A Cleft Country?

Pakistan, by most accounts is a country divided on various ethno-lingual lines, is a diverse country not only in it’s people but also their visions for the future. Whilst our neighbor to the east has sucessfully overridden these divisions of humanity, throught economic progress, we still stand mired in a syndrome of denial.

Our economic progress is has been limited by the deterioration of the law and order throughout the country. What is more troubling is the rise of Islamic fundamentalism, where the fanatics on the street have seized the opportunity to commit extreme hateful acts of violence and transgressions under the cover of Islam. But whose Islam is it? For these fundamentalists, it certainly does not include the Shias, Ahmadis, or accordingly to some, Hanafis. Lets not even begin to talk to about Christians and Hindus of Pakistan.

I see this rise in radicalism a dangerous phenomenon, more so than the delusions of a Pakhtun separatist or a Punjabi nationalist, because these radicals are using the most precious element of our statehood – Islam to manipulate the general public. Who can stand against the Mullah declaring a jihad on Christians on the grounds of the US invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan? Who can doubt their Fatwas against Hindu holidays such as Basant? The truth is that YES the US invaded Iraq, Afghanistan, however do we want to be next? according to the radicals inviting trouble, it is half the fun. While Basant may have been a non Islamic holiday, it has been converted into a Jashn-e-Bahara which commemorates spring. How much do we have to give up?

I do not fault the extremists who are Muslims, because they are responding to extremists who are Christians, Jewish etc., however it is their Taliban/SA inspired visions of Pakistan’s future that I disagree with. Who can doubt the decadence of the KSA Royals or the excesses of its populations? While S. Arabia lives off it’s oil reserves, the Talibs, albiet Pious Muslims, led Afghanistan (along with NA and others) to economic disaster. Were the pious Taliban fully able to eradicate homosexuality in Afghanistan? Or the Wahabi inspired Kings of SA able to control themselves on trips to the west?

Ironically, I almost fully agree with what many of the Muslim radicals have been preaching, however I also see that they are detached from reality. Pakistan, a muslim majority state, will always have sinners, the corrupt and Muslims in name only, how many of them can we correct?

Until these ignitors of hate are silenced, either through political dialogue or unfortunately through the barrel of the gun, Pakistan will always remain mired in the uncertainity of its path towards power and progress.

I agree for the most part with you RF, but if you ask me I think the average Pakistani is a lot smarter then we give him credit for ...if one believes something is wrong, it is wrong ALL the time. If Musharraf for example had taken a stand earlier against "created groups" like the Lashkar etc on he would have been considered someone standing on principles, now he is perceived as Bush's chamcha.

I think that's Pakistan's real problem, everything is selective, yesterdays heroes are todays traitors. Accountability is only for those who don't support you and so on. Justice is always restricted for the people in power while those in opposition don't deserve any.

The average person can see past that double standard.
The government has a credibility problem, one day the MMA and it's lot are extremists promotiong sectarianism and the next day they make deals with them. One day AQ Khan is a hero, the next day he has proliferated on his own and apparently imported Missles for his own personal use (i am guessing they are decoration pieces in his house garden).

This hypocrisy extends everywhere, one can subvert the constitution and not be called traitors. One can kill one's own people and be told it is in the National interest, one can hold "free and fair" elections but ensure only the results are one wants. One can create militants and then abandon them..

Extremism is the problem now but the underlying problem is a culture of coverups, false promises and backstabbing.

Re: A Cleft Country?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by RajputFury: *

**Ironically, I almost fully agree with what many of the Muslim radicals have been preaching, however I also see that they are detached from reality. Pakistan, a muslim majority state, will always have sinners, the corrupt and Muslims in name only, how many of them can we correct?

Until these ignitors of hate are silenced, either through political dialogue or unfortunately through the barrel of the gun, Pakistan will always remain mired in the uncertainity of its path towards power and progress.**
[/QUOTE]

Exactly.

From his very first national address as Chief Executive, General Musharraf had stated quite clearly that Pakistan must deal with extremism and ethnic discord, and that was one of his main priorities. After that he banned extremist parties, curbed the funding of others, announced moves to reform madrassa's etc for which he was declared a secularlist, "munafiq", and western stooge amongst other names, but he has stuck by his mission to rid Pakistan of extremists, and build a moderate Islamic nation. That was all before 9/11 of course. But he has continued that with more zeal since, for which of course he has been called worse names.

