Afghan Christian convert could face death

[Light_Bearer]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Attia

That guys is already going to hell and facing worst azab.. so wat is the point of hurting him right now

Is it your opinion or wish or faith?

can you prove it outside of books of faith.

[Rahul67]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

Attia, I just hope that you aren't in my Paros......... You are dangerous.......

What's happening is wrong, and I am no expert, but sure Islam can't be preaching this.
If Islam allows this, than may be the impression created about this being hardliners religion is correct.
Look at the point made by PakPatriot, a very valid point...

[Khehkeshan]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

You can remove the Taliban from Afghanistan, but you can't remove the jihalat.

[Rahul67]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

I don't see usual tough talkers in this thread and pseudo preachers of Islam in this thread till now, I would have loved to know those views as well..
I can name some of them lets forget it for time being......

[Sadiyah]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

From what I’ve learned, the punishment for apostasy in Islam is capital punishment.

In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.

Dear questioner! Thank you very much for this question that reflects deep insight and true search for knowledge. May Allah grant you success in this life and the Hereafter.

It goes without saying that, leaving Islam is the ugliest and the worst form of disbelief (kufr) in Almighty Allah. It is technically called ridda (apostasy from Islam), and someone who leaves Islam is called a murtadd (apostate).

The Qur’an makes it clear that the one who leaves Islam, hinders people from the path of Allah and then dies as such will be a loser on the Day of Judgment. His eternal abode will be Hell, where he/she will suffer severe torture and endless chastisement. Allah will not forgive him/her, nor will any of his/her good deeds be accepted from him/her. Allah Almighty says: (Lo! Those who disbelieve and turn from the way of Allah and then die disbelievers, Allah surely will not pardon them.) (Muhammad 47: 34)

Also, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) is reported to have said: "The blood of a Muslim who testifies that there is no god but Allah and that I am the Messenger of Allah is not lawful to shed unless he be one of three: a married adulterer, someone killed in retaliation for killing another, or someone who abandons his religion and the Muslim community.‘’

The prescribed punishment for a murtadd:

If a sane person who has reached puberty voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be punished.‏ In such a case, it is obligatory for the caliph (or his representative) to ask him to repent and return to Islam. If he does, it is accepted from him, but if he refuses, he is immediately killed.‏

No one besides the caliph or his representative may kill the apostate. If someone else kills him, the killer is disciplined (for arrogating the caliph’s prerogative and encroaching upon his rights, as this is one of his duties).

There is no blood money for killing an apostate (or any expiation). If he apostatizes from Islam and returns several times, his return to Islam, which occurs when he states the two Testifications of Faith, is accepted from him, although he is disciplined.

If a spouse in a consummated marriage apostatizes from Islam, the couple are separated for a waiting period (`iddah) consisting of three intervals between menstrual cycles. If the spouse returns to Islam before the waiting period ends, the marriage is not annulled but is considered to have continued the whole time.

(Based on 'The Reliance of the Traveler, by Ahmad Ibn Naqib Al-Misri, with some amendments.)

In addressing the issue of apostasy it is important to keep in mind the time, circumstances and the conditions that existed at the time of a particular ruling or judgment. Most modern governments do not apply Shari`ah law. However, this does not justify individuals taking it upon themselves to kill people if they apostatize from Islam. If this were to happen, such reckless action would only lead to a vicious circle of murder and homicide in which case a great deal of innocent people would be injured. As it stands presently, the means for dealing with apostasy are appropriate. Muslims should know that Almighty Allah has promised the apostate a severe punishment in this life, and an even greater punishment in the next life.

Ref: Apostasy: Definition & Ruling

[Lajawab]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

I don’t get it…

Why is this such a big deal?

When the Muslims of Kosova and Bosnia were slaughtered in the thousands, I didn;t hear an uproar…

Entire cities, villages and towns were laid to waste by the state machinery in the hands of Serbian Christians, why was there no outcry?

Why is there no outcry when thousands are being butchered in Iraq?

Yet, since we have hooked ourselves something which in some possible angle or way might even slightly and remotely make Islam to be seen in a negative light, we have to blow it out of proportion…

Is anyone seeing what’s going on in Iraq? How many babies, kids, women and elderly are being slaughtered by rampant bombings…Is anyone making an issue out of that? Or is it Islam’s lack of a good publicity department or a public relations firm?

But no, democracy is the saviour of mankind because despite having killed more people since Nazism, it boasts a great PR backing…And no doubt, the more people it kills, the better people will seem to like it, except who can see through the fog…

The rule of apostasy has many forms including that of tyrrany, treason and treachery…A man not faithful to Allah :swt: after becoming a Muslim can in no way be faithful to those he professed to be of the same faith in…If a married person who is unfaithful to his partner is deemed punishable by death then it follows that a person unfaithful to his faith is to be punished by death…

In both cases, the perpetrator has the means and the mindset to corrupt society based on certain principles…

May Allah :swt: save us from the blight of doubt in our faith, Ameen…

[Princess_Fiona]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@PaKpatriot1

What about the Christians converting to Islam? Dont Christians have a right to do the same to those converts?

Iam not sure about christian religion but in islam converting from muslim to any other religion is the worst thing to do... it will be same as shirk, cause u are turning away from Allah (swt) and nauzbillah accepting that there is someone else better then Allah (swt)
Now should the person be punished right now.. iam not sure wat my opinion would be.. But it is not about freedom of religion as i mentioned before.. it would set an example for those christian ppl who try to convert muslim in to christanity :)
You might not know the background but that guy used to get food from a christian organization where they would give away food with flyers about christian religion... so in a way it is like marketting..
About ur question.. Believe me... those people are not going to kill him.. If it was about death penalty then it would be very easy to ask someone to just shoot him right away.. it is just that they want to show christain ppl tat what might happen if they try to convince a muslim to convert...
But for now... **They are not going to give him death penalty.. **His family already disowned him, no one is going to give him a job, food ,shelter, money or any kinda help... So i mean it is better to die rather then living in a country where everyone would hate u .....

[Princess_Fiona]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Light Bearer

Is it your opinion or wish or faith?

can you prove it outside of books of faith.

why should i try to prove it outside the book of faith? A person who doesn’t have faith is like they are living with no feelings.. Instead of you telling me that please try to have faith and believe in Allah.. you are telling me to leave faith and then talk
OK can u please try to prove it outside of books of faith? lemme see wat you explaination will be

[antiobl]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Attia

.............. So i mean **it is better to die rather then living **in a country where everyone would hate u .....

Huh! It is amusing when ABCDs pass heartless judgments like these. How come most of you moved to US or UK "instead of dying back home?

@Attia

.....You might not know the background but that guy used to get food from a christian organization ......

Look no body converts because of food. Thousands others were "fed" by Pakistan and they still hate Pakistan.

Thousand of Somalis were fed by the blue hat Pakistanis, and they still butchered 27 Pakistani soldiers.

Wish it was that easy. We must accept that the guy truly believes Hazrat Isas Elaih-e-Salaam’s message is better than what he got about Islam from the local Pushtoon Mullah.

Instead of "fixing" our Mullahs we are punishing the guys who run from the Mullahs. Strange really strange.

[Princess_Fiona]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Rahul67

Attia, I just hope that you aren't in my Paros......... You are dangerous.......

What's happening is wrong, and I am no expert, but sure Islam can't be preaching this. If Islam allows this, than may be the impression created about this being hardliners religion is correct. Look at the point made by PakPatriot, a very valid point...

First of all.. I am not dangerous at all but a simple human with a heart like u :)

second of all.. that means that u are not shocked or angry that a muslim left ur religion .. tat a muslim is turning away from Allah (swt) accepting someone else being greater then him?
So that means it didn't effect u in any way if a person disrespects ur religion.. cause in a way it is like disrespecting islam :)

[Princess_Fiona]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@antiobl

Huh! It is amusing when ABCDs pass heartless judgments like these. How come most of you moved to US or UK "instead of dying back home?

Look no body converts because of food. Thousands others were "fed" by Pakistan and they still hate Pakistan.

Thousand of Somalis were fed by the blue hat Pakistanis, and they still butchered 27 Pakistani soldiers.

Wish it was that easy. We must accept that the guy truly believes Hazrat Isas Elaih-e-Salaam’s message is better than what he got about Islam from the local Pushtoon Mullah.

Instead of "fixing" our Mullahs we are punishing the guys who run from the Mullahs. Strange really strange.

If i see that the country iam living in is hating me.. i would absolutly wanna die back home.. but it is not the case :)
I accept ur opinion about mullahs.. but now that would be like generalizing.. not all mollahs are bad ..
As i said before.. they aren't to going to give him death penalty but just to set an example ... and personally i wouldn't want him to die as well....

[analyze_it]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

[quote="Attia
as i mentioned before.. it would set an example for those christian ppl who try to convert muslim in to christanity

i mean it is better to die rather then living in a country where everyone would hate u …[/QUOTE"]

---

How about killing a few Tableeghis in western countries . or for that matter anywhere … it would set an example for thos Islamic ppl who try to convert nonmuslims into Islam.

What an explanation, if the adultery is punishable by death so the apostasy should be punishable by death and so forth. No wonder about the label of barabarism.

[Princess_Fiona]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

^ we are talking about islamic rules not christain rules.. If u entered islam, you can't leave it while i heard in other religions u can....it doesnt matter if a non-muslim converts to islam or no but it does matter if a muslim converts to other religion... u can call me mean but tat is wat i think.... and plus iam giving a very general opinion.... anyone can have any different view.. :)

[Khehkeshan]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

This is why I believe in secularism. Inshallah it will come to both Afghanistan and Pakistan soon. Killing someone because they now believe something else is the most inhuman thing to do.

[Rahul67]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Attia

^ we are talking about islamic rules not christain rules.. If u entered islam, you can't leave it while i heard in other religions u can....it doesnt matter if a non-muslim converts to islam or no but it does matter if a muslim converts to other religion... u can call me mean but tat is wat i think.... and plus iam giving a very general opinion.... anyone can have any different view.. :)

That's exactly gives you label of hardliners and fanatics, since you in name of religion / Islam are creating two very different set of rules for same individual for same offence..
Anyway, that's the crux of issue why Islam is going through so much pain and creating so much pain for everybody..
I hope as this news grows, there would be a worldwide uproar against it within Muslims to give a message that its not what Quaran preaches, Otherwise it just strengthens the hands of hardliners in other countries and religion to preach against Islam

[Code_Red]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

^ yes it is, That is why it is forbidden in quran to kill an apostate, murtid ...

[quote]

I hope as this news grows, there would be a worldwide uproar against it within Muslims to give a message that its not what Quaran preaches, Otherwise it just strengthens the hands of hardliners in other countries and religion to preach against Islam
[/quote]

Sadiyah, attia , Lajawab !

Do you know the ayat of quran which sanctions muslim govt to kill a murtid ( a person who converts from islam to other religion and lives peacefully ) ?

[Lajawab]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Code_Red

^ yes it is, That is why it is forbidden in quran

Sadiyah, attia , Lajawab !

Do you know the ayat of quran which sanctions muslim govt to kill a murtid ( a person who converts from islam to other religion and lives peacefully ) ?

Do you know an Ayah which tells you how to pray? Should we give it up since it doesn’t?

[system]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Attia

^ we are talking about islamic rules not christain rules.. If u entered islam, you can’t leave it while i heard in other religions u can…it doesnt matter if a non-muslim converts to islam or no but it does matter if a muslim converts to other religion… u can call me mean but tat is wat i think… and plus iam giving a very general opinion… anyone can have any different view..

So Islam is sorta like an LA street Gang… Anyone can enter, but no one leaves!

[Code_Red]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Lajawab

Do you know an Ayah which tells you how to pray? Should we give it up since it doesn't?

You are using wrong analogy here ...

Prayers are obligation on muslims. It is mentioned in quran in a number of places(alongwith its different components), so there is no contradiction

It is a very common rule in Islam that if you need guidance regarding any issue, you look in the holy Quran and if you do not find anything in the holy quran then you look in hadees and sunnah and then ijtehaad.

Are you aware that the issue of apostasy is discussed in quran at number of places ?? Please find it and slap in on my face and prove me wrong ! simple

[quote]

^ yes it is, That is why it is forbidden in quran to kill an apostate, murtid ...

[/quote]

^^ this is a strong statement, and it totally contradict general understanding among muslims ...
simply quote the quranic verse from which you derive that Islamic punishment of apostasy is capital punishment ???

[system]

Re: Afghan Christian convert could face death

@Attia

Iam not sure about christian religion but in islam converting from muslim to any other religion is the worst thing to do… it will be same as shirk, cause u are turning away from Allah (swt) and nauzbillah accepting that there is someone else better then Allah (swt)
Now should the person be punished right now.. iam not sure wat my opinion would be.. But it is not about freedom of religion as i mentioned before.. it would set an example for those christian ppl who try to convert muslim in to christanity
You might not know the background but that guy used to get food from a christian organization where they would give away food with flyers about christian religion… so in a way it is like marketting..
About ur question.. Believe me… those people are not going to kill him.. If it was about death penalty then it would be very easy to ask someone to just shoot him right away.. it is just that they want to show christain ppl tat what might happen if they try to convince a muslim to convert…
But for now… **They are not going to give him death penalty.. **His family already disowned him, no one is going to give him a job, food ,shelter, money or any kinda help… So i mean it is better to die rather then living in a country where everyone would hate u …

Yeah, but marketing your religion happens everywhere, including among Muslims… It happens ALL the time in Pakistan, and yet when a Hindu or Christian is converted to Islam, its mashallah and Jazak’allahs all around… But if its the other way around, then an example must be made… Do you see the hypocricy in that?