- It's good you are no longer using the 'muslim' card, and accepting that the '2 nation' theory was shallow. That culture, history plays a major part in how people percieve themselves.
The Muslim card only existed in your mind.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. You Indian have been more successful in turning this into a Hindu-Muslim issue than Lashkar-e-Tayyiba and Hizbul Mujahideen ever were.
How then would you justify the holding of 'azad kashmir' & 'northern territories' by pakistan??
- Does that not bother you as a 'Kashmiri', that part of Kashmiris are illegally occupied by Pakistan (the only basis being that they are muslim)..
- Or is your view that "Aj liya hai thora sa Kashmir, phir lenga hum sara Kashmir'.
- Does that not bother you as a 'Kashmiri', that part of Kashmiris are illegally occupied by Pakistan (the only basis being that they are muslim)..
For the last time, those are not parts of "Kashmir" and the people there are not "Kashmiris."
- I have pointed out repeatedly that those people's ancestors rebelled in favor of Pakistan before the Pathan invasion, and actually joined forces with the Pathans.
- This idea that the people of Azad Jammu Kashmir are being held in Pakistan against their will exists only the minds of communally-minded Indians. The people from Azad Kashmir that I've met have been some of the most jingoistic Pakistanis I've ever seen...every other family in AJK sends its children into the Pakistani army.
- I have said repeatedly that there's no reason to compel people who are happy with the status quo into joining any independent Kashmiri state...if the Jammuites want to stay in India, and the people of AJK in Pakistan, then so be it.
- Independence is being yearned by Baloch people - would you support them in their quest for independence - afterall culturally they are different than Punjabis? What about the Sindhi's.
Balochistan and Sind weren't illegally occupied by Pakistan, nor do you have a shred of evidence to suggest that the majority of the population there wants independence.
- You have previously mentioned that the Hindu pundits' are purposely being kept as refugees - to gain sympathy by the Indian government. Is that why there were millions of Afgans kept in Pakistan - to gain sympathy. Here you failed your Kashmiri brethern.
Your analogies are ridiculous.
Pakistan played no role in the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. India illegally occupied Kashmir.
Pakistan played no role in encouraging the Afghans to flee their homes. Governor Jagmohan did.
Pakistan did the best it could to accommodate 5 million penniless refugees. India dumped the 50-60,000 Pandits who couldn't arrange for shelter on their own in tent cities in Jammu.
- By starting this thread of illegally detained people - you have tried to imply that this has resulted in fueling this movement. Nowhere have you strongly condemned the Jihadi's messing up and hijacking the kashmiri movement.
I have condemned it...you just have a selective memory.
The ethnic cleansing, talibanising and making this a muslim movement has isolated the Kashmiri hindus, who now demand Punam Kashmir for themselves. You Kashmiri muslim have watched from the sidelines while these Jihadi barbarians destroyed the social fabric of Kashmir - and yet said nothing?? Why.
- 5. You talk of ethnic cleansing. Why, despite all the whining in India about Muslims having a higher birthrate than Hindus, is Jammu & Kashmir's Muslim population share decreasing? Why, according to your own government's figures, are the death tolls so skewed...over 19 years, your government claims that the war has claimed the lives of 209 Pandits...and 43,000 Kashmiri Muslims.
- There has been no 'Talibanization' of Kashmir. It's still probably one of the most culturally liberal Muslim states in the world.
- All this condemnation for the "Muslim" nature of the secular Kashmiri nationalist movement...and yet, when the Pandits call for a Hindu, openly fascist, anti-Muslim state (comprising of 60% of Kashmir's land, for just 4% of the population), we don't hear a word from you. Nothing but hypocrisy.
- Jagmohan was as much responsible for the exodus of the Pandits as any Jihadi group was. As for "not saying a word" every leader in the Hurriyat has been calling for the return of the Pandits to Kashmir.
I don't even expect you to condemn the deaths of Muslim Kashmiris at the hands of your army anymore. It's become clear to me that crimes committed against Muslims don't matter to you at all...
- You have played the muslim victim card, trying to inflame passions - Babri musjid + 300 other muslim religious places destroyed, Pigs touching a student in Prison, etc etc. Make up your mind - are you a Muslim first and then Kashmiri, or the other way around.
I only bring up Babri Masjid + the hundreds of other destroyed mosques when Indians try to make ridiculous arguments about how nothing has been done to Muslims in India, and try to perpetuate this absurd notion of India as some secular utopia.
As for Kashmir men being raped in prison and kept with pigs...let me see if I understand your twisted logic. It's OK for Indian guards to torture Muslim prisoners, including tactics that are clearly designed to do nothing but insult their religious beliefs...but if people talk about these things, they're "playing the Muslim card." If that's how communally minded Indian guards mentally and physically torture Muslim prisoners, then I will talk about it. I'm not going to live in denial to protect your country's image.
To be honest, when I posted the article, all I wanted to convey was the level of inhuman torture Kashmiri prisoners are subject to in Indian jails...even when the evidence against them is flimsy/nonexistent. I was really more horrified by the fact that he was raped by the guards than anything with the pigs.
But, like clockwork, you Indians manage to find a way to put a "Muslim" spin on the issue.
- Just as the new generation has changed over time from pro Pakistan to pro independence - the final stage will come when they will be pro-India. Time is the best healer. (Think of USA and their civil war & what they are today - United & strong)
I've already pointed out why your US Civil War analogy is absurd.
The older generation of Kashmiris, who started this uprising in '89 had only witnessed political repression. This new generation of Kashmiris has grown up surrounded by a level of Indian military brutality and oppression that their parents and grandparents had never imagined in their worst nightmares.
The children who grew up watching their homes and villages being destroyed by security forces....their mothers and sisters being raped and molested by Indian soldiers...their fathers being illegally detained and "disappearing" in custody...unarmed protesters being butchered by paramilitary forces...as well as the daily indignities of just being Kashmiri (being slapped around by Indian soldiers, not being able to get passports, etc)...if anything, they have an even worse perception of Indian rule than previous generations did.