We all know that there is Kashmir problem lingering since 1947. Pakistan had un-successful attempts to release Kashmir from Indian occupation. Bollywood had made few movies on the subject projecting their point of view and some of them were successful at box office. But above movie based on the same dispute show that how much Indians hate all Pakistanis. Perhaps this offense is as result of the demise of ‘Jehadis’ after 9/11 incident. It seemed that the operation against ‘Jehadis’ by Musharraf has gone too far.
Using foul language for Pakistanis is the norm in Indian Movies. But this movie has surpassed all the bounds of decency. I was shocked to listen to dialogs such as “if we all Indians pee on border, all Pakistanis would be flooded with Indians’ pee”. A group of so called Muslim Jehadis were shown watching naked Indian whores.
I think the director who made this movie had eaten lots of ‘channa dal’ and drank lots of booze. The gas resulted from these ingredients; instead of passing his ‘holy hole’ went direct to his brain to imbalance his thinking power, produced a piece of Indian garbage.
I happen to agree with the above statement about BOllywood movies.
However in return for my sincere acceptence of the truth will you be equally sincere and accept that a major follwing for Bollywood movies is Pakistan ?
As I always say ‘To each his/her Taste’. If I ndian Garbage is what you seem to thrive on, don’t complain when the flavor of the garbage changes a bit from time to time!!
Lets admit that jihadis type elements r on both sides of the border. If a pakistani thinks that God has made 11 hindus equal to one muslim, then I am quite sure other Bhagwan's revelations r also there in India. After all ethnically both r same, and both ppl have been brainwashed about the history and religions.
I was talking to a hindu indian some years ago, and he was boasting that hinduism is a way of life, rather than religion. Being an open atheist, I do not take any BS about the 'goodness' of any religion. So I started arguing with him on that. It turns out that I was talking to hindu version of a religous fanatic. The same sort of arguments that I used to have with tableghi or jamaati in karachi, i was having the same with that idiot. Only the terminologies with different.
The only difference is that for the major part of Indian state's existence, govt did not sponsor these religous elements in the society. Even BJP govt is shying away from religous fanatics in its govt. Pakistan's case was different on two accounts:
Pakistan was based on a religous theory (2 nations)
Zia used religion to intervene in Afghanistan on USA insistance
That is one reason, the brainwashing is done more in pakistan than in india.
On the Pakistani side, I think it became more of a problem becuase the state encouraged it.
On this one, you can’t blame Indians really. It is Zia’s legacy.
damn, pakistanis seem to watch indian movies some 6 months before i do.
after 'gadar' (which i have not seen) became a super-duper hit, there is expected to be flood of patriotic movies. afterall, we had a decade dealing with separated brothers after 'diwar' was a hit.
so it will go on. if these movies flop and some other formula, say 'surrogate mother' or 'unwed father/mother' becomes hit, we may have to endure those movies for a while.
afterall, people make money on borrowed money and they want to do business. most of them will lack ideas also. if they feel some theme is attracting people, likely to repeat it.
why these anti-pak themes worked in recent yrs? i believe it is legacy of kargil. 'sarfarosh', which was also well made, released at same time by coincidence and trend continued.
---> Islamization of Hinduism?? Please explain this Andhra. You're saying it as if its a bad thing.
I do agree with you on the Talibanization of Islam. Even though the majority of muslims dont follow this perversion (which theoretically is NOT Islam).
Pyarichudia, I wonder if this is the place for it. By 'Islamization' of HInduism I mean the growing assertion of 'Hindu' identity as opposed to a 'Secular' identity cultivated in the early post-independence years.
If you observe Muslims generally go for that. They maintain their traditions, way of life assertively.
Hindus are becoming the same.
Ayodhya affair is just a bad example of this.
What do you mean, it is 'bad'?
I don't know if it is bad or good. Too early to tell.
andhra, i disagree. nothing to do with 'hindu' identity. those who shout against 'hindutwa' or shed a truckload of tears over ayodhya will have no problem watching 'maa tujhe salaam'.
i think kargil was a turning point in indian psyche. not that pakistan was loved by indians before. but any person who sincerely believed that it is possible to bridge gap between two nations started believing that pakistanis can not be anything but enemies of india and indians. whether this perception was wrong or right is a different matter. but fact is that wagha candle lighting, nostalgic punjabi refugees stopped getting any emotional response from common man any longer, rather this peace brigade was laughed at as being stupid.
they are realistic too. it could have been possible that half our lawmakers were killed three months ago. it is a clear, present, alive danger. why filmmakers will not make films on it? and hence response to these movies.
[quote]
Originally posted by FreeMind:
** After all ethnically both r same, and both ppl have been brainwashed about the history and religions.
**
[/quote]
what ethnicity are you talking about?...the mere fact that ppl of both fact have been living in close proximity doesnt mean that their basic religious values will ever change..it seems to me that being an atheist you cannot comprehend or even try to comprehend the point of view of any one side...and as far as Kashmir goes..lets give the Kashmiris the space to be free to do whatever they think best with their country....
The only difference is that for the major part of Indian state's existence, govt did not sponsor these religous elements in the society. Even BJP govt is shying away from religous fanatics in its by turning away and not looking at destruction of mosques, burning of priests...the indian govt hasnt risen to a higher state than the one u mention of Zia ul haq .
