I still need someone out there to make a coherent case backed up with real evidence of how this is a war for oil.
How much oil would 75-100 billion dollars buy?
Why didn’t we take the oil in '91?
Has the U.S. historically bought oil form the region or filled up tankers at night when no one was around and slipped away?
I don’t know the answers here, I’m askin’ the questions.
this was always the assertion. I just don't understand the idiocy behind the logic that this war is about oil. I know I am going to hear now about all the oil revenues int eh next twenty years that US is going to earn.
Before some child delves into that, give me a definition of present value of money and we can begin the discussion in earnest.
The 75 Billion may barely cover the war. The real figure after rebuilding phase could be much, much more.
Absolutely, some estimates out the rebuilding of he infrastructure for oil production, refinement and distribution at another $20 billion Let's hope Saddam doesn't sabotage the livelihood of his own people. But then again, he has killed so many of his what's a few more.
Contracts for re-building Iraq will go mostly to American firms I believe. That will be quite a boost to the US economy in itself I would have thought.
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*Originally posted by storch: *
The 75 Billion may barely cover the war.
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Thats why it is the first installment... :)
more than what Iraq has to offer?
and its not coming outa your pockets .. they [iraq] will pay through their noses ... if they cant pay, be the slaves!! ... war is an investment .. :-) ... or a strategy to keep others from developing into a threat ...
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*Originally posted by Wada Saien: *
or a strategy to keep others from developing into a threat ...
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threat to children(s) i.e. Israel.
I'm still waiting for the reasoned economic and political analysis that makes the case for an oil grab. I'm no expert, I only have strong inklings. So experts, enlighten me and convince me that this is a war for Iraq's oil.
That is because economic benefits of this war will only be gained by the Iraqis post liberation.
Storch,
And while you are at it, ask why we did not seize Kuwaiti oil in 1991, and how that "pipeline in Afghanistan is coming.
Memories are very selective.
Where was the oil in Kosovo/Bosnia ?
I live in Newport RI. There is a small group here that are the sons and daughters of the very wealthy. We refer to them as TFB's, or "trust fund babies". Inevitably they are drunks, partiers, and pretty worthless. They never succeed on their own, they live off the trust fund and make little or no contribution to society.
It strikes me that Saddam is the ultimate "trust fund baby". He has created nothing. He has made nothing. He simply was ruthless enough to seize the black gold under his land. He has done nothing to improve the lot of his people. For nearly three decades he has led his people into conflict after conflict, convinced that he will be some megalomaniacal Arab King of historic significance. The oil wealth has gone to his head, and inflated his sense of self importance. Now he is convinced that someone is there to steal his trust fund.
And let's face it, "No war for Oil" is simple and easy to understand. that makes it easy for even the casual protestor to mimic. The actual economics would require some actual analytic thinking, and so far no one has been able to explain the supposed financial motivation to this war.
OG, what do you have against people who go to Brown? I suggest you have a big bowl of Chowduh at the Black Pearl and give my oil back. BTW/ Loved Marble House. That Alba was some lady.
We are readying a nice place on Ocean Drive for Saddam's exile. He would fit right in.......
why don't you guys read the other threads where "contracts" are listed? is that "insignificant"?
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*Originally posted by Ohioguy: *
We are readying a nice place on Ocean Drive for Saddam's exile. He would fit right in.......
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may be rightly so. i will wait until Sharon and other Israeli leaders are driven to the same place, but something assures me that its never going to happen, perhaps it has something to do with America/Israel being in bed together
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ohioguy: *
Storch,
And while you are at it, ask why we did not seize Kuwaiti oil in 1991, and how that "pipeline in Afghanistan is coming.
Memories are very selective.
.....
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If you can get something without aggression, with utmost control then you don't need to. But with some hard/thick headed/criminal Saddam Hussein incharge of Iraqi oil it wouldn't be so easy. "Pipeline" stuff is I think going fairly easy, a few months back Karzai and Jamali signed some agreements regarding that pipeline. I know you want to see "pictures" of that pipeline, but I don't think you will get to see.
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*Originally posted by Changez_like: *
why don't you guys read the other threads where "contracts" are listed? is that "insignificant"?
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From that thread:
Government agencies are asking the private sector - mostly large oilfield service and engineering-construction firms - to join the effort.
The U.S. Agency for International Development, or USAID, in late February reportedly sent requests for proposal to several infrastructure-engineering firms. The contracts are worth an estimated $900 million.
•••That doesn't look like a great return on $75-100 Billion. The 900 wouldn't even be profit.
The work includes rebuilding roads, bridges, oil fields, municipal water supplies, irrigation systems, schools, government buildings and other facilities.
•••Will we be shipping these items back to the U.S. for our own personal use?
Those invited to join the rebuilding party are familiar names in the engineering, construction and energy services industries.
Deutsche Bank estimates oil field service firms will easily see $1 billion to $1.5 billion in the "stabilization phase" after the war ends.
Still, not everyone is betting the house on the war's impact.
"I don't think it's going to make or break our industry," Washington Group's Hermann said.
•••sounds like everyone's really salivating to get in there
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*Originally posted by storch: *
....
•••That doesn't look like a great return on $75-100 Billion. The 900 wouldn't even be profit.
The work includes rebuilding roads, bridges, oil fields, municipal water supplies, irrigation systems, schools, government buildings and other facilities.
.....
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$900 million is only for the "reconstruction" phase. What about the free flow of oil? Who will be "controlling" the oil flow? "price"? "profit sharing" ?
1000 million make a billion. Outlay of 100 billion in today's dollar terms using the compunded interest 10%/7 yrs or 7% 10 yrs logic would mean that it would take 7-10 years to recoup the "investment" This does not even discount the inflation plus fluctuation in currencies.