Question 1 : Kia vaseelay key zaryay dua mangna jaeez hay. For example main kisi pir / or even Muhammed (PBUH) key mazar per ja ker unhain vaseela bana ker Allah say mangoon, kia yeh jaeez hay ?
Question 2 : Kia Aurtoon ka mazaroon per jana jaeez hay ??
If you post in English you can have my reply.
Farouq Taj.
Edited portion:
I think I've managed to decipher your post.
Is the first question about Tawassul ?
Is the second regarding visiting graves ?
[This message has been edited by farouq_taj (edited 09-21-98).]
Niaz,
Prayer is forbidden in two places only. The rest of the world is a mosque according to hadith.
The first place is the Restroom
The second place is the graveyard.
So it is Haram according to Islamic logic to go and pray at a Mazar which is equal to a grave yard.
About women visiting Mazars. I am not sure about that one. These are intresting topics.
SuperMan
Salam
Farooq : The first one is regarding pray (dua) , can we ask for something on a graveyard of a saint of prophet ??
Second is are women allowed to go to graveyards ??
Jazakumullah khair ya superman
Assalam O Alaikum
Salam Niaz:
1) This is a branch of Islamic theology called Tawassul. You won't find a simple answer in just one post.
Some schools of fiqh recommend it (Brelvi, Sufi) others consider it haram (Salafi and Wahabbi).
There is plenty of literature on this and I suggest you read both sides to get a fair picture.
2) Again this depends on which school of fiqh you follow and the issues are similiar to Tawassul.
Farouq Taj.
Assalam O Alaikum
What does islam say about this, not the brelvis, sufis, or wahabis.
Assalam O Alaikum.
Niaz,
You cannot ignore the different schools of fiqh.
There is no such thing as a clean and perfect view of Islam where there are no differences of opinion.
The questions you've asked are complex and Alims far better qualified than you or I who have spent a lifetime studying have tried answering them. Please follow my advice and read some literature. Find out what Ibn Tamiyah, Imam Gazzali, Ibn Arabi etc have to
say about Tawassul.
Farouq Taj.
This is all over the hadith that going of women to mazaroon or graves is haram! You are not soppose to build Mazares.
Wa-salam
Answer to Your First Question,
This pertains to culture of people rather than to religion. Millions and Millions of people pay homage to Data Sahib in Lahore , Lal Shahbaz Qalandar in Sehwan and other places. People have blind faith in these Buzrigs. When unfortunate people do not find any way out for their miseries, these Buzrigs are only their hope. I do not think they are doing any sin by offering paryers. Yes it is a sin to be a corrupt, commit fornication, kill innocent people, spread hatred, etc. Even such person offers five time prayers in a mosque is A GREAT MUNAFIQ and consequently A GREAT SINNER.
Question 2.
No there is no harm in going to graves by women. I have seen thousands of women in Masjide Nabawee offering prayers at ‘Roza-e-Mubarak of Prophet Muhammad PBUH. As far the intention is to offer prayers, there is no bar for women to go to graves of dear ones.
Farid
Assalam O Alaikum !!
Going to Mazars with a view that the saint burried there will help us and doing sajda to the mazar, is SHIRK and is gunah-e-kabira which will not be forgiven.
Women cannot go to qabaristan / Mazars, but they can go to masajid. The women u have seen going to Medina in Masjid Nabwee are going to Masjid Nabwi and they are not praying on Roza-e-Mubarak. Eik aur baat, in masjid nabwee also everybody prays with their faces towards kaaba not towards Roza-e-mubarak.
Assalam O Alaikum
Mr. Niaz,
2.Same as above. Women are allowed to go to Rozae Mubarak of Prophet Mohammad and there is no bar to go to graves of their relatives to offer prayers ("Duaa")
I wonder what is the idea behind asking such questions, for which you know the answer according to your perception of religion. If the intention is to impose your set of beliefs on others, you are wasting your time.
Regards
Farid
[This message has been edited by Farid (edited 09-26-98).]
Okay Niaz so you answered your own question....but now explain WHY women can't go to mazar/graves???? I mean is it consider a sin or is it na jaiez?
Please do elaborate.
Assalam O Alaikum !!
Here are some ahadith about graves (mazaars) and last hadith is about women going to graveyard. There is one more hadith about women going to graveyard which rite now i am unable to find.
Volume 1, Book 8, Number 419:
Narrated 'Aisha:
Um Habiba and Um Salama mentioned about a church they had seen in Ethiopia in which there were pictures. They told the Prophet about it, on which he said, "If any religious man dies amongst those people they would build a place of worship at his grave and make these pictures in it. They will be the worst creature in the sight of Allah on the Day of Resurrection."
Volume 2, Book 23, Number 414:
Narrated 'Urwa:
Aisha said, "The Prophet in his fatal illness said, 'Allah cursed the Jews and the Christians because they took the graves of their Prophets as places for praying."' Aisha added, "Had it not been for that the grave of the Prophet (p.b.u.h) would have been made prominent but I am afraid it might be taken (as a) place for praying.
Book 2, Number 0490:
Narrated Ali ibn AbuTalib:
AbuSalih al-Ghifari reported: Ali (once) passed by Babylon during his travels. The mu'adhdhin (the person who calls for prayer) came to him to call for the afternoon prayer. When he passed by that place, he commanded to announce for the prayer. After finishing the prayer he said: My affectionate friend (i.e. the Prophet) prohibited me to say prayer in the graveyard. He also forbade me to offer prayer in Babylon because it is accursed.
Book 20, Number 3117:
Narrated Abdullah ibn Amr ibn al-'As:
We buried a deceased person in the company of the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him). When we had finished, the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) returned and we also returned with him. When he approached his door, he stopped, and we saw a woman coming towards him.
He (the narrator) said: I think he recognized her. When she went away, we came to know that she was Fatimah. The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) said to her: What brought you out of your house, Fatimah? She replied: I came to the people of this house, Apostle of Allah, and I showed pity and expressed my condolences to them for their deceased relation. The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) said: You might have gone to the graveyard with them.
She replied: I seek refuge in Allah! I heard you referring to what you mentioned.
He said: If you had gone to the graveyard...He then mentioned severe words about it.
I then asked Rabi'ah (a narrator of this tradition) about al-kuda (stony land). He replied: I think it means the graves.
Wa ma alaina illal balagh / Assalam O Alaikum.
Assalam O Alaikum
I found 1 ayat by regarding calling the dead ones:
Surah Al-Room (30 : 052)
PICKTHAL: For verily thou (Muhammad) canst not make the dead to hear, nor canst thou make the deaf to hear the call when they have turned to flee.
SHAKIR: For surely you cannot, make the dead to hear and you cannot make the deaf to hear the call, when they turn back and
Jazakumullah Khair / Assalam O Alaikum.
Niaz,
What you have described above the excerpts from Hadith may or may not be authentic. I usually avoid quoting Hadith because of the following reasons:-
2.Different sects have different set of Hadith to practice and many of them negate one an other. People practicing these consider to be authentic and declaring others as false. You will never know who is correct and who is wrong.
When ever I find such kind of questions, I usually seek answer in Holy Quraan. If I find the answer, I take it as authentic.
I do not seek the answers in Hadith or other books because of their authenticity and written by some one with biased thinking. I am thankful to Allah that he has given me the faculty of judging right from wrong. When I can understand most difficult worldly knowledge for earning of my livelihood then why I can not understand the basic principles of Islam and try to practice them as much as possible. For me basics are more important then going or not going to graves, or eating halal or no halal meat or some other trivial matter..
Now I quote Hadith which show that going to graves by men and women were allowed by Prophet Mohammad PBUH.
A. Abu Huraira said that the Prophet visited his mother’s grave and wept and caused those around him to weep. He then said, "I asked my Lord’s permission to pray for forgiveness for her, but I was not allowed.; I then asked His permission to visit her grave and I was allowed.; so visit graves, for they make one mindful of death." Muslim transmitted it.
B. Buraida said that God’s messenger used to teach them to say when they went out to the cemeteries, "Peace be upon you, inhabitants of the dwellings (Aslam-o- Alaikum Ya Ahalal-Kaboor) who are of the number of the believers and the Muslims. If God, will, we shall join you. We ask God to grant us and you well being." Muslim transmitted it.
C. Aisha said that whenever it was her turn for God’s messenger to spend the night with him, he would go out towards the end of the night to al-Baqi and say, "Peace be upon you, household of a people who are believers. What you were being promised will come to you tomorrow, you receiving it after some delay, and if God will we shall join you. O God, grant forgiveness to the inhabitants of "Baqi Al-Gharqad," (This is the full name of the cemetry at Madina) Muslim transmitted it.
D. She (Bibi Aisha) said she asked God’s messenger what she should say, i. e. when visiting graves, and he told her to say, "Peace be upon the inhabitants of the abodes, believers and Muslims, and God show mercy to those of us who go before and those who go later. If God will we shall join you," Muslim transmitted it.
E. Muhamma b, an-Nu’man who traced the tradition back to the Prophet reported his as saying, "If any one visits the grave of his parents or one of them, every Friday he will be granted forgiveness and it will be recorded as filial piety". Baihaqi transmitted it in "mursal form in Shu’ab al-iman.
(Excerpts taken from Mishkat Al-Masabih English Translation with Explanatory Notes by James Robson)
If you read these Hadith carefully you would see word believers along with Muslims. Believers perhaps here mean people of book.
Now tell me after reading these Hadith why one should follow your set of Hadith. To me it is also a matter of common sense. It is human nature that when ever some one loses dear and near ones, tears should come out as natural instinct. Going to graves whether men or women for offering prayers (Duaa) is not forbidden. As I already advised you not to impose your set of beliefs, it is not going to work because you will always come in contact with the ideas 180 degrees out to your set of beliefs by quoting references from some good books on Hadith and Suna.
Your reference to verse 52 to of Sura Rum or The Roman Empire on the above subject matter is totally unrelated. Please remember all these Sura were revealed on certain occasions some of which have general applications and some of which were only applicable to particular incidents happened at that time. Let me quote the full translation (yours is incomplete) of verses before and after it to understand the proper meaning of verse 52.
Verse 51 "And if we (but) send a wind from which they see their tilth, turn yellow, behold they become, thereafter ungrateful (Unbelievers)"
Verse52 "So varily thou canst not make the dead to hear nor canst thou make the deaf to hear, the call when they show their backs and turn away.
Verse 53 "Nor canst thou lead back the blind from their straying; Only those wilt make to hear, who believe in our signs and submit their wills in Islam".
Now you can see these verses are for Un-believers and not for literally dead people. Please do not quote unless you fully understand the back ground of these verses. It tantamount to misguiding the people.
Dear Niaz, it is my advise that you better read Holy Quraan with translation and explanation by some good and un biased author. I always recommend to people to read The Holy Quraan, Text, Translation and Commentary by Abduallah Yousaf Ali. An excellent book for learners as well for scholars. I consider my self as learner in this field and do not impose my imperfect knowledge on others. I think you have heard of "Nim Hakim Khara-e-Jaan, Nim Mullah Khatra-e-Iman".
I want to answer you what you have written about Christian and Jews. . But this post has become very long, usually I avoid large postings. Therefore I would rather prefer to answer at another time.
REGARDS
FARID