Farid..stop being so naive...what do you think they were going to make a movie about? ZZ has a point...the movie maker has to make money..and the easiest way to get to ppl is to touch their dukhti rag!
If truth is knowledge, knowledge is power, and power corrupts, then are
all the liars in the world really the good guys?...*
Oh Kargil was a turning point as far as Pakistan is concerned. Nationally the Govt. came toknow people are fed up with Pakistan.
Internationally Pakis stand isolated, getting lectures from Uncle Sam.
I mwas talking about the growing assertion of Hindu identity.
I think it is significant. Essentially this ideology wants to proove India is secular becuase it is Hindu, whereas in Nehruvian World VIew, a 'composite' identity is stressed upon more.
Unfotunately for the 'composite' identity wallahs Shah-Bano, Rushdie type affairs and the rise of Taliban type ideologies is weakening their case.
As for me, I believe India was and is secular becuase it is Hindu.
Not because of any intrinsic merits of Hinduism, but a trait in HInduism that effectively separates the state from the religion.
andhra, i feel this 'hindu' thing is irrelevent. pakistanis like to put everything anti-pak as anti-muslim since for them they are citadel of islam and u r falling in same trap. it is far from true. why 'hey ram' flopped. it tried to dissect the actions of a person attempting to murder gandhi so much that it looked as if his actions are being justified. if there was a 'hindu' thing, 'hey ram' should have clicked. it didnt.
Well ZZ I was not talking about Pakistan at all. Kargil seemed to demonstrate how Indians feel about Pakistani doings well enough.
I am talking about the change in HIndu attitudes.
Consider, in the last 200 years HIndus as a community broadened their horizons, went through partition, are more aware of their heritage, seeing the affairs of other faiths etc.,
The last bit is significant. I think even after partition Hindus as a communtiy went back to business as usual. The information age is making them know, Religion is a big deal!!
All this is bound to have an effect.
We were Watching ‘Yeh Dil Ashiqana’ and the hero said the same thing but it went like…
“Agar har ek hindustani ek ek Lota pani ka bharay or border pe giray, to phir tumhare desh mein sailaab ajayga!”
(If each Indian was to fill a lota full of water and pout it on the border, then your country shall be flooded!)
A few of us were watching the movie and we laughed till our sides hurt. Till date we still make fun of the crappy movie and its dialogs like “Chaye chuuntiyaan kitni ho, Gane ko nahi ugare sak te” (no matter how many the ants, they wont be able to dig up a sugar cane)
By the way, if you want to watch good commercial Indian Movies, go for SOuth Indian ones. Like Main Ratnam. THey are good.
To let you in on a secret, Bollywood movies are regarded as silly in cultured Indian circles. Meant for Indian villagers, especially the ones up North. THe kind who believe Bad Women wear skirts and have christian names(Hence Ajit JOkes)
would you belive me if I told you we were watching the movie in my home Village? Sehwan Sharif to be exact and were basically watching the movie to get a good laugh at the issue of ‘hijacking’
Sure I believe you. Tell me one thing though. This Pakistan bashing movies are a relatively recent Bollywood phenomenon.
Before that it was all potboilers and tear jerkers.
They were lapped up by Paks even then!!
How do you explain that?
I think Indian movies are seen by majority of Indians with exception of few including you. These movies are mostly commercial and based on past experience at box office. Movies on Paki bashing topped at box office e.g. Gadar, where a Sikh guy from East Punjab kick the butts of Pakis from West Punjab.
The approval of such hate themes by majority Indians encourage retard directors of Indian movies like this one to make such garbage and use profanity against people of neighboring country without realizing that a number of Hindus and other communities also live in Pakistan.
Allowing such garbage based on profanity and hatred by so-called civilized democratic Indians is surprising.
Farid,
>>Allowing such garbage based on profanity and hatred by so-called civilized democratic Indians is surprising.<<
Unfortunately there is a relative Freedom Of Expression in India.
I agree, it is nowhere near the levels of the West, but it does exist.
So the Governemnt no doubt keeps quiet about it for the same reason it kept quiet about Rushdie Affair and banned Satanic Verses
That is very good question indeed. I think the only decent director in indian film industry is mani ratnam and of course shankar he is quite good has a very inovative aproach to film making, and in olden days it was mehboob.
I think what it is sadly in us the pakistaniz watching an indian film is concedered a safe and harmless way of entertaining ourself, which I think is very wrong way of thinking it actually weakens our mentality and corrupts our believes.
2yrs back I promised myself that I will never ever spend my money on indian films and music and I think so far I 've been very successfull in cutting down on consumpsion of bull crap which we unknowningly take in.
I only watched aprox. 4 or less movies in past two yrs. and so far in my life I only bought three indian bhangra casset (no cd yet)
. and when it comes to movie soundtracks I only listion to selected composers like a r rahman and vishal, rest r just bunch of copy cats.
rather go and watch some american flick.
bhaRhe chalo ke tajasus kaa naam iimaa’N hai
[This message has been edited by MAREEZ_E_ISHQ (edited February 27, 2002).]