opinion ther is no use trying to debate with bubble guy. he is just trying to be rude and force his opinion on others.

[quote]
Originally posted by Roman:
**>> Be not weary and faint-hearted crying for peace. When ye should be Uppermost: for Allah is with you and will never put you in loss for your (good) deeds.

FYI - I don't consider an out-of-context reference to a Quranic Aya as a logical argument.

FYI2 - If I am gonna change my view, I am gonna change them by using my own cognitive faculties, not by simply reading something and acting on it without any objective inquiry.

Enough said on the matter.**
[/quote]

Frankly do we give a hoot, what you think or believe? Since when Kuffar like you or Asfia can dictate the terms. It is Muslims issue and cannot be settled without respecting our faith and family.


Bubble Buster
"The true EVIL lies in IGNORANCE, not in suspicion."

[quote]
Originally posted by Asfia:
*in my opinion ther is no use trying to debate with bubble guy. he is just trying to be rude and force his opinion on others. *
[/quote]

Please take a number and stand in the line to :)

KISSMASS!


Bubble Buster
"The true EVIL lies in IGNORANCE, not in suspicion."

[quote]
Originally posted by GUPORA:
Mr Buble
Sorry to say that You are also within those whose knoledge is just a couple of hundred of
books and some frantic mullah.For your Allah's sake get out of it.Or tell me the true definition of a muslim,and let me ask you are you a muslim too? And if your answer
is yes,then on what basis do you think that
you are a muslim.As I was reading this whole
topic I came to know that somebody has translated the holy of the holiest book"QURAN
I PAK".For Allah Mian Gee's sake stop this
act of kufar.Hazrat Umar (A.S.)and Hazrat
Abu Bakr(A.S.) ordered in a Fatva that anybody who doesn't have the knowledge of Arabic in Jahalat daur can not read the translated QURAN-I-PAK even if it is translated in Arabic.

[/quote]

Wow, how you became what you are? By the way you just gave a headache to my spell and grammar checker.
Finish the high school first, than we will talk.


Bubble Buster
"The true EVIL lies in IGNORANCE, not in suspicion."