talking to one of the VPs who is a philosopher of sorts.
so this is the situation in UK..
the retirement age thing is being booted out, on one hand it allows people to work longer because they are healthier at that age and life expectancy is longer, secondly, state resources to fund pensioners re stretched and look dodgy, so people may have to work longer to have resources when they are unable t work
in US defined benefits pensions are gone, not that they had been around for ever, more of a post worldwar 2 thing, unions negotiated pensions for ppl to retire so new ppl can have jobs and the new ppl funded pensions, now, the baby boomers are retiring, gen X and gen Y are lower in numbers and cant fund social security at the same ratio.
meanwhile employers killed pensions and had people go to defined contribution or 401K type retirement accounts, to which most people are not saving enough, those who are saving while benefiting from compunding are not making great returns and are barely keeping up with inflation.
lastly..life expectancy is on the rise, so many people are concerned that their savings will run out. and the advances in healthcare mean that things that would have killed someone 30 years ago are now survivable, but then the question is about quality of life if you are very old and frail and physically very dependant, but living on because modern medicine can keep you alive..
so what will happen to all these people when they retire?
I predict joint family system back in vogue within next few decades, it will become a practical reality for many people. even now many college grads or young families are living with parents due to economic situation.
The system is a victim of its own success, state retirement was created by Bismarck and was for a time when only a fraction of the people would survive to the age of 60-65.
The biggest problem is modern technology can make us survive longer NOT live. Life and wellbeing is different from health and we (in developed countries) broadly live in denial of death.
The economic system that presently exists is relatively more sustainable in the US because of a younger population and positive population growth rate by contrast Europe and Japan are largely facing negative population growth rates.
Ideally yes joint family system would make sense, but in many countries the state has been such a strong presence that you wonder if people know how to exist in a family anymore?
good point zakk, it may be easier said than done but I would rather have a shorter healthier life than a longer one where I am very frail and cant be independent. I suppose when one is old hand has family and grandkids and great grandkids etc that thinking may change.
as far as the family system what people dont realize is that in many places even in US life was very different just half a century ago and outside of cities larger family living was pretty common, just like ppl evolved to the nuclear family concept they can move to a different concept again.
the question is of sustainability of current system and how long would it last..remember at one time pensions were part and parcel of everything, now they are gone.
as far as the family system what people dont realize is that in many places even in US life was very different just half a century ago and outside of cities larger family living was pretty common, just like ppl evolved to the nuclear family concept they can move to a different concept again.
the question is of sustainability of current system and how long would it last..remember at one time pensions were part and parcel of everything, now they are gone.
true, a generation doesn't seem long in the grand scheme of things but having long term vision is not somehing everyone does.
There is also a very large pool of people who are so far disconnected they don't have any support networks anymore (some might never have had kids and were from small families in any case so there is nowhere for them to turn).
The paradox is that developed countries prize themselves on placing individualism and autonomy above all else, going the other way around and telling people you can't do this or that because there is no money in the pot is going to be hard.
We all know instinctively that actions have consequences but when a whole generation has led a life of plenty that realisation could lead to a lot of social unrest before it is accepted.
Also besides the tax burden of sustaining the elderly, we also have to remember the mountains of debt that need to be repaid.
In global terms what we are seeing is the gradual decline of the old order and old powers. How things re-align in another generation is anyones guess..
true, a generation doesn't seem long in the grand scheme of things but having long term vision is not somehing everyone does.
There is also a very large pool of people who are so far disconnected they don't have any support networks anymore (some might never have had kids and were from small families in any case so there is nowhere for them to turn).
The paradox is that developed countries prize themselves on placing individualism and autonomy above all else, going the other way around and telling people you can't do this or that because there is no money in the pot is going to be hard.
We all know instinctively that actions have consequences but when a whole generation has led a life of plenty that realisation could lead to a lot of social unrest before it is accepted.
..
People would be forced to do it wouldnt they?
one way or the other attitudes and lifestyles would need to adapt
Unrest i can guarantee, there is already misgivings in younger generations about greed of baby boomers in US and the state pensioners in UK.
I can see some of this playing out in political arena with one generation trying to reduce the pressure on it, while the other trying to maintain save as much of the benefits that they can.
People would be forced to do it wouldnt they?
one way or the other attitudes and lifestyles would need to adapt
Unrest i can guarantee, there is already misgivings in younger generations about greed of baby boomers in US and the state pensioners in UK.
I can see some of this playing out in political arena with one generation trying to reduce the pressure on it, while the other trying to maintain save as much of the benefits that they can.
Yup countries will struggle with the clash between generations..and not all will succeed in coming to a solution. Japan and Italy are experiencing negative birth rates but the inertia is so strong that no reform process has worked.
One analysis made the harsh comment that Europe may end up the worlds largest retirement home if things continue as they are
The interesting read on this is that with low birth rates these countries will depend on immigrants, so aside from the generational differences there will be racial/ethnic/religious as well, some of it we already see playing out.
The interesting read on this is that with low birth rates these countries will depend on immigrants, so aside from the generational differences there will be racial/ethnic/religious as well, some of it we already see playing out.
yes but what tends to be quite popular during times of recession? immigrant bashing..also migration patterns may change as global growth is being driven by the east more now