General Musharraf stated in October 1999, that it was in Pakistan interests to rid itself of extremism, and has remained entirely consistent in this regard to this day. For that he will have the support of the silent, but vast majority of Pakistani people, because they have been waiting for so long for a leader who would finally take a stand against those people whom they have dared not, as you stated, challenge in repsect to religious declarations.

Re: Re: A Cleft Country?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Malik73: *

Exactly.

From his very first national address as Chief Executive, General Musharraf had stated quite clearly that Pakistan must deal with extremism and ethnic discord, and that was one of his main priorities. After that he banned extremist parties, curbed the funding of others, announced moves to reform madrassa's etc for which he was declared a secularlist, "munafiq", and western stooge amongst other names, but he has stuck by his mission to rid Pakistan of extremists, and build a moderate Islamic nation. That was all before 9/11 of course. But he has continued that with more zeal since, for which of course he has been called worse names.

General Musharraf stated in October 1999, that it was in Pakistan interests to rid itself of extremism, and has remained entirely consistent in this regard to this day. For that he will have the support of the silent, but vast majority of Pakistani people, because they have been waiting for so long for a leader who would finally take a stand against those people whom they have dared not, as you stated, challenge in repsect to religious declarations.
[/QUOTE]

Gen.Musharraf has done more to encourage the extremists while talking tough.

  1. Who has allowed "banned" groups to operate openly by just changing names?

  2. Who has not prosecuted even ONE banned extremist leader?

  3. Who allowed Maulana Azam Tariq to contest elections despite having 20 murder cases against him?

  4. Who banned PML-N and PPP politicians from contesting elections on flimsy reasons like "no graduate degree" while allowing MMA idiots to run with madrassa degrees?

  5. Who has allowed MQM thugs to take over Karachi and Hyderabad and allowed a murderer like Ishratul Ibad to become Governor of Sindh?

  6. Who has made a deal with the MMA to keep his kursi and uniform?

Musharraf is all talk and no walk when it comes to tackling extremism.

Re: Re: A Cleft Country?

I agree, Musharraf has taken the right step dispite all odds… I would like to quote his vision along with Quaids…

Musharraf’s vision..
http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL9910/S00082.htm
And now a few words on exploitation of religion. Islam teaches tolerance not hatred, universal brotherhood and not enmity, peace and not violence, progress and not bigotry. I have great respect for the Ulema and expect them to come forth and present Islam in its true light. I urge them to curb elements which are exploiting religion for vested interests and bringing a bad name to our faith.
I would like to reassure our minorities that they enjoy full rights and protection as equal citizens in the letter and spirit of true Islam.

Quaids first speech (I don’t need to provide a URL for this)
You are free, you are free to go to your temples, you are free to go to your mosques or to any other place of worship in this state of Pakistan. You may belong to any religion or caste or creed that has nothing to do with the fundamental principle that we are all citizens and equal citizens of the State."

Re: Re: Re: A Cleft Country?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Abdali: *

And now a few words on exploitation of religion. Islam teaches tolerance not hatred, universal brotherhood and not enmity, peace and not violence, progress and not bigotry. I have great respect for the Ulema and expect them to come forth and present Islam in its true light. I urge them to curb elements which are exploiting religion for vested interests and bringing a bad name to our faith. I would like to reassure our minorities that they enjoy full rights and protection as equal citizens in the letter and spirit of true Islam.

[/QUOTE]

Yes, that's what I was referring to. From day one he has taken a lead in tackling extremists and terrorists (the FATA operation being the latest example of that), and the people are hugely supportive of these policies. As I said previously, the silent but vast majority of Pakistani people have been waiting for such a long time for someone to take the lead in standing upto extremist mullahs, whom they were fearful of questioning.

Ignorance is bliss :hehe:

not as much as using two nics ;)

Lo jee aa giyay moderator sahib :hehe:

BTW, speaking from experience Ahmad Shah? :wink: